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#Post#: 1321--------------------------------------------------
Re: Changes Take 2
By: Hecari Date: December 16, 2020, 2:37 pm
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Haha WMaster, you've misspelled my name. Its okay, I still love
you.
I think these new changes are very intriguing indeed and will be
looking forward to trying it out. I'm especially interested in
what kinds of new strategies will emerge.
As a side note, there seems to be a lot of talk about what Zerg
Hex "should" or "should not" be. For example, "Zerg Hex should
have diverse strategies" or "Zerg Hex shouldn't be a tower
defense." These kinds of statements in my opinion are very vague
and unsupportable, because there really isn't any sort of
authority on what Zerg Hex actually is, except for whatever
WMaster decides it to be. Any sort of claim by anyone else on
what Zerg Hex "should/n't be" will be fundamentally based on
one's personal view of the game and what one enjoys from it, and
you cannot reasonably expect other people to concur with you. I
do not intend on taking sides with this comment, but just to
help facilitate clearer discourse.
#Post#: 1322--------------------------------------------------
Re: Changes Take 2
By: Speed Date: December 16, 2020, 2:41 pm
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ok, clearly zerg hex is a tower defense, let's remove the armory
in favor of a 2nd yard.
gogogo xd
(Najdorf has a build btw... ^^)
#Post#: 1323--------------------------------------------------
Re: Changes Take 2
By: Hecari Date: December 16, 2020, 2:53 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
While perhaps it is indeed a bit of a stretch to say that Zerg
Hex is a tower defense, it would be quite accurate to say that
it has tower defense elements.
#Post#: 1324--------------------------------------------------
Re: Changes Take 2
By: AAAAPPPPP Date: December 16, 2020, 2:55 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
These changes look excellent for helping to balance out the game
and adding variety. Will have to test them out of course to see
how well they all work together, but looks to be a great step in
the right direction. Appreciate you listening to our feedback!
#Post#: 1325--------------------------------------------------
Re: Changes Take 2
By: Speed Date: December 16, 2020, 3:30 pm
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[quote author=AAAAPPPPP link=topic=138.msg1324#msg1324
date=1608152150]
These changes look excellent for helping to balance out the game
and adding variety. Will have to test them out of course to see
how well they all work together, but looks to be a great step in
the right direction. Appreciate you listening to our feedback!
[/quote]
Damn, I thought I was good at making sarcastic comments, but
this one makes me look like an amateur x)
Really good joke buddy, I'm impressed.
#Post#: 1326--------------------------------------------------
Re: Changes Take 2
By: Adam Date: December 16, 2020, 3:47 pm
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[quote author=<heXnab>Speed link=topic=138.msg1325#msg1325
date=1608154217]
[quote author=AAAAPPPPP link=topic=138.msg1324#msg1324
date=1608152150]
These changes look excellent for helping to balance out the game
and adding variety. Will have to test them out of course to see
how well they all work together, but looks to be a great step in
the right direction. Appreciate you listening to our feedback!
[/quote]
Damn, I thought I was good at making sarcastic comments, but
this one makes me look like an amateur x)
Really good joke buddy, I'm impressed.
[/quote]
^ person who is speaks about "Constant whining and provocating
like a little 5 year old kid xd." btw
#Post#: 1327--------------------------------------------------
Re: Changes Take 2
By: Speed Date: December 16, 2020, 3:49 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=Adam link=topic=138.msg1326#msg1326
date=1608155257]
[quote author=<heXnab>Speed link=topic=138.msg1325#msg1325
date=1608154217]
[quote author=AAAAPPPPP link=topic=138.msg1324#msg1324
date=1608152150]
These changes look excellent for helping to balance out the game
and adding variety. Will have to test them out of course to see
how well they all work together, but looks to be a great step in
the right direction. Appreciate you listening to our feedback!
[/quote]
Damn, I thought I was good at making sarcastic comments, but
this one makes me look like an amateur x)
Really good joke buddy, I'm impressed.
[/quote]
^ person who is speaks about "Constant whining and provocating
like a little 5 year old kid xd." btw
[/quote]
Complaining about it, while doing it xd btw.
#Post#: 1328--------------------------------------------------
Re: Changes Take 2
By: RickSanchez Date: December 16, 2020, 4:03 pm
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[quote author=WMaster link=topic=138.msg1306#msg1306
date=1608122815]
Summary
[list]
[li]Beastling
[list]
[li]Deal percentage damage to nearby walls upon attacking a
wall.[/li]
[/list][/li]
[li]Tankling
[list]
[li]Deal additional flat damage to structures. Around 10-15
damage.[/li]
[li]Make default AI target closest enemy instead of attacking
enemies.[/li]
[/list][/li]
[li]Construction Yard
[list]
[li]Add research to produce gas. Cost 150/250/350 for 1/2/3 gas
per 3 sec.[/li]
[li]Make gas production only possible when build outside the
main base.[/li]
[li]Add passive ability to generate double the gas income after
5 minutes of construction.[/li]
[/list][/li]
[li]Rework Siege Tank
[list]
[li]Limit to only one that can be built from the Construction
Yard.[/li]
[li]Make it require upgrade ‘Sentry Supercharge’ but rename it
‘Plasma Cannons.’[/li]
[li]Increase creation cost to about 300 minerals and 100 gas.
Train time to about 40 sec.[/li]
[li]Allow for upgrades within the Siege Tank. They are lost when
destroyed.[/li]
[li]Make its fire ability cost quite a bit. Thinking 100-200
minerals, 2000-4000 energy.[/li]
[li]Make them revealed for Zerg and alert Zerg players when they
are constructed.[/li]
[/list][/li]
[li]Hydralisk
[list]
[li]Starting with +1 life when spawned.[/li]
[li]Remove Hydralisk Spawn Size upgrades.[/li]
[li]Increase life gained rate, time from 120 sec to 50 sec.[/li]
[li]Increase life regeneration from 0.4 to 3.0.[/li]
[li]Reduce maximum lives from +3 to +2.[/li]
[li]Indicate having no additional lives with changed unit
model.[/li]
[/list][/li]
[li]Infestor
[list]
[li]Make Transfuse cast instantly.[/li]
[li]Increase structure maximum health gain from 100 to 200. (Max
1600.)[/li]
[/list][/li]
[li]Tune Large Spine Crawler
[list]
[li]Increase base damage from 70 to 75.[/li]
[li]Increase splash radius from 0.7/1.2/1.5 to 0.7/1.2/2.0.[/li]
[li]Increase splash areas damage from 60%/35%/20% to
60%/40%/20%[/li]
[/list][/li]
[li]Upgrade Baneling
[list]
[li]Change health/armor from 90/0 to 30/3[/li]
[li]Make classify as Light.[/li]
[li]Add 3 Spores coming from explosion, dealing 25 damage in an
area with radius of 1.[/li]
[li]Make Spawner spawn an unlimited amount.[/li]
[li]Make Spawner train time depend on amount of units alive
produced from Spawner.[/li]
[/list][/li]
[li]Buff Firebat
[list]
[li]Increase health from 100 to 200.[/li]
[li]Increase Heavy Plating upgrade health from +200 to
+300.[/li]
[li]Decrease Heavy Plating upgrade cost from 250 to 200
gas.[/li]
[/list][/li]
[li]Other
[list]
[li]Incorporate Shock Trooper and Firebat into Conservation
upgrades.[/li]
[li]Reapers gain +1 attack from the Penetrating Laser
upgrade.[/li]
[li]Re-add +4% damage reduction from Defenders linked to
Construction Yards.[/li]
[li]Decrease Tanklings Spawner mineral cost from 120 to
100.[/li]
[li]Decrease Armor 1 research cost from 800 to 400.[/li]
[/list][/li]
[li]New Zerg Base
[list]
[li]Raise inner base and extend the ramp.[/li]
[li]Protect inner base from all attacks except Ion Cannon, also
from Scans.[/li]
[li]Raise base side-areas to give it more protection.[/li]
[li]Make it look pretty with Zerg walls.[/li]
[/list][/li]
[/list]
[/quote]
Beastling
Good change!
Beastlings gained value with faster respawn and even open some
edgecases in which they are useful in a random scenario. Still
they need more love and this can be something.
Tankling
Bad and/or atleast bad balanced change.
The Tanklings purpose shouldn't be to bust walls. There is a
unit for that role called Banelings. Rather make that one good
in its role.
Themewise i'd rather want to see buffs that affect Tanklings
role to drain energy by adding more scaling with armor upgrades.
Construction Yard
Bad idea. This will dramaticly increase the amount of players
that will eco up forever, doing nothing meaningful and build bm
wall that zerg will struggle to break. Maybe the Banelings
change counter that later on, but i have doubts. As pushing
terran you are lost in solo random since your team will be less
likely to help you in any way by taking pressure with doing
attacks theirself. Totally against what the game should look
like imo. Early yard into cow eco is the go to build after that
patch happens. Big disappointment after the last patches.
Tank
I can't really judge that now. It will be OP or useless. Due to
Zergbase changes I am more tempted to think it will be useless.
Hydralisk
Twisted opinion. While I like most of them the remove of the
upgrades will Buff Elitepushes which further encourages terrans
to turtle till that point or fail the timing completly. How many
terrans do you know that hit 25 min Elitetimingpush? Randoms
wont even do that 30 mins in if they decide to dump 750 gas into
conyard and therefore skip all the marineupgrades. See Conyard
above.
Infestor
Great change. Maybe just double the HP is too much love.
Big Spine
Great change.
Baneling
Want to test before i judge
Firebat
Yikes. One bat will tank bigspine for longer than overcharge
lasts. Nobrainer to send one before the marines. Likely to be
OP.
Other
Conservation good, Reaper +1 why not, tanklingcost good
Armor 1 400 and Defenderlink buff on top of the regeneration and
the doubled wall armor both have potential to be gamebreaking in
its own way.
Zerg Base
Great beside the attackblock. This one is a big yikes again.
Overall I think the patch will be a step in the wrong direction
and will lead into turtles that eco for 25 minutes and watch
teammates die that actually play the game. New Meta try to
pretend to be as least of a threat as possible to play farmville
with nice coweco. I consider 3 gas opener as dead since you
cannot effort to take zerg early aggression. sad gameplay. sad
decissions. I am very disappointed.
#Post#: 1329--------------------------------------------------
Re: Changes Take 2
By: baZzZ Date: December 16, 2020, 4:10 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
i just came back for one post, then im out again - Thank you
very much WMaster for your efforts filling the game with more
varity, i will enjoy playing around and find new/different
strategies beside t1/t2 push. Thank youuu. :)
#Post#: 1330--------------------------------------------------
Re: Changes Take 2
By: Turb007 Date: December 16, 2020, 4:13 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Speed, we feeling a bit extra-feisty lately? :P
In general: I honestly like the concept of the majority of the
proposed changes. My huge complaint here though is that I would
really like the game to be balanced a bit more before trying to
implement all of these things. In random lobbies, there is a
CHANCE that these will help the balance (which is a good thing),
yes. But I would of liked the game to be balanced around at
least a "Pro" 2v4 before all of this is added.
[quote author=WMaster link=topic=138.msg1306#msg1306
date=1608122815]
In my opinion there should be no problem with some suboptimal
strategies as long as it introduces some unique traits.
[/quote]
I like this idea, it gives those who are more casual a chance to
play the game and actually have an impact. The key here is that
they are suboptimal, which may take some balancing.
[quote author=WMaster link=topic=138.msg1306#msg1306
date=1608122815]
[list][li]Allowing Zerg to have answers to bunkers earlier in
the game so they can still choose what player to pressure
regardless of playstyle.[/li][/list]
[/quote]
I like this as well. Then, in theory, if the zerg just leaves
them alone and focuses hard on the aggro terrans (as per usual),
then they can become a huge problem later on.
[quote author=WMaster link=topic=138.msg1306#msg1306
date=1608122815]
Large Spine Crawler
[/quote]
I agree with Speed on this one. This won't do anything vs good
players yet deters "lesser" players. I don't see this being in
the right direction, albeit not that huge of a change.
[quote author=WMaster link=topic=138.msg1306#msg1306
date=1608122815]
If the randomness is disliked it can also be made to fire in the
direction of the attacker
[/quote]
The baneling idea is interesting, can't say I'm for or against
it. However, certainly not a fan of adding more RNG to the game.
[quote author=WMaster link=topic=138.msg1306#msg1306
date=1608122815]
I’ll throw in a variation that Reapers get +1 attack from
Penetrating Laser too.
[/quote]
No please. It's hard enough to keep decent players off of extra
gases. Strikes can be defended with a couple shatter marines
long enough to get a small wall up with reapers and a few scvs
behind it around extra gases. Meaning different spawner units
need to attack it. This change would just make it that much more
difficult to deal with multiple people doing that, on top of
dealing with the actual aggression.
[quote author=WMaster link=topic=138.msg1306#msg1306
date=1608122815]
[3] Suggested has been to re-apply some damage reduction bonus
from Defenders to Construction Yards. Observed was that they
don’t feel like they add defensive value. This can be done, but
not as much as before. With a +4% on max 3 stacks you jump from
+67% to +108% effective health, I think that’s a good place to
start. Note that effective regeneration/repair also applies
here, so it should be noticeable given the added repair bonus.
[/quote]
No, please no. As Oayoo stated, bunkering is still very easy to
do. I've already felt that ion should be bumped up to 50
charges, if all of these changes go through, ions are going to
be absurd again.
[quote author=WMaster link=topic=138.msg1306#msg1306
date=1608122815]
[5] Also suggested was to decrease the Zerg Armor 1 research
cost. So it is less of an eco penalty which is crucial early in
the game. Beastlings could then be more of a choice perhaps. I’m
thinking to decrease it from 800 to 400. I feel like that makes
it more accessible, Armor 1 isn’t a high improvement and does
also not help with eco, so I think this change might be safe. Do
let me know if it is actually a bad idea.
[/quote]
Yes, yes this is a bad idea :P I'd actually be fine with it if
infestors had slower movement speed. And maybe lower range as
Speed suggested, so marines can fire at them behind walls.
[quote author=WMaster link=topic=138.msg1306#msg1306
date=1608122815]
Zerg Inner Base Idea
[/quote]
I really like this! Idk if blocking scans is right, I kind of
like to keep tabs on zergs eco in some games.. But other than
that, thats cool, I like.
I also like the infestor and hydra changes. Should be
interesting. Can't say whether or not I like the con yard gas
income.. Kind of undecided there.
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