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#Post#: 12678--------------------------------------------------
Re: Western Democracy
DIR By: guest55
Date: April 9, 2022, 11:20 pm
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This Man Votes
--- Quote ---
> He'll be voting in November. Will you?
--- End Quote ---
HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81kMaPi_Hug
Comment:
--- Quote ---
> Vlad Putin and his ex-KGB pals would be so PROUD of you
MAGAfans!
--- End Quote ---
#Post#: 12886--------------------------------------------------
Re: Western Democracy
DIR By: 90sRetroFan
Date: April 18, 2022, 8:19 pm
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Continuing from:
HTML https://trueleft.createaforum.com/news/brexit/msg12818/#msg12818
Why do any leftists still support democracy?
HTML https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10723057/Britons-Boris-Johnsons-Rwanda-plan-poll-says-Huge-support-defies-hand-wringing-critics.html
--- Quote ---
> Voters back Boris Johnson’s plan to send asylum seekers to
Rwanda by two to one, a poll revealed last night.
>
> The survey for the Daily Mail found that even Labour voters
are more likely to support it than oppose it
--- End Quote ---
Only a small minority care about being ethical. They, not the
majority, should be the ones who make the important decisions:
--- Quote ---
> Gillian Triggs, assistant high commissioner at the UN refugee
agency, said the scheme was ‘unacceptable’ and a breach of
international law.
--- End Quote ---
#Post#: 12965--------------------------------------------------
Re: Western Democracy
DIR By: 90sRetroFan
Date: April 21, 2022, 9:08 pm
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Again our enemies accurately demonstrate that they are the true
democrats:
HTML https://www.eurocanadians.ca/2022/04/russia-ukraine-disinformation-what-are-they-hiding.html
--- Quote ---
> Could it be that Russia has a legitimate reason for this war?
Could this war be considered a just war from Russia’s point of
view? When we “connect the dots” of the past few decades, a
picture that contradicts the “approved” narrative starts to
emerge. To see clearly involves taking a trip down the “Rabbit
Hole”.
--- End Quote ---
So what do our enemies claim is the source of legitimacy?
--- Quote ---
> Mearsheimer’s predictions are based on exposing the facts of
the 2014 Maidan coup d’etat in Ukraine that threw out the
democratically elected pro-Russian Prime Minister, Victor
Yanukovich.
> ...
> As soon as Ukraine came closer to being incorporated into NATO
after the Maidan coup, Russia’s immediate response was to
re-annex the Crimean peninsula to Russia. This was a move wildly
popular with the largely Russian population of Crimea who had
voted strongly in the 2010 election for the deposed Prime
Minister Yanukovich. Russia held a referendum in Crimea on the
choice of reunion with Russia. The vote was overwhelmingly in
favour. In a flash, NATO lost its bid to take over Sevastopol.
> ...
> the largely ethnic Russian East Ukrainian region of the
Donbas, which had also voted overwhelmingly for the deposed
Prime Minister Yanukovich, attempted to break away from Ukraine
now that the coup had effectively disenfranchised them. They
formed the breakaway republics of Donetz and Lugansk, and also
sought annexation by Russia.
--- End Quote ---
NATO was never about democracy; during the Cold War, NATO was
happy to ally with autocracies so long as they were willing to
fight the Soviets. This is what NATO needs to get back to. The
sooner NATO drops its idiotic "pro-democracy" rhetoric, the
sooner China stops feeling threatened by NATO and hence might
see the sense in allying with NATO against Russia!
#Post#: 13324--------------------------------------------------
Re: Western Democracy
DIR By: Zea_mays
Date: May 14, 2022, 1:27 pm
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Although rightists are eager to claim he embraces dictatorship,
I think it is equally as likely he was just trying to "warn"
that the West's "adversaries" were gaining ground on them.
--- Quote ---
> Justin Trudeau Said He Admired China’s Dictatorship.
> [...]
> At a “ladies night” fundraiser in Toronto in 2013, an
up-and-coming politician was asked which nation’s administration
he admired most in the world.
>
> Wearing a pale blue shirt and a smile, the fresh-faced Liberal
Party leader answered Communist China.
>
> “There is a level of admiration I actually have for China
because their basic dictatorship is allowing them to actually
turn their economy around on a dime and say we need to go green,
we need to start, you know, investing in solar,” Justin Trudeau
told the group of women. “There is a flexibility that I know
[Prime Minister] Stephen Harper must dream about: having a
dictatorship where you can do whatever you wanted, that I find
quite interesting.”
--- End Quote ---
HTML https://web.archive.org/web/20220412170532/https://fee.org/articles/justin-trudeau-said-he-admired-china-s-dictatorship-canadians-should-have-believed-him/
--- Quote ---
> Trudeau took to social media Friday to explain himself.
>
> “I pointed out that globally, Canada is up against big
countries (China, for one) that can address some major issues
quickly,” he wrote on Twitter.
>
> “It’s ridiculous for anyone to suggest that I of all people
would trade our rights and freedoms for any other system of
(government).”
>
> Trudeau made the remarks during a ladies-only fundraiser
billed as “Justin Unplugged,” which invited women “to (really)
get to know the future prime minister.”
--- End Quote ---
HTML https://web.archive.org/web/20220418221326/https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/trudeau-under-fire-for-expressing-admiration-for-china-s-basic-dictatorship-1.1535116
His response at 1:35 is something so many democracy-worshiping
liberals say completely honestly. ...Like, if they just thought
about what the words they are saying actually mean, maybe they
would realize how pitiful democracy is...
HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8FuHuUhNZ0
#Post#: 13327--------------------------------------------------
Re: Western Democracy
DIR By: Zea_mays
Date: May 14, 2022, 1:33 pm
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This article is behind a paywall, but many people have written
similar headlines about elected judges and elected sheriffs.
...When will they realize electing politicians is just as
dangerous for society?
--- Quote ---
> America’s elected coroners are too often a public-health
liability
--- End Quote ---
HTML https://www.economist.com/united-states/2022/01/29/americas-elected-coroners-are-too-often-a-public-health-liability
#Post#: 13333--------------------------------------------------
Re: Western Democracy
DIR By: Zea_mays
Date: May 14, 2022, 1:50 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote ---
> The survey team found that compared to public opinion patterns
in the U.S., in China there was very high satisfaction with the
central government. In 2016, the last year the survey was
conducted, 95.5 percent of respondents were either “relatively
satisfied” or “highly satisfied” with Beijing. In contrast to
these findings, Gallup reported in January of this year that
their latest polling on U.S. citizen satisfaction with the
American federal government revealed only 38 percent of
respondents were satisfied with the federal government.
> [...]
> This result supports the findings of more recent shorter-term
surveys in China, and reinforces long-held patterns of citizens
reporting local grievances to Beijing in hopes of central
government action. “I think citizens often hear that the central
government has introduced a raft of new policies, then get
frustrated when they don’t always see the results of such policy
proclamations, but they think it must be because of malfeasance
or foot-dragging by the local government,” said Saich.
>
> Compared to the relatively high satisfaction rates with
Beijing, respondents held considerably less favorable views
toward local government. At the township level, the lowest level
of government surveyed, only 11.3 percent of respondents
reported that they were “very satisfied.”
>
> Again, the U.S. reveals quite a different story. “American
trust surveys over time show a clear distinction between low
levels of trust towards the federal government, but a strong
belief and faith in the power of local government — at the most
local level, those positions may be filled by part-time
volunteers who are a part of your everyday life,” said
Cunningham. This dichotomy is highlighted by a 2017 Gallup poll,
where 70 percent of U.S. respondents had a “great” or “fair”
amount of trust in local government.
>
> Saich contends that the lack of trust in local governments in
China is due to the fact that they provide the vast majority of
services to the Chinese people. This trust deficit was
compounded by the 1994 tax reforms, which garnered a
substantially larger share of total national tax revenues for
the central government. Local governments, despite being faced
with declining revenues, were still on the hook for providing
the bulk of public services throughout China.
> [...]
> The responses from survey participants in rural areas,
however, surprised the researchers, particularly over time. “We
did not anticipate how quickly both low-income citizens and
people from less-developed regions in China closed the
satisfaction gap with high-income citizens and people from the
coastal areas,” Cunningham added.
>
> The surveys found that rural residents, generally poorer than
those in cities, had more optimistic attitudes about inequality
than their wealthier urban counterparts.
--- End Quote ---
HTML https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2020/07/long-term-survey-reveals-chinese-government-satisfaction/
Imagine that, a 95.5% satisfaction rate when your nation isn't
pitted in a battle for 49% of the population vs 51%...
As for the local governments, note the misleading comparison of
asking Chinese citizens if they were "satisfied" vs the US poll
asking if people "trusted" the local governments. You can give
them the benefit of the doubt that they aren't massively corrupt
without being satisfied by them. ...And I imagine US
satisfaction with local government would be even lower if they
actually provided any substantial amount of services.
Non-existent public transit, poor road maintenance,
locally-controlled police who are so corrupt they can get away
with murder and steal more than non-police criminals, terrible
city planning which promotes suburban sprawl and car-centric
travel, etc.... People vote for the most unsatisfying policies
and then wonder why things suck.
#Post#: 13537--------------------------------------------------
Re: Western Democracy
DIR By: guest55
Date: May 22, 2022, 12:06 pm
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Biden voters were much more likely to report negative voting
than Trump voters in the 2020 election
--- Quote ---
> In the 2020 election, many Americans chose to vote due to
their hatred of the opposing candidate, rather than their
fondness for their chosen politician. A study published in
American Political Research seeks to understand the dynamics
behind this so-called “negative voting” pattern.
>
> Politics is regularly a field that contains a lot of
negativities, but the 2020 American presidential election was
particularly difficult and polarizing. Negative voting is a
choice made by constituents to vote for a certain candidate, not
because they want to support them, but because they do not want
their opposing candidate to win.
>
> This is in contrast with voters who vote because they have
positive feelings about their own party and their candidate.
Though this is not a new concept, it is very prevalent at this
point in time with approximately one third of voters in the 2020
election casting a negative vote for president.
--- End Quote ---
--- Quote ---
> Researchers Diego Garzia and Frederico Ferreira da Silva
utilized a Computer Assisted Web Interview survey conducted by
Qualtrics. It included 1,064 participants to represent the
American voting pool. Participants were presented with a direct
measure of negative voting, where they were asked if they view
their vote as an expression or support for their candidate or
opposition for the competing candidate. Votes against are
considered negative votes.
>
> Results showed that approximately 30% of participants cast a
negative vote. Despite the polarization the 2020 election
brought, this is not significantly more than in previous
elections. Interestingly, Biden voters were much more likely
(39%) to report negative voting than Trump voters (18%).
>
> This is in line with previous research that showed that the
incumbent candidate was more often the target of negative voting
than the challenger. Negative voting is seen less in people with
strong party affiliations and can go as high as 50% among people
who swing between parties or identify as independents.
--- End Quote ---
--- Quote ---
> This study sought to revisit the idea of negative voting in
regard to the very polarizing 2020 presidential election.
Despite the strengths, this study has some limitations. For
example, post-electoral surveys can lead to post-election
rationalization, which could skew the results. Additionally,
online surveys have come under fire many times for potentially
being less accurate and being completed less carefully.
>
> The study, “The Electoral Consequences of Affective
Polarization? Negative Voting in the 2020 US Presidential
Election“, was authored by Diego Garzia and Frederico Ferreira
da Silva.
--- End Quote ---
HTML https://www.psypost.org/2022/05/biden-voters-were-much-more-likely-to-report-negative-voting-than-trump-voters-in-the-2020-election-63174
This Man Votes 2
--- Quote ---
> When they show you who they are, believe them.
--- End Quote ---
HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FT_4dPiGSNA
In other-words, people are forced to vote for "the lesser of two
evils", which means they're often still voting for evil. This is
democracy.
#Post#: 13770--------------------------------------------------
Re: Western Democracy
DIR By: Zea_mays
Date: May 30, 2022, 12:00 am
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I assume this is not satire. It really illustrates just how
incapable democracy is of functioning. The politicians just vote
to hold themselves unaccountable. LOL
HTML https://i.redd.it/8e81iqfc61291.jpg
Note that one of the major supposed differences between
autocracy and democracy is that, in a democracy, politicians are
theoretically able to be held "accountable" for their actions by
the check and balance of voting. But little good that's ever
done.
Meanwhile, corrupt monarchs and dynasties were often overthrown
by other dynasties or individuals who claimed they could do a
better job.
#Post#: 14137--------------------------------------------------
Re: Western Democracy
DIR By: Zea_mays
Date: June 16, 2022, 10:25 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Some good news for once:
--- Quote ---
> Poll: Half of Americans now predict U.S. may 'cease to be a
democracy' someday
>
> A new Yahoo News/YouGov poll shows that most Democrats (55%)
and Republicans (53%) now believe it is “likely” that America
will “cease to be a democracy in the future” — a stunning
expression of bipartisan despair about the direction of the
country.
>
> Half of all Americans (49%) express the same sentiment when
independents and those who do not declare any political
affiliation are factored in, while just a quarter (25%) consider
the end of U.S. democracy unlikely and another quarter (25%) say
they’re unsure.
--- End Quote ---
HTML https://www.yahoo.com/news/poll-half-of-americans-now-predict-us-may-cease-to-be-a-democracy-someday-090028564.html
Although, to be realistic, it is likely that the 53% of
Republicans want to end democracy to empower themselves, while
the 55% of Democrats fear that Republicans are going to be the
ones who end democracy.
#Post#: 14249--------------------------------------------------
Re: Western Democracy
DIR By: 90sRetroFan
Date: June 21, 2022, 8:33 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Rightists are the authentic democrats:
HTML https://www.newsweek.com/texas-secede-us-2023-gop-pushes-referendum-1717254
--- Quote ---
> The Texas GOP's new party platform also called for full repeal
of the Voting Rights Act of 1965.
--- End Quote ---
HTML https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voting_Rights_Act_of_1965
--- Quote ---
> the Act sought to secure the right to vote for racial
minorities throughout the country, especially in the South.
According to the U.S. Department of Justice, the Act is
considered to be the most effective piece of federal civil
rights legislation ever enacted in the country.[9] It is also
"one of the most far-reaching pieces of civil rights legislation
in U.S. history."[10]
--- End Quote ---
The Voting Rights Act of 1965 defends suffragism, not democracy.
As I explained here:
HTML https://trueleft.createaforum.com/colonial-era/how-the-u-s-stole-mexico/msg13791/#msg13791
--- Quote ---
> Rightists are the true democrats in that they still hold to
the original definition of the demos. False Leftists, who favour
non-demos people voting also, would be more accurately labelled
as suffragists. Suffragism is thus a way to undermine
(traditional) democracy without abandoning elections. Of course
True Leftists differ from False Leftists in that we would prefer
to openly defeat democracy by ending elections altogether.
Nevertheless, until we succeed in ending elections, we of course
pragmatically prefer suffragism over (traditional) democracy,
which is why we support:
>
>
HTML https://trueleft.createaforum.com/issues/demographic-blueshift/
--- End Quote ---
True Leftists (authentic autocrats) have been reluctantly forced
into an emergency coalition with False Leftists (suffragists,
who inaccurately call themselves "democrats") solely in order to
keep rightists (authentic democrats, who are nevertheless
inaccurately called "autocrats" by False Leftists) from winning.
Back to first link, further evidence that rightists are the
authentic democrats:
--- Quote ---
> The platform describes homosexuality as "an abnormal lifestyle
choice," and also declares that the party opposes "all efforts
to validate transgender identity."
--- End Quote ---
Majority opinion within the demos is all that matters to
authentic democrats (ie. rightists). They do not care about
minority opinion within the demos, nor do they care about
opinions of non-demos people (irrespective of number).
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