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       #Post#: 8607--------------------------------------------------
       Israel
   DIR By: guest30
       Date: September 6, 2021, 12:19 pm
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       After having many time researching world political condition, I
       don't think that Israel is the main enemy of the world, I more
       convinced that the real threat to the world is the nations who
       give strong power to Israel, Western European nations, they also
       who persecuted the world for 500 years until now, and their
       economic oppression to the world still continue, and is not
       Israel who do that thing, and discussing how to destroy Western
       European power is more important rather than destroying Israel,
       with Western European nations totally destroyed, Israel will got
       weaken and they no longer a threat anymore to the Arab nation,
       and can be easily defeated
       #Post#: 8622--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Israel
   DIR By: Dazhbog
       Date: September 7, 2021, 11:34 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > the is not Israel who do that thing
       --- End Quote ---
       Throughout history, Jews have exploited and persecuted colonized
       populations on a massive scale. Israel is the Jewish state,
       created to ensure that Jews can continue exploiting and
       persecuting colonized populations with impunity, therefore it is
       indeed Israel who "does that thing."
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > and discussing how to destroy Western European power is more
       important rather than destroying Israel, with Western European
       nations totally destroyed, Israel will got weaken and they no
       longer a threat anymore to the Arab nation, and can be easily
       defeated
       --- End Quote ---
       Duginists, False Left "anti-imperialists" and other faux
       "anti-Zionists" (many of them of course Jews) already promote
       your view aggressively to buy Israel (and Russia) time to
       increase their stockpile of high-tech weaponry while countries
       originally willing to go to war with them exhaust themselves
       elsewhere.
       #Post#: 8625--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Israel
   DIR By: guest30
       Date: September 7, 2021, 11:58 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       @Dazhbog
       --- Quote ---
       > Throughout history, Jews have exploited and persecuted
       colonized populations on a massive scale. Israel is the Jewish
       state, created to ensure that Jews can continue exploiting and
       persecuting colonized populations with impunity, therefore it is
       indeed Israel who "does that thing."
       --- End Quote ---
       Throughout history, "White European" and "European Jewish"
       people have exploited and persecuted colonized populations on a
       massive scale. the result of Western European colonialism is
       also Israel, the Jewish state, created to ensure that Jews can
       continue exploiting and persecuting colonized populations with
       impunity, therefore it is indeed Israel who "does that thing",
       and also Western Europe.
       Don't forget and pretend to not remember that Western Europe
       colonize and enslave the world too, you want to be a "white"
       apologist?
       --- Quote ---
       > Duginists, False Left "anti-imperialists" and other faux
       "anti-Zionists" (many of them of course Jews) already promote
       your view aggressively to buy Israel (and Russia) time to
       increase their stockpile of high-tech weaponry while countries
       originally willing to go to war with them exhaust themselves
       elsewhere.
       --- End Quote ---
       And they are think correctly that Western European and nations
       of Anglophile, the nations who give Israel power to continue
       their colonial rule are the big problem of the world, not
       Israel, even after Western European nations destroyed first, we
       can defeat easily Israel which have small size of territory even
       tough they have more advanced weapon, just need many casualties
       to defeat the swindlers of the world
       #Post#: 8641--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Israel
   DIR By: Dazhbog
       Date: September 8, 2021, 7:24 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > Throughout history, "White European" (including Russian) and
       "European (including Russian) Jewish" people have exploited and
       persecuted colonized populations on a massive scale.
       --- End Quote ---
       /fixed
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > the result of Russian and Western European colonialism is also
       Israel
       --- End Quote ---
       /fixed
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > therefore it is indeed Israel who "does that thing", and also
       Western Europe, as well as Russia.
       --- End Quote ---
       /fixed
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > even after Western European nations destroyed first, we can
       defeat easily Israel which have small size of territory even
       tough they have more advanced weapon, just need many casualties
       to defeat the swindlers of the world
       --- End Quote ---
       Even assuming that Israel itself can be defeated as easily as
       you say...
       1. ...Israel and international Jewry might still covertly
       support whatever country you attack first to the extent that you
       either can't win or that you aren't able to attack Israel
       afterwards.
       2. ...Israel might enlist the support of Russia, which
       predictably doesn't figure as a potential enemy in your
       calculations, in case you are actually able to attack.
       3. ...the Zionists might move their center of power to Russia,
       so that even Israel's defeat won't end Zionism.
       #Post#: 8657--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Israel
   DIR By: guest30
       Date: September 9, 2021, 1:45 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       @Dazhbog
       --- Quote ---
       > the result of Russian and Western European colonialism is also
       Israel
       --- End Quote ---
       It was Anglo nation British (United Kingdom) who played the big
       part on creating Israel, Soviet Russia, like China just
       recognize Israel, but gradually hostile to them after several
       years during Cold War era, if you blame Russia for participate
       in creating Israel, blame to China also...
       --- Quote ---
       > therefore it is indeed Israel who "does that thing", and also
       Western Europe, as well as Russia.
       --- End Quote ---
       If you not want to open your mind to fact that Russia already
       renounced their colonial policy during Communist era, then I can
       say that you are deliberately ignorant and just want to slander
       Russia with many ways possible whether your slander is based on
       fact or just your opinion
       --- Quote ---
       > 2. ...Israel might enlist the support of Russia, which
       predictably doesn't figure as a potential enemy in your
       calculations, in case you are actually able to attack.
       --- End Quote ---
       Israel also can enlist the support from any nation which not
       have strong anti-Israel sentiment, even tough they are nation
       which geographically not from Europe, nation like Singapore,
       Japan, South Korea, and Taiwan even have no problem with working
       with Israel, the solution is, spread to the world the danger of
       Western European nations and also Israel, and what benefit if we
       destroy them both, if we can say that thing to world community,
       even Russia will reluctant to support Israel and keep against
       Western European nations
       --- Quote ---
       > 3. ...the Zionists might move their center of power to Russia,
       so that even Israel's defeat won't end Zionism.
       --- End Quote ---
       Zionist can move their center of power to everywhere, don't just
       point to Russia, so, the solution is, spread to the nation of
       the world about the danger of Zionism, and tell them the benefit
       if they oppose Zionism, and it can be sure that the whole nation
       of the world will reject them if the Zionist people move their
       power to their land, but such proposal and appeal did not
       succeed to Western European and Anglo nations, because they are
       heavily got benefit from work with Zionist people, so not
       surprise if many of Western European and Anglo nations, even
       almost all of them not recognize Palestine
       #Post#: 8690--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Israel
   DIR By: Dazhbog
       Date: September 10, 2021, 4:17 pm
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > if you blame Russia for participate in creating Israel, blame
       to China also...
       --- End Quote ---
       This is how Russia reacted to the creation of Israel:
  HTML https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_Declaration_of_Independence#Aftermath
       --- Quote ---
       > The Soviet Union was the first nation to fully recognize
       Israel de jure on 17 May 1948
       --- End Quote ---
       This is how China reacted:
  HTML https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Arab%E2%80%93Israeli_War#First_phase:_15_May_%E2%80%93_11_June_1948
       --- Quote ---
       > Although the Arab invasion was denounced by the United States,
       the Soviet Union, and UN secretary-general Trygve Lie, it found
       support from the Republic of China and other UN member states.
       --- End Quote ---
       See the difference?
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > the solution is, spread to the world the danger of Western
       European nations and also Israel, and what benefit if we destroy
       them both, if we can say that thing to world community
       --- End Quote ---
       Russia-Israel relations already are mutually beneficial,
       therefore Russia is unlikely to turn against Israel on these
       grounds.
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > Zionist can move their center of power to everywhere, don't
       just point to Russia
       --- End Quote ---
       To not be exposed, they will have to settle in a country with a
       "white" majority in order to blend in with the rest of the
       population. In your setting, the EU/NATO- and
       Anglosphere-countries are scheduled for destruction. This leaves
       only Russia (and maybe some other Turandom-countries).
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > but such proposal and appeal did not succeed to Western
       European and Anglo nations, because they are heavily got benefit
       from work with Zionist people
       --- End Quote ---
       Why are you so confident it will work with Russia then?
       #Post#: 8716--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Israel
   DIR By: guest30
       Date: September 11, 2021, 12:25 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       @Dazhbog
       --- Quote ---
       > This is how Russia reacted to the creation of Israel:
       >
       >
  HTML https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_Declaration_of_Independence#Aftermath
       >
       > [quote]The Soviet Union was the first nation to fully
       recognize Israel de jure on 17 May 1948
       --- End Quote ---
       [/quote]
       And also, Soviet Union recognize Palestine, still not worse than
       nations of Anglophile
       --- Quote ---
       > This is how China reacted:
       >
       >
  HTML https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Arab%E2%80%93Israeli_War#First_phase:_15_May_%E2%80%93_11_June_1948
       >
       > [quote]Although the Arab invasion was denounced by the United
       States, the Soviet Union, and UN secretary-general Trygve Lie,
       it found support from the Republic of China and other UN member
       states.
       --- End Quote ---
       See the difference?[/quote]
       The difference is clear, United States denounce Arab invasion of
       Israel, and later on mid 1950s, Soviet Union assist Arab
       invasion of Israel, and when United States and Western European
       nations had an attempt to against Israel, until recent time,
       they still not just only recognize Israel, but give endless aid
       to Israel
       --- Quote ---
       > Russia-Israel relations already are mutually beneficial,
       therefore Russia is unlikely to turn against Israel on these
       grounds.
       --- End Quote ---
       United States, Western European nations-Israel relations already
       are mutually beneficial, therefore they are unlikely to turn
       against Israel on these grounds, contrary to what you all
       "Aryanism" people promise.
       The difference between how Western European and Anglo nations
       support Israel and how Russia support Israel are, the former
       also imposed the Israel's pro-Western European and United States
       policy and their oppressive capitalistic economic system to the
       rest of the world, and Russia just keep their supporting
       Israel's policy to themselves, so Russia is not really want to
       against Israel, but they are not harmful to the rest of the
       world
       --- Quote ---
       > [quote]but such proposal and appeal did not succeed to Western
       European and Anglo nations, because they are heavily got benefit
       from work with Zionist people
       --- End Quote ---
       Why are you so confident it will work with Russia then?[/quote]
       Because to convince them was more easy than we convince Western
       European nations to against Israel, just remind them that
       Western European and Anglo nations many times send their
       military troops near Russian border to prepare to attack them is
       because that is what Israel wants, to wipe out Putin's
       government and reimplemented capitalist debt-based economic
       system which created by Jewish Western European elite people who
       called themselves as "Rotschild family", Israel want Russia to
       be controlled again by them
       #Post#: 8738--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Israel
   DIR By: Dazhbog
       Date: September 11, 2021, 6:48 pm
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > United States, Western European nations-Israel relations
       already are mutually beneficial
       --- End Quote ---
       No, they are not. From your own post:
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > they still not just only recognize Israel, but give endless
       aid to Israel
       --- End Quote ---
       As far as I know, the states in question do not endlessly get
       anything in return. Therefore, their relationship with Israel is
       not mutually beneficial.
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > Because to convince them was more easy
       --- End Quote ---
       Convincing Russia to side with Israel is just as easy, as Russia
       just opportunistically pursues its own interests.
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > just remind them that Western European and Anglo nations many
       times send their military troops near Russian border to prepare
       to attack them is because that is what Israel wants, to wipe out
       Putin's government
       --- End Quote ---
       Putin's Russia is a staunch ally of Israel:
  HTML https://trueleft.createaforum.com/enemies/duginism/?message=7939
       Why would Israel want to wipe out his government?
       #Post#: 8742--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Israel
   DIR By: guest30
       Date: September 12, 2021, 12:26 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       @Dazhbog
       --- Quote ---
       > As far as I know, the states in question do not endlessly get
       anything in return. Therefore, their relationship with Israel is
       not mutually beneficial.
       --- End Quote ---
       They are gain benefit each other, see this information below :
       Corporate exchange
       Several regional America–Israel Chambers of Commerce exist to
       facilitate expansion by Israeli and American companies into each
       other's markets.[186] American companies such as Motorola, IBM,
       Microsoft and Intel chose Israel to establish major R&D centers.
       Israel has more companies listed on the NASDAQ than any country
       outside North America.
       "Military bases
       The United States maintains six War Reserve Stocks inside
       Israel, at Airwing 7 air base and maintains some $300 million in
       military equipment at these sites. The equipment is owned by the
       United States and is for use by American forces in the Middle
       East, but can also be transferred to Israeli use during a time
       of crisis. The United States is also alleged to keep fighter and
       bomber aircraft at these sites, and one of the bases is thought
       to contain a 500-bed hospital for US Marines and Special
       Forces.[188][189] According to the American military journalist
       and commentator William Arkin in his book Code Names, the US has
       prepositioned in at least six sites in Israel, munitions,
       vehicles, and military equipment, and even a 500-bed hospital,
       for use by US Marines, Special Forces, and Air Force fighter and
       bomber aircraft in a wartime contingency in the Middle East.[8]
       Arkin in his book writes that some of the sites are located at
       Ben Gurion Airport, Nevatim, Ovda air base, and in Herzliya
       Pituah. The sites are numbered as "site 51," "site 53," "site
       54," "site 55" and "site 56." Some of the depots are
       underground, others were built as open hangars. According to
       Arkin, site 51 holds ammunition and equipment in underground
       depots. Site 53 is munitions storage and war reserve vehicles at
       Israeli Air Force bases, site 54 is an emergency military
       hospital near Tel Aviv with 500 beds, and sites 55 and 56 are
       ammunition depots.[190] However, Israel is not the only country
       in the Middle East to host US military bases; there are American
       facilities in Turkey, Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia (mostly
       withdrawn from in 2003), Oman, and the Persian Gulf states of
       Kuwait, Bahrain (headquarters of the United States Fifth Fleet),
       Qatar, and the United Arab Emirates. The Bahrain headquarters of
       the United States Fifth Fleet is meant to act as a watchdog and
       deterrent to potential Iranian aggression in the Persian Gulf
       region.[8]
       The Israeli Mediterranean Port of Haifa hosts regular visits by
       navy vessels of the United States Sixth Fleet, which is
       headquartered in Naples, Italy.[191]
       The Dimona Radar Facility is an American radar facility in the
       Negev desert of Israel, located near Dimona. The facility has
       two 120-metre (400-foot) radar towers designed to track
       ballistic missiles through space and provide ground-based
       missiles with the targeting data needed to intercept them. It
       can detect missiles up to 2,400 kilometres (1,500 miles) away.
       The facility is owned and operated by the US military, and
       provides only second-hand intelligence to Israel. The towers of
       the facility are the tallest radar towers in the world, and the
       tallest towers in Israel."
       Source :
  HTML https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel%E2%80%93United_States_relations#Missile_defense_program
       --- Quote ---
       > Convincing Russia to side with Israel is just as easy, as
       Russia just opportunistically pursues its own interests.
       --- End Quote ---
       As long as they not doing anything to harm and oppress another
       nation like what Western European nations do, I have no problem,
       Russia cooperate with Israel, but never harm and invade enemies
       of Israel, so that cooperation is less a bad thing than how
       Western European and Anglo nations cooperate with Israel, and
       even Russia's Gross Domestic Product (GDP) economy not
       sufficient enough to build their massive military power if
       Russia assist Israel to war against their enemies, they (Russia)
       only have 2 trillion US Dollars annually
       --- Quote ---
       > [quote]just remind them that Western European and Anglo
       nations many times send their military troops near Russian
       border to prepare to attack them is because that is what Israel
       wants, to wipe out Putin's government
       --- End Quote ---
       Putin's Russia is a staunch ally of Israel:
  HTML https://trueleft.createaforum.com/enemies/duginism/?message=7939
       Why would Israel want to wipe out his government?[/quote]
       Anglo and Western European nations who want to harm Russia more
       than Israel, even I talk about how they, not Israel, try
       everything to harm Russia, if you dislike the nation who are
       ally to Israel, hate South Korea, Japan, Taiwan, Vietnam,
       Singapore, India, and also Saudi Arabia too, they got much
       benefit from Israel and don't have any strong reason to against
       them, and... dislike Indonesia under Suharto leadership too
       Suharto work secretly with Israel :
       "Yes, October 16, 1993, Israeli Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin
       came to Jakarta, after previously making diplomatic visits to
       China and Singapore. Yitzhak Rabin is not kidding, he carries
       out an important mission for the Israeli government, to carry
       out a special lobby with the Indonesian government.
       About a decade earlier, in the early 1980s, the Indonesian
       government purchased more than 30 skyhawk aircraft from Israel.
       This buying process is carried out in a secret operation called
       Operation Alpha.
       This operation was an intelligence operation, because at that
       time Indonesia needed sophisticated aircraft from Israel, with
       the latest technology. Meanwhile, the government of this country
       does not have official diplomatic relations with Israel."
       Source :
  HTML https://republika.co.id/berita/qco36w320/kerjasama-gelap-soeharto-dengan-isrel-dan-dialog-gus-dur
       And, if seeing the reality that Russia was reluctantly to
       against Israel, then find another nation who want to contribute
       to against Israel, but I am more prefer to destroy the nations
       who are being the sources of Israel power, the Western European
       and Anglo nations
       #Post#: 8745--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Israel
   DIR By: Dazhbog
       Date: September 12, 2021, 6:47 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > They are gain benefit each other, see this information below
       --- End Quote ---
       From your own post:
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > However, Israel is not the only country in the Middle East to
       host US military bases; there are American facilities in Turkey,
       Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia (mostly withdrawn from in 2003),
       Oman, and the Persian Gulf states of Kuwait, Bahrain
       (headquarters of the United States Fifth Fleet), Qatar, and the
       United Arab Emirates. The Bahrain headquarters of the United
       States Fifth Fleet is meant to act as a watchdog and deterrent
       to potential Iranian aggression in the Persian Gulf region.
       --- End Quote ---
       In other words, America doesn't benefit from their cooperation
       with Israel any more than from their cooperation with other
       countries (including anti-Israel ones like Turkey).
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > Russia cooperate with Israel, but never harm and invade
       enemies of Israel
       --- End Quote ---
       Any kind of cooperation with Israel harms the enemies of Israel,
       as it perpetuates Israel's existence.
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > Russia's Gross Domestic Product (GDP) economy not sufficient
       enough to build their massive military power if Russia assist
       Israel to war against their enemies
       --- End Quote ---
       Russia's weak economy doesn't change the fact that they have one
       of the world's largest stockpiles of WMDs, as well as a well
       oiled military industrial complex.
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > Anglo and Western European nations who want to harm Russia
       more than Israel, even I talk about how they, not Israel, try
       everything to harm Russia
       --- End Quote ---
       So you admit that Israel isn't anti-Russian.
       --- Quote from: kameradbaren link ---
       > Suharto work secretly with Israel
       --- End Quote ---
       I praised Suharto for his anti-colonialist and anti-communist
       effort. I never said that he was particularly anti-Israel.
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