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       #Post#: 24586--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Islamic Golden Age - Philosophy and Humanities
       By: rp Date: December 26, 2023, 12:21 am
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       I agree. The "Golden Age" (by which we mean the study of and
       development upon Greek writings) alone cannot be attributed to
       Turanian blood. It is merely the consequence of an advanced
       literate society (Persia) gaining access to knowledge that they
       previously did not have. I would even go so far as to say it is
       not bad in and of itself. The specific types of developments
       that are made (i.e. Aristotelian) are what matters.
       #Post#: 24741--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Islamic Golden Age - Philosophy and Humanities
       By: rp Date: January 8, 2024, 2:51 pm
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       [quote author=90sRetroFan link=topic=417.msg24149#msg24149
       date=1701069385]
       But are you saying that they had these views because of contact
       with Western ideas.? If so, you should at least include the part
       of the enemy article which mentions Aristotle:
       [quote]Ibn Khaldun also wrote: “Therefore, the Negro nations
       are, as a rule, submissive to slavery, because Negroes have
       little that is human and have attributes that are quite similar
       to those of dumb animals.” Khaldun could have been quoting
       Aristotle, who wrote that “[B]it is clear that there are certain
       people who are free and certain who are slaves by nature,[/B]
       and it is both to their advantage, and just, for them to be
       slaves.” Aristotle also likened slaves to animals, calling the
       ox the poor man’s slave.[/quote]
       [/quote]
       But wait, as Aryanists, don't we agree with the part in bold?
       The only difference is that we would say this necessitates those
       individuals to be prohibited from reproducing, unlike Aristotle
       who would justify their enslavement and hence not seek to
       prevent their reproduction (sustainable evil).
       #Post#: 24745--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Islamic Golden Age - Philosophy and Humanities
       By: 90sRetroFan Date: January 8, 2024, 5:21 pm
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       Hence:
       [quote]Aristotle, who wrote that “it is clear that there are
       certain people who are free and certain who are slaves by
       nature, and it is both to their advantage, and just, for them to
       be slaves.”[/quote]
       To be more precise, however, we would add a category of people
       who are naturally inclined to enslave others. Aristotle himself
       would belong in this category. Our position is that this
       category must be prohibited from reproducing first.
       #Post#: 25274--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Islamic Golden Age - Philosophy and Humanities
       By: antihellenistic Date: March 1, 2024, 4:57 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Root of Iran's Racial Discrimination during the Ancient Time
       The answer is obvious :
       Rotten culture of Eurocentrism
       [quote]Among the sources surveyed here, Nizami is unique in
       crediting Alexander the Great with "inventing" slavery by
       branding the Ethiopians as slaves. The episode in Sharafnamah
       details the war between Alexander (here a follower of the
       monotheistic Faith of Abraham) and heathen blacks composed of
       Ethiopians, Nubians, and the Zanj. Having defeated the black
       host, Alexander brands the Ethiopians as slaves and massacres
       the rest.51
       One episode near the conclusion of Darahnamah especially
       reflects the Iranian feeling of superiority over blacks.
       "Alexander in the Country of Egypt and the Land of Maghrib"
       contains a battle against the uncivilized (vahshi) Zanj, who are
       mystified by the bows and arrows Alexander's men use. Having
       suffered some casualties, the Zanj retreat. "We saw a short
       stick with an iron point," they complain to their king, "which
       they would suddenly throw at us and it would, without leave,
       enter our bodies and at once kill us." The king examines one of
       the arrows and failing to throw it more than a few yards
       concludes that the invaders work the arrows through sorcery (II,
       565). The king is taken captive and brought before Alexander:
       Alexander looked and saw a man large-limbed and black, wearing
       red breeches, iron bracelets, a golden torque around his neck,
       and ankle-rings like a camel's .... (II, 566)
       "He resembles anything but a king," Alexander says
       contemptuously, concluding that the man is destitute--why else
       would he go about naked? Learning that the king is very rich,
       Alexander demands a huge war tribute. The black king removes his
       ankle-rings and places them before Alexander, as guarantee that
       he will return with the booty. "That is some guarantee!"
       Alexander laughs. "Unless I wear these ankle-rings no one will
       call me king or will obey me," the king explains (II, 567-68).
       The king is further ridiculed when he reappears later and jumps
       up and down before Alexander "as children jump." Not recognizing
       him, Alexander takes him for a mad man or a clown, until he is
       told "that man is the king, and he has never honored anyone to
       the degree that he has been honoring you" (II, 568).
       ...
       While histories and travels report that the Zanj eat each other,
       most literary sources picture them eating white people.
       Cannibalism is not mentioned in Firdawsi's Habash episode (c.
       1010). About 200 years after Firdawsi, however, cannibalism
       becomes a prominent vice in Nizami's blacks in Sharafnamah
       (1191). Here an army of Nubians, Ethiopians, and the Zanj attack
       the Egyptians, who ask Alexander to come to their rescue. The
       Zanj chief, who kills Alexander's messenger and drinks his blood
       (p. 102), rules an army of "man eaters and man tormentors,"
       "vipers who injure mankind." "The Zanj are not human, but verily
       the devil [ahriman]" (p. 105). Heathens as well as cannibals,
       the blacks suffer defeat at the hand of Alexander, "The Defender
       of the Faith" (p. 96). Alexander massacres the black host,
       except for the Ethiopians, whom he brands as slaves (pp.
       131-32).
       Battle against the infidel cannibal Zanj is prominent also in
       Darabnamah, in the protagonists' adventures in the Sea of Oman
       and its coastal areas (I, 63-145; II, 253-73), in Zangbar and
       its nearby islands (II, 400-44), and in Egypt and the Land of
       Maghreb, i.e., Morocco (II, 554-69). As in Nizami, the
       protagonists are believers (Alexander is a Muslim here), enjoy
       God's protection, and achieve victory through divine
       intervention (e.g., I, 113; II, 270). When the Zanj devour some
       2,000 of Alexander's men, he continues to press his men on, "for
       we are in the right and they in the wrong" (II, 256). When
       victory is won, God, not man, is credited with the achievement
       (II., 259). The Zanj, who refuse to accept Islam, are put to the
       sword (II, 271ff.). In another episode, the Zanj pretend to
       accept Islam and are massacred when this falsehood is
       discovered. Alexander views their dead bodies and offers many
       thanks to God (II, 412).
       In Iskandarnamah, the war against the Zanj begins when Alexander
       goes to the rescue of a devout pious people who owe an annual
       tribute of 1,000 men to the cannibal Zanj, who eat the men. A
       Muslim in this romance also, Alexander fights the Zanj, bearing
       an amulet containing the names of God. The war against the
       formidable Zanj is long and hard (321-44, 420-96, 512-50,
       566-68, 588-89, 668-71, 684-93, 697-700, 739-40). God gives
       Alexander encouragement and even tactical advice through dreams
       and through an angel. "[The Zanj] are all enemies of God, and
       mankind is tortured by them. Killing them is considered penance
       for sins," the angel tells Alexander (p. 337. See also p. 512).
       It is God's will that the world be rid of them and their
       progeny.
       In addition to being accused of eating whites, in the literary
       sources blacks are also charged with kidnapping whites. In
       Iskandarnamah, black men abduct white princesse or maidens (pp.
       340-44 and 415-17) either for themselves, or for their king's
       harem. [/quote]
       Source :
       Minoo Southgate. (1984). The Negative Images of Blacks in Some
       Medieval Iranian Writings. Iranian Studies, 17(1), 3–36.
  HTML http://www.jstor.org/stable/4310424
       #Post#: 27492--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Islamic Golden Age - Philosophy and Humanities
       By: antihellenistic Date: August 21, 2024, 9:29 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Western Progressivism in the Islamic Caliphate was not made by
       Muslims, but by ancient Jewish and Christian intellectuals who
       lived in the Muslim World. Therefore, the Golden Age was not
       part of Islamic element
       [quote]The “Islamic scholars” who translated “ancient Greece’s
       natural philosophy” were a curious group of Muslims, since all
       or almost all of the translators from Greek to Arabic were
       Christians or Jews, as were the translators from Arabic to
       Latin. Consider the astonishing statement of Bernard Lewis in
       The Muslim Discovery of Europe:
       We know of no Muslim scholar or man of letters before the
       eighteenth century who sought to learn a western language, still
       less of any attempt to produce grammars, dictionaries, or other
       language tools. Translations are few and far between. Those that
       are known are works chosen for practical purposes [philosophy
       being considered a practical discipline] and the translations
       are made by converts [who knew western languages before
       conversion] or non-Muslims.
       According to Franz Rosenthal in The Classical Heritage in Islam,
       “Almost all of the translators [from Greek into Syriac or Hebrew
       or from Greek, Syriac, or Hebrew into Arabic] were Christians.”
       One possible exception is Masarjawaih, who may have been a Jew.
       Another is Thabit b. Qurrah (ca. 834-901 A.D.), a “heathen”
       Sabian from Harran.
       Similarly, “Aristoteles latinus” by Bernard Dod, a chapter of
       The Cambridge History of Later Medieval Philosophy, provides a
       comprehensive list of medieval translations of Aristotle from
       Arabic into Latin, none by Islamic scholars—unless by “Islamic”
       one means “Christian or Jewish.”
       ...
       Were not Avicenna and Averroes great? Great they were, and
       philosophers too, but not exactly Islamic ones.
       Islamic philosophy is a misnomer; at least, what we in the West
       think of as Islamic philosophy is. It is not Islamic in the
       sense of being rooted in Islam or even in the weaker sense of
       being melded to it. It is based rather on those vaunted
       translations from Greek and has a higher allegiance to
       Neoplatonism than to Islam. It considered philosophy the highest
       expression of truth, available only to the wisest, and Islam a
       lower expression suitable for the masses. It believed that the
       Koran is temporal, not eternal, and that God knows only
       universals, not particulars. In short, it was in opposition to
       what we and most Muslims think of as Islam.
       In A History of Islamic Societies (Cambridge University Press,
       2002), Ira M. Lapidus, Professor Emeritus at Berkeley, a mild
       and genial apologist for Islam, admits that
       [Islamic] philosophers did not truly reconcile Greek thought to
       Islam; rather, they tried to rationalize their acceptance of
       Greek philosophy in terms of Islam. Their metaphysical and
       religious mentality was based on Greek opinions rather than
       Quranic tradition. Philosophy, they thought, was a higher
       vision, superior to the revealed but inferior version of truth
       known as Islam.
       They were “remote from the mainstream of Islamic religious and
       cultural trends.”
       ...
       To elevate Islam, Maziak even caricatures medieval Christianity.
       in Science of medieval Christianity: Avicenna
       “introduced medieval Europe to the principles of logic and their
       use to gain knowledge and understanding of the universe”;
       and Averroes
       “reintroduced to medieval Europe the Aristotelian approach to
       studying nature by observation and reasoning.”
       The caption of a picture of Avicenna in the article in Science
       says that he helped bring about the Renaissance by
       “advocating the use of reason and logic as the way to gain
       knowledge.”
       If this means that Avicenna believed that reason and logic were
       the way to gain knowledge, he was not a Muslim. If he believed
       that they were a way to knowledge, with whom was he
       arguing?[/quote]
       Source :
       Posted on August 1, 2005 Hyping Islam’s Role in the History Of
       Science by Jonathan David Carson, American Thinker, July 29
  HTML https://www.amren.com/news/2005/08/hyping_islams_r/
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