DIR Return Create A Forum - Home
---------------------------------------------------------
Zerg Hex Forum
HTML https://zerghex.createaforum.com
---------------------------------------------------------
*****************************************************
DIR Return to: Balance Discussion
*****************************************************
#Post#: 425--------------------------------------------------
Balance Take 1 – Firebat, Roach, Bunker, Beastling
DIR By: WMaster
Date: November 17, 2020, 3:53 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
It took me a while to read through the explosion of balance
discussions. I read about 6 hours a day for a few days while
writing notes, tried any longer but my brain just stopped lol.
I’m also not the fastest reader and do try to keep it somewhat
memorized. However I decided I read enough and started writing a
balance proposal. So here it is. Thanks everyone for your
participation.
Intro
First I’d like to note that in the past I’ve been trying to
balancing the game while allowing for spots the be filled by
newer players, effectively balancing around a 4v2 game. However
as I see it now it’s better to balance with equal skill across
the board. When pro vs pro have an even fight, then if skill is
linear, average vs average should also have an even fight.
--- Quote from: GrumpyKitten link ---
> The main thing that i want to emphasize is that it is near
impossible to balance an asymmetrical game. It will always boil
down on individuals skill levels.
--- End Quote ---
And skill is also not that easy to define. There are different
kind of skills players can have. A player individual skills
could counter another players skillset. It’s hard to determine
who’s better in a Rock Paper Scissor scenario. However if Rock
becomes a Burning Rock we’d have a clear winner. Players can
improve their decisions and refine their skillset of a cerain
game, allowing to be able to counter more inexperienced players.
For some maybe obvious, but I would say it’s better to balance
around a pro vs pro setting than a new vs new setting.
Experienced players have in general more game knowledge and/or
skill than newer players and will most often use this to their
advantage to win. So often win stats can determine how players
compare to one another experience wise. And it’s the core game
knowledge which is important for balancing a game. Developers
like myself do not necessarily know more about that. And that is
why I value any input. Sometimes favoring opinions and arguments
from those with more experience.
Not to say newer players input can’t be important, lots of
little experience still add up to much experience. And it’s also
important to know how a game feels to play.
But I’ve also read a statement that new players want an easy to
execute method to win, to which I would say that you would also
have to face that method at times, and that would make it a bit
counter intuitive. Unless of course you avoid such situations..
--- Quote from: Avion link ---
> The point is to get better, not to have the option to phone it
in.
--- End Quote ---
Great to still see you Avion. And I agree, with at times some
relax moments.
With that, on to some balancing.
---------------------------------------------------------
I feel like we should address Firebat and its tech first, it has
been reported and discussed a lot. Also Roach and about high
ground bunker will be covered.
Firebat and Chemical Plant issues:
- A valid Firebat strategy is to bunker in, rush Chemical Plant,
and wait. It does not require much effort and is not risky, yet
Zerg can’t do much against it.
- A Firebat push strategy is boring to execute.
- Firebats are too hard to kill.
- Firebats serve a similar purpose with Marines.
- Firebats have a separate tech path.
- Firebats ignore micro and energy management that makes the
game unique and challenging.
- Without much risk, Firebats can be made too eary.
Suggestions were:
- Completely remove Firebat and Chemical Plant.
- Change Hydra and Strikeling damage reduction to type from
Armored to Structures.
- Decrease Firebat armor.
- Remove Firebat bonus damage vs Structures.
- Have Firebats require a Buggo to require some offensive play.
- Make Chemical Plant output depend on Refineries taken.
- Make Firebat an Armory tech.
- Make Firebat play a tank role.
Removal of Entities
As Oayoo made it clear that I shouldn’t be affraid removing
things from the game, especially when they are just not working.
Unless an entity has not been used a lot, removal can create a
feeling of loss for those who were still playing with them. A
question as of why they couldn’t just have been balanced better
could be a response. Adam wouldn’t be the only one to describe a
removal to be an extreme measure. A more comfortable decision
would be to revamp/rework a certain entity. Giving it a
different purpose, like suggested for Firebats to become a tank
instead of a damage dealer. But sometimes, and more often in RTS
games, removal is for the better.
Chemical Plant
More veteran players have told that the game was more enjoyable
in the past. Gas was a precious resource and at times you were
in a situation where you needed shatter yesterday. With the
coming of the Chemical Plant you’re now able to build a source
of Gas safely within your inner base. Yes it costs a lot to get,
but that’s also just looking at numbers to go up, a waiting
game. I can see Zerg Hex go without the Chemical Plant, or
perhaps a re-implementation later. It will likely draw much more
attention to the Converter, of course the use of this structure
can be discussed too.
---------------------------------------------------------
Firebats
Before going into Firebats, I’d like to inform about some
general game aspects relevant for Zerg Hex.
Swarm Rate
The rate at which a new units reach a defined area. Units
marching one by one have a lower swarm rate than a grouped
march.
Push Power
Affected by Swarm Rate and Time to Kill. With a swarm rate of 1
per 5 sec and time to kill of 3 sec, you’ll be able to push
forward for 2 seconds every 5 seconds. As GrumpyKitten pointed
out that not just energy use, but also DPS that matters in Zerg
Hex, especially for pushes. Note that attack range does not
affect this when considering instant attacks. Pushing units are
only occupied during attack, if able to kill from further
distances, they’ll also aquire new targets from a further
distance.
Overwelming
When Push Power is negative. Swarming units win time not being
attacked while being in attacking range. This happens more often
with lower DPS. However it is less possible with Shattering
Laser or Firebat’s area of attack.
Risk being attacked
Swarmed units risk being attacked when Time to Kill takes longer
than Time to Reach from moment of attack. Where moment of attack
is affected by attack range and Overwelming.
Firebats have very high DPS and thus a great Push Power. Shorter
range so they risk being attacked a bit faster. But because
Firebats have an area attack, it cannot be overwelmed like a
single target unit would, the deciding factor for Firebats to
take damage would just be the Time to Kill vs the Time to Reach
from its max range. And Time to Kill is quite short for almost
all Zerg units.
Currently Firebats have almost everything the Terran needs for
pushing. High armor, high health, high damage, bonus damage to
structures, reduced damage from Strikelings and Hydralisks. It’s
just a far better option to push with than Veteran Marines or
perhaps even Elites. Combined with a low mineral cost and an
easy to attain gas cost they can just be thrown into battle
while you build up the next wave.
[center][attachimg=1][/center]
Almost all can agree that Firebats are too strong. And some say
even if they’re nerfed, they don’t serve a special purpose, they
would just be some Marine with a different brand. Some would
like to see them mixed in with a Marine army. They would
naturally be at the front, so I like the idea for them becoming
a Tank.
Firebat Attack
Perhaps we could endorse Firebat’s ability to counter swarms of
fast to kill units. There have been issues with mass slowlings
being very effective and causing lags. ShinraBanshou therefore
suggested limiting spawner counts similar to Strikelings.
However I’d much rather have a counter unit so that it doesn’t
go uncontested and become such a problem.
We could discuss the possibility of Firebats dealing more damage
to Light units, these are Zerg units up to Tanklings. Hydralisks
would have to be changed to remove the Light qualification.
Roaches would be where they fall off in offensive strength.
They could still be useful as tank against Roaches. This because
Roaches can then not get kills to spawn Tar Roaches to get out
of hand. My proposal is to make Tar Roaches be Light units so
Firebats are even better against them combined with Marines. We
could even go as far as to make Firebats burn away Tar from the
Roaches, removing their Tar upgrades when hit. This would make
them a more direct counter.
For actual damage values I’d start with something like 15 to
Light and 5 by default.
Firebat Tech
It has been suggested to integrate Firebats within the Armory
tech. It could be done with a low cost research at the Armory
such that Firebats can be made a bit sooner in scenarios where
you’re facing early pressure. Or it could be with Tier 2
Equipment. Tier 2 would then be relevant when facing mass
Slowlings or encountering Primals.
Firebat Tank
Firebats might still be too durable even while tank becomes
their main role. I propose to decrease their HP and replace some
armor with continuous regeneration. The replacement shifts
attention from damage per attack to damage per second, it’s
quite similar, but it also allows Firebats to recover from
battle much faster. Also Hydralisks will be able to deal more
damage and do not have to reach a certain damage per attack
threshold, with enough of them you’re able to kill the
front-line tanks. Values for Firebat could be 100 HP, 2 Armor
and 5HP/s continuous regeneration. They’ll be able to tank most
of the early-mid game, until Primals get a few attack upgrades.
They don’t really scale well into the later game so I think they
could use an upgrade at the Armory which adds 200 HP or even
more. Also note that Large Spines still deal bonus damage to
Armored, 110 as opposed to 70. Could also be discussed if that
needs changing too.
Firebat Energy
It wouldn’t be great if Firebats were still to drain gas with it
becoming a harder resource to get. Suggested was to make them
use energy. With them using energy it can be difficult to
recharge them during battle while they are more at the front,
they could be given a higher energy capacity, but they might
also be replenished with Energy Warp. I guess we’ll have to find
the right numbers by playing some with them. Note that they are
also most likely the first to die, so giving them too much
capacity can result in more energy losses. For now I think
somewhere around 30 attacks worth of energy should be alright.
Making them deplete a full load at the same time Marines would
without Conservation. I think making them use 2 energy per shot
would make them effecient energy users.
Firebat Cost
I’m thinking of making Firebats cost a little more gas, it will
delay some tech if made early, and later you can use excess gas
to strengthen your army.
---------------------------------------------------------
Roach
Some reported Roach issues:
- Counter to T1 Marines
- Combined with Tar Roach spawns they are better than Primals
and Ultralisks considering costs.
- Primal Tech cost much so players can get stuck with Roaches.
- Can be made too early.
Tar Infection
Personally I don’t mind Roaches being an affordable counter to
T1 Marines. They become strong when grouped together, like all
units, but with Roach Infection more so. In a favorable
engagement killing 10 Marines they produce 500HP worth of
addition Tar Roaches directly on site of battle. Kills lead to
more kills. Fun mechanic, but it also means threat grows more
exponentially than with other units. Without surface area
limitations they would become more dangerious than any other
spawner units. Luckily there are many ways to limit surface
area, it’s only more of a problem in an open field when pushing.
Lowering the effectiveness of spawnlings will reduce how much
threat goes out of hand. I was thinking of a reduction in
health.
Tar Rush
Reducing the spawling’s health will also reduce the total health
once Tar Rush is researched. Currently a Veteran Marine with
Penetrating Laser needs 28 shots to kill both Roach and Tar
Roach, this is the same as required for a Primal. Yes you’ll
need Veterans when Primals show up, but Zerg will need Roaches
when Veterans show up. It’s a mixed bag. Once Zerg upgrades,
they’ll likely sprinkle in a few Primals to prevent easy pushes
and then go back to Roaches. There’s not a real obvious
solution, increasing Veteran Marines’ damage does allows for
faster killing, but it only makes Roaches compare better against
Primals, higher damage gives favor to health as opposed to
armor. Even facing Elites you’re better off creating Roaches. I
think this is what Oayoo meant by denoting Roaches counter
Elites.
However I created a sheet and found some helpful info. At 3 and
4 damage there is a significant difference between how many hits
required for Roach (total) and Primal, almost double. And 4
damage being double as effective as 3. My idea is to increase
Veteran’s Shatter damage by one to make this difference more
apparent.
Veterans without shatter kill per shot 3.57% of both Roach
(total) and Primal.
With Shatter damage at 2, Veterans kill per shot 4.43% of a
Roach (total) and 4.48% of a Primal.
With Shatter damage at 3, Veterans kill per shot 5.28% of a
Roach (total) and 4.48% of a Primal.
With Shatter damage at 4, Veterans kill per shot 6.75% of a
Roach (total) and 5.37% of a Primal.
Sounds a bit strange, buffing Marines to make Primals more
effective. But when designing games this is totally acceptable.
Of course there needs to be some counteraction for the increase
in power, but the increase in difference is important. I would
actually say buffing Primals from 110 HP to 120 HP would provide
an even better result.
Putting changes 120 HP Primals, 40 HP Tar Roach and +1 Shatter
damage together results in Veterans dealing 7.18% and 4.87%
damage per shot with Penetrating Laser. Making Primals +47% more
resillient than Roaches to Veterans. I would also prefer
increasing Elites Shatter damage by one, so it has at least some
effect on Ultralisk with Penetrating Laser. Elites vs
Roach/Primal would then be 13.4% and 12.0%, not a big
difference, but Elites will have a great pushing power to both
of them, so Zerg would be adviced to tech up anyway.
I’ll attach the sheet I made to allow making your own
calculations with it, or to double check mine of course.
---------------------------------------------------------
Beastling
This is another reported unit having no use. To which I can
agree. I didn’t quite do any math when implementing it. Turns
out a Slowling Spawner produces up to 25 HP / 4 sec or 187.5 HP
/ 30 sec, while a Beastling Spawner produces 200 HP / 30 sec,
but you get 5 Slowling Spawners with the same supply, so
choosing Slowlings is more than 4 times as effective. Granted
they are more durable and that can result into a few more
attacks, but it generally that doesn’t happen. Point being, they
need a buff or removal, removal as an option because they were
likely not used that much.
As a buff, 20 supply of Slowlings produce 375 HP / 12 seconds,
so how about spawning Beastlings every 12 seconds while removing
its Light attribute. They still have 1 armor and it perhaps
allows to choose for something better when facing Firebats. Also
they have a much higher HP density which makes grouping them
more dangerious.
---------------------------------------------------------
Heavy Bunker
Even the Omegalisk especially designed to put an end to
fortification can have trouble doing so. I think the primary
reason for this is the Construction Yard with 4 Defenders.
Without Defenders, the Construction Yard aura gives 40% damage
reduction. This translates into 167% effective health. But with
4 Defenders each adding 8% reduction for a total of 72%
reduction, this translates into 357% effective health. Which is
quite huge. From just +67% to +257% just by adding Defenders.
This combined with sufficient Fortification upgrades is enough
to buy time to kill an Omegalisk.
Note that damage is reduced, and so repairs are quicker to
recover from it, making any form of healing appear more
effective too.
Concluding that with the ability to upgrade Fortification a lot,
something needs to change to prevent unbeatable bunkers.
Proposing to replace the damage reduction gained from Defenders
with something else. Maybe a regeneration bonus to structures
witin range, while disabling the Defender’s ability to repair.
Something like this would be highly effective early, but fall
off later. An armor boost could also work. To disable repair
would prevent Defenders to unlink by accident, previously
prevented with hold position.
Defensive Play
--- Quote from: Oayoo link ---
> The problem right now is that if you play defensive with a
yard opening, you will be able to do MORE DAMAGES than an
aggressive build.
--- End Quote ---
I certainly tried designing so a defensive playstyle would also
be an option, it could be fun for more passive players to also
contribute somehow, to have some more variety. But I guess they
shouldn’t have had the power to wipe out the Zerg so easily.
Poor design on my part. I’ve been trying to come up with ideas
to allow defensive players to support offensive players. I have
one idea I myself like, I’ll post it in the New Ideas section.
For now I feel like the Fortification upgrade won’t be that
effective without the Chemical Plant, it could be upgraded at
the start, but that does hurt in offensive power. Proposing to
increase armor gain by 1 for walls and gates per upgrade. It
will be stronger earlier yet can easily be negated with later
Zerg units.
---------------------------------------------------------
Summary
Here are the ideas put together. Hope I’m going the right
direction with this. It is not final and so it is open for
debate.
- Removing Chemical Plant
- Revamping Firebat
[li]Set damage to 5 and 15 to Light.
- No bonus damage to Structures.
- Using 2 energy per shot with 60 energy max.
- Usable as tank. 100HP, 2 armor and 5 HP/s continuous
regeneration.
- Making them cost more gas heavy and less minerals. Could be
from 40/30 to 30/50.
- Require Tier 2 Equipment.
- Add upgrade at Armory to increase HP by 200.
[/li]
- Veteran Marine
[li]Increase Shattering Laser base damage from 2 to 3.
[/li]
- Elite Marine
[li]Increase Shattering Laser base damage from 4 to 5.
[/li]
- Buff Primal Roach
[li]Increase HP from 110 to 120.
[/li]
- Nerf Tar Roach (Spawnling)
[li]Decrease HP from 50 to 40.
- Make qualify as Light.
[/li]
- Adjust Beastling
[li]Spawn Time from 30 to 12 seconds
- Remove qualification Light
[/li]
- Hydralisk
[li]Remove qualification Light
[/li]
- Construction Yard - Defender Link
[li]Remove bonus damage reduction.
- Give bonus regeneration equal to 50% of Defender’s repair
rate.
- Disable Defender repair while linked.
[/li]
- Fortication Upgrade
[li]Increase armor gain for walls and gates from 1 to 2
[/li]
I think with these changes might also result in Ultralisks
having more use like it has before. Torralisks might now
completely take over the role of the Omegalisk, because bunkers
will be less effective. Let me know if that needs changing
together with this or that it can wait for another patch.
Have a great day,
WMaster
#Post#: 426--------------------------------------------------
Re: Balance Take 1 – Firebat, Roach, Bunker, Beastling
DIR By: RickSanchez
Date: November 17, 2020, 4:24 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
i am very hyped for this. Great changes beside leaving italis
which can maybe still lead into bunker forever. also maybe
increase roachspanwer cost also by like 10 to 20.
Can't wait to see it live
when you will update?
#Post#: 427--------------------------------------------------
Re: Balance Take 1 – Firebat, Roach, Bunker, Beastling
DIR By: RickSanchez
Date: November 17, 2020, 5:13 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
One other thing to consider is that zerg doesnt have to be
afraid of some super late doom push and therefore has not to eco
as hard as now, which means z can get more infestors into mass
transfuse which will doom alot of terrans these days (if they
even push at all). maybe that needs a nerf too like more
energyusage or make it cost minerals
#Post#: 428--------------------------------------------------
Re: Balance Take 1 – Firebat, Roach, Bunker, Beastling
DIR By: Adam
Date: November 17, 2020, 5:17 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Great changes, lets go with them
--- Quote from: RickSanchez link ---
>
> One other thing to consider is that zerg doesnt have to be
afraid of some super late doom push and therefore has not to eco
as hard as now, which means z can get more infestors into mass
transfuse which will doom alot of terrans these days (if they
even push at all). maybe that needs a nerf too like more
energyusage
>
--- End Quote ---
As of now zergs that know how to use transfuse can be counted on
fingers so I dont think it will ever become a problem
#Post#: 429--------------------------------------------------
Re: Balance Take 1 – Firebat, Roach, Bunker, Beastling
DIR By: Oayoo
Date: November 17, 2020, 5:47 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I think you are going into the right path Wmaster !!!! WP
Now we will obviously need a lot of test in game to see how it
will works.
In addition to removing chemical, i think you should not block
the gases of the dead players. That way Terran can try to take
sneaky gases ^^ It would really be helpful !
I would ask too for a little speed nerf on Tar Roaches and i
fear that the high regen of Firebats might be a little strong
(we need test on this).
5 hp regen may be a little too much (1-2 hp regen maybe ? need
test !!!!)
Sorry for multiple edits.
#Post#: 430--------------------------------------------------
Re: Balance Take 1 – Firebat, Roach, Bunker, Beastling
DIR By: Mehaperson
Date: November 17, 2020, 8:34 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Over all I think these balance changes are good, it switches the
core game back to what it was which is to my understand is a
race against the Zerg.
Some key things from what I understood, ion racing is still a
completely viable option as italis and multiple armor wall
upgrades exist. With the added regen this is going to be
incredibly powerful in the early game/early mid but will
obviously drop off ridiculously hard in the later stages as the
damage reduction no longer exists, which is fine. Removal of
italis and making ion damage heal-able would prevent this but
that's up for discussion.
With the reworked firebats, in my opinion, this adds a new
element to the game that hasn't really existed for terran before
which is unit composition/group microing. Obviously before
people slow pushed with shock troopers and marines, and doom
pushes, but A moving isn't exactly what i'd call microing.
Seeing this now it reminds me of when Terran went
hellbat/marines vs zergs in ladder during HotS. Microing your
hellbats to soak baneling/ling damage forcing zerg to micro
banelings and terrans to split marines while hellbats got
freehits. This, from what I'm predicting anyways, can
potentially be seen when the roaches start to show up and the
firebats can be used as a wall to reduce the surface area and
burn the tar roaches that really punish poor micro/bad play.
This will cause zerg to go into primal and ultralisks to sort of
eat through this, but that requires in game testing to see if
this opinion of mine towards this holds up.
(inb4 somebody comes in and says, "you dont need firebats with
good micro ^^", to which I reply, not everybody has top 10
diamond/low masters apm/microing and games shouldn't be balanced
at the top level, nor the bottom level, but around the middle as
that's where most of your consistent player base is at)
Removal of the chem plant is huge in a good way. This punishes
passive play(which is always good game design), and forces
players to move towards a more aggressive play style. Obviously
as I mentioned earlier, players can still ion rush(which should
be looked at if it becomes an issue).
Overall, it sounds like games won't last longer than 30 minutes
unless zerg is hurting and terran is just toying with them.
Good changes and I hope that this is well received by the player
base/community with some more feedback to continually push the
game in the right direction.
#Post#: 431--------------------------------------------------
Re: Balance Take 1 – Firebat, Roach, Bunker, Beastling
DIR By: Oayoo
Date: November 18, 2020, 2:39 am
---------------------------------------------------------
There is a possibility for the wall upgrade buff to be abused,
we need to test it in games. It should be fine without the
defenders buff but i wanna try ^^
We all know that a lot of players will immediatly try to create
a new bunker strategy out of this because Italis are still here.
We need test in game ! can't wait^^
#Post#: 432--------------------------------------------------
Re: Balance Take 1 – Firebat, Roach, Bunker, Beastling
DIR By: Speed
Date: November 18, 2020, 4:06 am
---------------------------------------------------------
... Not a fan tbh.
As much as I hated the chemical, if you wanted to win roach
players, getting 3 chemicals and auto-casting walls was the best
way.
10HP removed from the tar roach... 20% of its HP... not gonna do
anything.
Roaches with tar rush on creep, with speed upgrades, too, you
cannot move forward as terran unless you have RIDICOULUS DPS
output. I wouldn't get a firebat for 30 gas, let alone 50. If it
didn't require T2 it could be a nice (OP) counter to the
constant stream of harrassment so many zerg love to send to
someone.
I'm gonna talk about the issue with roach again.
Zerg all-in by building full spawners and upgrading capacity
before getting any eco, then, if some terran somehow manages to
hang on to his low ground, build an army and push, even with the
shittiest eco zerg can afford Armor 1 & 2, and from the spawners
they lose they gain supply to build roach... Yeah, it FURTHER
demolishes their already shitty eco, but the terrans don't have
good eco either from the early game allin.
For zerg this is a great patch! Stupid OP firebat is gone (the
one where 4-5 can take a big spine), chemical plant is gone, so
you will not see 20 lvl walls at 30 minutes, and zerg's go-to
unit, the roach, only got a 20% HP nerf on their little minion.
Even for my zerg (I rather quit the game than making roaches),
this patch is good, with the stupid firebat gone and chemical
plant gone, only italis is an issue for the ultralisk, so I feel
confident I can go for ultra tech instead of brutalisk like I
did before.
I consider myself as an above average zerg, and even I miss
transfusions regularly, don't think it will be too big of an
issue for me. Though the design probably isn't too great I
guess.
Just remove roach altogether. Zerg has to make eco for primal,
if they don't do so, they will die before reaching it. For roach
zerg doesn't have to make eco, so they will just all-in into
all-in like they do now and, as much as I despice the current
firebat, it's nice when someone rolls over those noobs with a
ball of firebats. Transitioning from T1 into chemical plants is
boring as fuck, but at least it's a win. If terran don't improve
I see myself losing games to zerg that all-in, then all-in again
and it's not a game I want to play.
I prefer the current patch over this proposal, ideally I wanted
a patch where you need to win with T1, but with the insufficient
roach nerf I don't feel like you can win with T1, and your
fallback options are gone, too.
I think even if T1 was the only way to win, most people would
still AFK, I think sadly even I failed to properly evaluate this
point when discussing future changes.
There is too many bad players, maybe try buffing their skill? ;)
Bunkers are actually easy to break for zerg if they eco well,
and if italis was gone you could do so much with hydras, but
instead you propose to take away the defenders 8% dmg reduction?
Yeah, it will make it easier for the zerg... in a no brain way,
this is exactly what we didn't want! Or I didn't want at least.
I've said this before on heXnab discord, I was expecting too
much and I already knew I was going to get disappointed. Here we
are :/
#Post#: 434--------------------------------------------------
Re: Balance Take 1 – Firebat, Roach, Bunker, Beastling
DIR By: Oayoo
Date: November 18, 2020, 4:37 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Best fix would be to remove Roaches and armor 2.
Then, scale up the cost of:
Armor 1(infests) around 1500/2000 ?
Armor 2(primals) around 5000 ?
Armor 3(ultralisks) around 6000 ?
Armor 4(brutalisks) around 9000 ? (buff them, they are total
garbage)
That way, to make infestors you will need to commit more eco to
transfuse and no more retarded roaches x)
#Post#: 435--------------------------------------------------
Re: Balance Take 1 – Firebat, Roach, Bunker, Beastling
DIR By: Adam
Date: November 18, 2020, 5:16 am
---------------------------------------------------------
remove roach and lock festors behind 2k?
XD
then why even bother pretending that zerg should have any chance
vs 2 players that know how to autocast t1 no matter how good he
is?
just make some mechanic that if 2 terrans build armory and tech
lab with 2 charges before 12-14 min zergs hive explode, will be
faster
and one more thing - pls stop with shared eco argument as a way
for zerg to fast rush primals, its not happening in random lobby
with random teammate and we all know it and it has nothing to do
with skill as it simply
require lvl of communication unreachable with some random person
u dont know (and lets not even get started on amout of people
who dont communicate at all)
*****************************************************
Page 1 of 10
DIR Next Page