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#Post#: 940--------------------------------------------------
Riddle me this
By: Hugh Jass Date: November 25, 2022, 6:01 pm
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What makes a player useful for the team and what not. What is
the difference between a 44% player and 64% player. Is it rigged
that some players have over 60% winrate ? Why is the average
winrate under 50%. Does having more battles make you more
experienced more than someone who has less battles but better
winrate ?
#Post#: 941--------------------------------------------------
Re: Riddle me this
By: Moderator1 Date: November 26, 2022, 12:36 am
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We can take all the questions in the order they appear and start
with the first one and stay on 1 topic/question at a time for
simplicity and then move to the 2nd one. I understand that some
of the topics are related but let's try at start to handle them
1 by 1 separately.
Is the question about 50% about my Ranked WR or something else?
Can you rephrase it to be more clear and more general and with
more clear goal? Usually we don't debate about anyone's personal
aspects because it is too simple, and leads to personal attacks.
I can answer why personally my university grades are like they
are but the answer and to the topic in whole is too simple and
boring and not productive.
All other questions look clear to me.
Looks you know the rules, general ethics, so we can start I
guess.
I will answer the 1st sentence first about the term Useful etc.
You can meanwhile rephrase or change the questions/arguments.
There is no prize here for the winner and it is 1-to-1 debate
with me and you and others should create their own debates.
For the audience I suggest to notice what is the main
topic/category here, is it about camouflage, slang, WG sales
etc? It is "stats don't matter" category like we mostly have
here. We have debunked the matter-argument many times but this
time the to topic is more clear with more refined questions so
it is little bit new/different. Previous debaters have had the
generally same stats-topic but they formulated it as "Stats
matter because one lost a battle once upon a time". Your
statements seem more adequate compared to those debators.
First I give some helpful arguments for the opponent because we
help our opponents here otherwise it would be too boring. One is
that if there are real money tournaments in a sport that require
for qualification some stats then Stats matter as a required
step to become a millionaire as top athletes are. This is one
argument you can use in sports and probably in Wows too. If
anyone wants to use that argument in any debates here then go
ahead and I give counter-arguments. I can give later more
helpful arguments for the opponent on that stats-topic but next
I give arguments of my side for the 1st question.
#Post#: 942--------------------------------------------------
Re: Riddle me this
By: Moderator1 Date: November 26, 2022, 1:28 am
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[quote]
What makes a player useful for the team and what not.
[/quote]
Can you define the term usefulness in entertainments? What it is
and is it it needed to someone for some amount? Or just rephrase
your question. I ask because my answer depends on what you mean
or which believes you have.
I think we all agree that battle results do not take into
account all things. Your own community members give examples
that a DD may carry the battle and be actually the key and have
at the same time last position in the result list, and other
explanations. We both agree on that, me, you and your community.
So, stats are not an ideal tool but we usually disagree which
usefulness can a non-ideal tool give. Usefulness can be a
subjective term where one sees one use and the other subject the
other aspects. That's why it is important to define more clearly
your question. It may be that you think that team members have
everyone the same goals in entertainment and therefore all have
the same definition for the usefulness term.
For example if people play football with friends or sometimes
Wows then their main goal is to socialize and they define the
football evening as a useful in case there were nice talks.
I have seen many times that Wows community does not understand
what it talks. It fails to define terms that it uses, we have
many examples for that. And it is not about defining skills but
because of brainwashed believes. Maybe you can prove the
opposite this time and define the term usefulness adequately and
your whole standpoint with your first statement will be
adequate. But it may be that everyone talks about "usefulness
for the team" and your brain just repeats such idea and words
without comprehending what you say. In real life people have lot
of different beleives too that they can't explain adequately,
for example hundreds of millions say that Ukrainian military
operation is a very good thing and they say it because all
others around them say it and if you asked them to explain then
they would fail and even fail to define the term War. So, it is
very common that peopel say things automatically without
actually knowing what they do and i refer to it with the term
Brainwash and i don't mean anything negative with it, i jsut
don't know another better suiting word. So, it may be that you
also jsut gave the sentence number 1 automatically and if so
then we can skip it.
#Post#: 946--------------------------------------------------
Re: Riddle me this
By: Moderator1 Date: November 27, 2022, 8:13 am
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I remind that ignoring arguments means one loses the debate.
We wait a response from the debator "Hugh Jass al Dente".
If he fails to reply he loses.
After 3 days i close the debate and decalre the winner.
[quote author=Admin al Dente link=topic=90.msg573#msg573
date=1664608951]
HTML https://m.youtube.com/shorts/TkEf7z9hhPc
[/quote]
#Post#: 950--------------------------------------------------
Re: Riddle me this
By: Ranked_good_3 Date: November 27, 2022, 9:16 am
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you didnt answer his questions boy... you never win any
debate....
go and play COOP its better for all
#Post#: 951--------------------------------------------------
Re: Riddle me this
By: Moderator1 Date: November 27, 2022, 9:18 am
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[quote author=Ranked_good_3 link=topic=153.msg950#msg950
date=1669562213]
you didnt answer his questions boy... you never win any
debate....
go and play COOP its better for all
[/quote]
I answered his 1st question and now it is his order to respond.
Also your community's typical suggestion to play Coop etc is
also against rules so i have to isolate you.
We don't send others to Coop or anywhere and are above Wows
community.
#Post#: 956--------------------------------------------------
Re: Riddle me this
By: wows Date: November 27, 2022, 5:06 pm
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I close this debate with the looser as always the Wows community
I suggest to understand what is a debate. It is not a tweeting
like a bird on a tree but more like a duel that animals to in
the forest. If you think you come to tweet here and then run
away scared without saying anything else then obviously you
lose.
You came to tweet something but you should have come to fight.
Do you understand? I will define one day what is a Debate and
other things but one should understand naturally that a debate
is for sure not a bird song.
Accidentally sometimes people tell creative ideas and your last
sentence was an example. If Wows community hadn't been so afraid
of me then i would have enjoyed that last statement/topic. I
would grade is as TOP 1 best topic so far. But sadly you chose
to give in immediately.
For others i suggest to learn from here that try to understand
what is a debate and which rules it sohuld have. If you think
that it doesn't need any rules and form then let's do by my
rules that i ban you- how would such debating format feel? Not
good? If not good then admit that we need some rules in
debating.
In short, try to understand what is debating, argumentation,
etc.
#Post#: 2205--------------------------------------------------
Re: Riddle me this
By: Hanuman Date: December 27, 2024, 10:30 am
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[quote author=Hugh Jass al Dente link=topic=153.msg940#msg940
date=1669420899]
What makes a player useful for the team and what not.
[/quote]
Why do you ask at all such question? Let's pick any
entertainment team based game which has players from all age
groups and naturally all kind of players, like disability
players, drunk players, etc, like it normally is in life and
entertainments. Can you yourself pick any such game beside Wows?
Maybe a football on a beach, okay? So, you ask what makes beach
footballers and Wows entertainers useful for the entertaining
team?
I ask again first why do you ask such usefullness question? And
what usefullness those entertaining footbalkers and Wows players
have at all? They entertain, right, so what do you mean by
usefulness there? You can imagine that both the footballers and
Wows team members are same persons. Ages 5-75, few drunk ones,
few with disabilities, etc, can you imagine such team? And don't
think naively that such example is not accurate. It is totally
fine example, Wows and beaches have similarly all sort of
players, all should similarly entertain themselves. So what
usefulness you mean there? I don't see any usefulness at all.
So, why you ask such question?
Or you think that Usefullness means skillfullness? Even that is
naive to expect in entertainment, naive and obsessive. How can
you expect from random team based Wows anything like that? It is
not even possible. If you play Clanz game mode then you have the
chance to make teams but even there it is still luck how
everything goes, plus even there it is still entertainment, you
can think of it as football match when you pick your friends to
your team.
If you look Top Youtubers which you surely call Useful then they
are not doing any useful teamwork at all, they ignore if enemy
DD starts to duel alley DD, i have demoed that many times. So,
the concept of Usefullness is very blury anyway.
So, write first yourself an answer to your question, and then
answer my above arguments, specially those which explain that
the Usefullness idea is naive and impossible idea.
Very likely your belief is that useful and good is to do what
wows community does. Like cap obsession in Rankeds, obsessive DD
splits, etc. I have proved that all those things are far from
useful and far from reasonability. Go ahead and lost what is
smart and useful.
I can give you an example that i have not visited Easycaps in
Goldz for 5 years in a row. You believe that is not Useful and
smart, right? I believe the opposite. And we are both in Goldz
for years, so we believe in different things, but both are at
the same league and same level. I ave outplayed plenty of times
Gold members who you believehave higher skilks than me, and
documented that. That should clearly illustrate that your vision
of useful methods is wrong. Hence your all question about
usefullness gets debunked.
I have debunked and outcompeted plenty of years all sort of
players. Recent example was against Devstrike forum, there a
debator tried to demo a better TeamsWR for an evening than mine,
and failed, he made TeamWr ca 70% while mine was ca 80%. Come
and demo ypur skilks anytime if you wish, but as a debate you
clearly lost here. All you usefullness question was debunked.
#Post#: 2206--------------------------------------------------
Re: Riddle me this
By: Hanuman Date: December 27, 2024, 11:49 am
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[quote author=Hugh Jass al Dente link=topic=153.msg940#msg940
date=1669420899]
What is the difference between a 44% player and 64% player.
[/quote]
So, what is your own answer to this question?
I can first give an example answer which contains a real life
demo with real results to your question. The demo was that a
Devstrike debunked 64% TeamsWR player and i as a 44% player
tried who can perform better, and i posted screenshots of the
results. What do you think what the experiment showed? It showed
that the 64% player performed worse than the 44% player. There
are screenshots that prove it, a documented real life
experiment, it demonstrated clearly that 64% player performs
worse than 44% player. What is the difference between those 2
players? Surely the difference is not that 64% performs better,
the experiment clearly debunked it. So, phrase yourself your way
what is the difference then?
Secondly, players don't have ratings. This you cannot comorehend
of course, but you should be intellectually capable to
understand that you should not go to debate against a person
with your believes that the opponent surely don't believe in.
You should not come to talk anything about player rating to me
if you want to succeed. The same is that a christoan should not
go to debate a muslim using words like Pork, Alcohol, and making
statements based on them. Your post is like coming to a muslim
to prove that proteins cure cancer and asking that: which meat
has more proteins, pork or lamb. Do you understand you always
fail if you go to muslim with such pork talk or to me with
illusional ratings talk?
So, i provided an example that proves that the difference
between 64 and 44 is that 44 is better. You surely would deny
such example.
The difference in those 2 average total numbers is in a way
zero, both are equal numbers, both are roughly 50. But this you
can't comprehend. Go ahead and read elsewhere where i have
explained why both are equal. Ask if you don't find anything, or
say what you don't understand. I am matematician myself, i don't
think you could call me having weak math skills or reasoning.
So, you won't succed on debunking the Both Are 50 argument.
One difference between 2 numbers is obsession, one is mentally
more unstable and takes entertainment too seriously. Do you
agree with that? Yes or no? I use terms like Competitive mood
and Entertaining mood. For years when i provided my Rankeds
challenge screenshots, then naturally my TeamsWr was always
60-80%, and like the mentioned recent competition against
debunked lost Devstrike forum where i demoed 75% etc. The
potential or skills is higher in competitive mood, and there is
no need to keep the mood and focusing so high all the times,
even athletes don't during the year. So, 64% players are
mentally just too obsessest, it is a mental illness. But do they
have more potential, more skills, in many cases yes, but not
always, for example look all the facts i provided in this post
that demo how a 44% have more skills and outperforms 64%.
It is just your sick Ego that would like to believe that you as
a 64% TeamsWr player always and always outplayes with any team a
44% player. I have demoed so many times that i outplay and
outdebate 64% players and you, so put your sick Ego lower and
admit that truth, and don't treat people by racist mentality,
specially in entertainments.
Come and prove that players have ratings, and prove that 64
outperforms 44. I have already provided all opposite proves for
years.
#Post#: 2213--------------------------------------------------
Re: Riddle me this
By: Hanuman Date: December 30, 2024, 7:49 am
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[quote author=Hugh Jass al Dente link=topic=153.msg940#msg940
date=1669420899]
Is it rigged that some players have over 60% winrate ?
[/quote]
Most times, yes, it is rigged/fabricated.
High TeamsWR accounts are most times 2nd accounts and hence
don't incluse the learning time spent on the 1st account. Common
sense explains that one cannot enter a new game/business and
instantly succeed there at first steps. And math explains
clearly that averages get stucked.
There are many other manipulations to fabricate higher TeamsWR,
like divisions, current OP ships, etc.
So, thetr surely always is riggedness, fabrication. Answer to
you is shortly Yes.
Secondly, TeamsWR aka Soup Rating is always a soup of many
components, hence misleading. For example our main nazi clan
Yoboy in dept debator is good only at those ships: Cossack, Z42.
And he doesn't play anything else for years. If you think that
he is good with Shima or Yamato, then you are wrong, and his
Soup rating is based on Z42, hence it can't give any info about
his Yamato skills. Therefore all Soup Ratings are not only
rigged, but also misleading. A good Z42 player's soup rating
does not make him good at other ships. Everybody is usually good
in only few ships.
So, why you ask such riggedness question? Obviously it is rigged
and misleading. But also obviously if you have in any ship or in
the overall soup rating a higher value, then you have understood
at least average level playing with few ships, that potential
you have of course, but you don't have potential to win always
or be smarter than everyone, for example a 40% TeamsWR player
can outplaye a 60% one, and not because luck or other delusions,
but because skills. I have demonstrated that truth plenty of
years plenty of times. You must be very delusional if you with
your 60% outplay me who has soup of 40% over all accounts.
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