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       #Post#: 7867--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Paganism
       By: guest28 Date: August 3, 2021, 8:02 pm
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       Yes I am well aware that the Asatru kind are rather exclusive
       for those of European descent but I have never thought the Troth
       was universalist.
       What would be your opinion on lets say Mexicans wanting to
       revive Aztec paganism and veneration of the Nahua gods for
       Mexicans and only Mexicans? Would be you opposed to them
       reviving their ethnic religion for their ethnic people? I do
       understand the point of Europeans only worshiping the gods that
       European because if a non-European were to worship that European
       god like odin then it would simply be a weird site to see. I
       have seen arguments of modern day neo-pagans saying that only
       Mexicans should be able to worship their gods and the same goes
       for Europeans worshipping their own gods.
       #Post#: 7868--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Paganism
       By: guest28 Date: August 3, 2021, 8:05 pm
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       "This is simply incorrect. It is very common to find old
       national socialists including Hitler saying Shinto is Japanese
       National Socialism."
       This is true actually on Shintoism being a form of Japanese
       National Socialism. Shinto is an ethnic exclusive faith, i.e. to
       the Japanese because the faith was formed out of the natural
       formation of the Japanese. But this isn't to say that a
       non-Japanese can be inspired by it because according to Sokyo
       Ono, he does affirm it is an ethnic faith but at the same time
       he also acknowledges the "universal" inspirational aspects of
       it.
       #Post#: 7876--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Paganism
       By: Cthens Date: August 4, 2021, 12:16 am
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       [quote author=HookedCross link=topic=873.msg7867#msg7867
       date=1628038938]
       Yes I am well aware that the Asatru kind are rather exclusive
       for those of European descent but I have never thought the Troth
       was universalist.
       What would be your opinion on lets say Mexicans wanting to
       revive Aztec paganism and veneration of the Nahua gods for
       Mexicans and only Mexicans? Would be you opposed to them
       reviving their ethnic religion for their ethnic people? I do
       understand the point of Europeans only worshiping the gods that
       European because if a non-European were to worship that European
       god like odin then it would simply be a weird site to see. I
       have seen arguments of modern day neo-pagans saying that only
       Mexicans should be able to worship their gods and the same goes
       for Europeans worshipping their own gods.
       [/quote]
       This forces me to concede to SirGalahad. If it is that slippery
       of a slope to fall into tribalism than maybe just throw it out.
       I live in the shadow of the mogollon rim in Arizona, I have a
       deep history here and in the old world. None of our ancestors
       worth anything told people they couldn't worship "our' gods. The
       sun god whether his name was in Uto-Aztecan or Egyptian shines
       on anyone willing to receive its light.
       If worshipping our ancestors and their gods make us tribalist
       than destroy it. It is worth nothing further.
       #Post#: 28745--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Hitler: The Face of Anti-Tribalism
       By: antihellenistic Date: November 21, 2024, 8:27 pm
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Odin Paganism and Dualism Root on Hitler's Worldview
       [quote]Hitler insisted that the National Socialist Swastika be
       right-handed, which would symbolise ‘decline and death’. Odin is
       the God of death, and Rudolf Jung confirms that the National
       Socialist God is Odin. So it makes perfect sense why Hitler
       chose the right-handed version of the Swastika: it represented
       his God. The Swastika is Odin’s symbol. Videla, in his book on
       National Socialist philosophy, says that the National Socialists
       made ‘struggle’ into a law: the ‘Law of Struggle’. He also says
       that the Swastika was the representation of this Law of
       Struggle. “The great symbol of Nazism was interpreted with the
       analogy of a world in movement and constant becoming due to the
       indefatigable nature of life-as-struggle.” “The Aryan spirit
       does not know a perfect world. The world is more like a wheel
       that turns on itself, symbolised by the swastika.” So, the
       Swastika is the symbol of Odin, and also ‘struggle’. War,
       struggle, death. Well, what was Hitler about? War, struggle and
       death! The amount of times Hitler said the words “battle”
       (Minute 00:06:51 until 00:08:02)
       Battle and struggle are integral to National Socialism, and
       Hitler says these terms thousands of times in Mein Kampf, his
       speeches, and elsewhere. We’d be here for weeks if we were to
       read all the quotes. But let’s just give a few examples: “I
       would like to thank Providence and the Almighty for choosing me
       of all people to be allowed to wage this battle for Germany.” In
       other words: ‘Thank you Odin, God of War, for allowing me to
       wage this battle’. Elsewhere: “Our entire struggle is a battle
       for the soul of our people. It is further a structure, a
       structure consisting of those minds who are the bearers of our
       worldview and who will be the foundation of the new state.”
       ‘Struggle is a battle for the soul of the German people, whose
       God is Odin.’ And perhaps most tellingly: “We are not pacifists,
       for we know that the father of all things is combat and
       struggle.” ... this particular quote is otherwise attributed to
       the Ancient Greek philosopher Heraclitus who said that “change
       is the father of all things”, and there’s definitely a link
       there. But ‘change’ is also Hegel’s ‘Aufheben’, which Videla
       said before means a “world in movement and constant becoming”.
       Aufheben and ‘change’ is struggle and revolution. Hitler, of
       course, was all about struggle and revolution, so it’s all tied
       together with him, but also Odin.
       (Minute 00:08:24 until 00:10:13)
       Adolf Hitler himself became a big proponent of WEL. In fact,
       Hitler planned to build a planetarium in Linz where a whole
       floor would be dedicated to Hörbiger’s theory. He is also known
       to have suggested that the World Ice Theory could one day
       replace Christianity.” “The Welteislehre provided an Aryan
       alternative to the ‘dreadful and mistaken’ ‘Jewish theories’ of
       scientists like Einstein.” “Invented by the Austrian scientist
       and philosopher Hanns Horbiger, World Ice Theory was inspired by
       a dream in which Horbiger found himself floating in space,
       observing a giant pendulum swinging back and forth, growing ever
       longer and eventually breaking. When he woke Horbiger claimed to
       know intuitively that the sun's gravitational pull ceased to
       exert any force at three times the distance of Neptune and that
       most of the physical universe could be explained through the
       interplay of the 'antagonistic Ur-substances of ice and fire'.”
       “According to Hörbiger, the prime matter of the universe was
       ice. Cosmic ice threaded its way through the cosmos; the Milky
       Way and every planetary body, with the exception of the Earth,
       was sheathed in ice. But this cosmic frost waged perpetual war
       with gigantic, fiery suns. Every body in the universe was drawn
       into the perpetual struggle between fire and ice and new planets
       were formed from the debris of catastrophe and collision.
       Bigger, more powerful bodies like the Earth ensnared smaller
       moons in ever-decreasing orbital cycles and the eventual
       collisions generated floods, earthquakes and volcanic eruptions.
       According to Hörbiger, Mondniederbrüche (‘moon breakdown’)
       explained the extinction of the dinosaurs, the biblical flood
       and the destruction of Atlantis. The few survivors fled to form
       ‘asylum’ or ‘refuge’ cultures in Mexico and South America.”
       (Minute 00:13:40 until 00:15:40)
       “ 'I tend to support World Ice Theory,' Hitler declared in 1942.
       Horbiger's  theory was convincing, the Fuhrer suggested, in
       proving that icy moons had crashed into Earth, creating
       geophysical forces that caused a flood from which only 'a few
       humans hadsurvived'... 'In all the human traditions,' Hitler
       continued, 'one finds mention of a huge cosmic disaster... In
       the Nordic legend we read of a struggle between giants and gods.
       In my view,the thing is explicable only [based on] the
       hypothesis of a disaster that completely destroyed a humanity
       which already possessed a high degree of civilization.' ” And
       probably related to this idea, Hitler also said: “All that’s
       left is to prove that in nature there is no frontier between the
       organic and the inorganic. When understanding of the universe
       has become widespread, when the majority of men know that the
       stars are not sources of light but worlds, perhaps inhabited
       worlds like ours, then the Christian doctrine will be convicted
       of absurdity.”
       (Minute 00:15:45 until 00:16:54)[/quote]
       Source :
       TIKHistory. (2024). The God Behind Hitler's National Socialism.
       Accessed on 22 November 2024, from :
  HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xW_-4yTnPY
       1. Adolf Hitler, 21 August 1927, "Collection of Speeches
       1922-1945," p69.
       2. Adolf Hitler, 18 January 1927, "Collection of Speeches
       1922-1945," p64.
       3. Videla, "National Socialism: Its Principles and Philosophy,"
       p47.
       4. Magee, "Hegel and the Hermetic Tradition," p154-155. Peikoff,
       "Heraclitus of Ephesus: A World of Change and Contradiction by
       Leonard Peikoff, part 3 of 50," 11 Feb 2021
  HTML https://youtu.be/CP2RH9IZnXk?si=RO3okHEeOXOqxCct
       5. Hale, "Himmler's Crusade," ebook p180.
       6. Kurlander, "Hitler's Monsters," Kindle Introduction, p29.
       7. Hale. "Himmler's Crusade." ebook p179.
       8. Kurlander, "Hitler's Monsters," Kindle Introduction, p150.
       9. Adolf Hitler, 14 October 1941, quoted from "Hitler's Table
       Talks," p23.
       Therefore, Hitler's worldview was totally against the
       Fundamental Western Worldview of In-World Spirit and Gratitude
       #Post#: 28746--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Paganism
       By: 90sRetroFan Date: November 21, 2024, 10:31 pm
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       "Paganism and Dualism Root"
       There is no such thing. Pagans are never dualists and dualists
       are never pagans.
       "Fundamental Western Worldview of In-World Spirit and Gratitude"
       You have totally misunderstood. There are two types of
       gratitude. There is the delusional gratitude for illusory peace,
       and there is the barbaric gratitude for the (accurately
       perceived) true nature of worldly existence which is perpetual
       conflict.
       We oppose both. We (unlike the barbarians) want peace, but
       (unlike the deluded) accept that lasting peace is impossible in
       the material world, and thus our mission is to eliminate
       everyone who remains attached to the material world for either
       barbaric reasons (they positively enjoy conflict) or delusional
       reasons (they think lasting peace in the material world is
       possible), or mixtures of the two (e.g. while neither enjoying
       conflict nor believing in the possibility of lasting peace,
       think the times of peace are worth the times of conflict). This
       is the struggle.
       What your quoted article is trying to do is interpret Hitler as
       a barbarian, and hence as advocating merely paganism.
       [quote]“The Aryan spirit does not know a perfect world.[/quote]
       Of course we know it. It is because we know it that we realize
       how bad this world is in comparison!
       [quote]Battle and struggle are integral to National
       Socialism[/quote]
       Yes, but not because we enjoy it. It is integral because our
       barbaric enemies enjoy it, and we will not defeat them by
       delusionally pretending they actually don't.
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