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#Post#: 18318--------------------------------------------------
Re: Counterculture and Western Civilisation
DIR By: rp
Date: March 8, 2023, 9:15 pm
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"I agree that the pictured church is American. This is why I
place hope in America."
IMO the church in the picture is just comically unserious, not
comparable to the Gnostic ruins. Most "American" (Western)
churches are just there to cater to the consumeristic,
hedonistic lifestyle of Westerners.
#Post#: 18322--------------------------------------------------
Re: Counterculture and Western Civilisation
DIR By: 90sRetroFan
Date: March 8, 2023, 9:38 pm
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"IMO the church in the picture is just comically unserious, not
comparable to the Gnostic ruins."
The Cathar castle ruins look mysterious to us now because they
have been ruins for centuries. Hypothetical True Leftists
centuries from now looking at the future ruins of the pictured
church above should find them just as mysterious.
Do you at least agree that if our only choices are either the
pictured American church above or a Western church such as (from
one of the replies in the Culture Critic thread):
[img]
HTML https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FpLlreJagAAQP_S?format=png&name=small[/img]
Jesus would choose the former to preach in?
#Post#: 18323--------------------------------------------------
Re: Counterculture and Western Civilisation
DIR By: rp
Date: March 8, 2023, 9:44 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Hmm.. You definitely have a point. The "pizza hut" just looks
like one of the buildings in my neighborhood, and I myself don't
have any problems seeing them in my day-to-day life. The Western
church on the other hand is so jarring that it would completely
alter the spiritual ambiance of my neighborhood. So in that
regard, yes, the former church is superior.
#Post#: 18324--------------------------------------------------
Re: Counterculture and Western Civilisation
DIR By: rp
Date: March 8, 2023, 10:06 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
On that note, I should say I find pre-Renaissaince Western
architecture a little more bearable than Renaissance
architecture, though not by a lot.
#Post#: 18363--------------------------------------------------
Re: Counterculture and Western Civilisation
DIR By: 90sRetroFan
Date: March 10, 2023, 8:48 pm
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Our enemies attack American aesthetics again, proving (again)
that they themselves are not Americans but Western occupiers:
HTML https://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/2023/03/10/pajama-nation-americans-have-morphed-into-the-people-of-walmart/
--- Quote ---
> It has become common in America to see someone wearing a
hoodie, backward baseball cap, torn jeans, a ‘wife-beater,’ or
their baggy pajamas to the grocery store, the DMV, or to the
movies. Most people probably don’t even notice it anymore
because it has become a regular feature of what Americans wear.
--- End Quote ---
Our enemies cite their authority on the subject:
--- Quote ---
> Americans, it seems, are quite content in attiring themselves
like complete slobs. They can’t be bothered to wear appropriate
and form-fitting clothes. Comedian Bill Mahr was right when he
said on his Real Time show in 2013 that Americans won’t be happy
until they can go shopping in a diaper!
--- End Quote ---
(I think they mean Maher.)
--- Quote ---
> Just as so many American fathers have abdicated their role as
leaders in the family, so also mothers have failed to instruct
and guide their daughters on what it means to be a woman. The
days when our women were known for being feminine, soft-spoken,
and polite are over. The entire notion of behaving “classy” and
“dignified” seems to have been kicked to the curb.
>
> Whites Have Succumbed to the Degrading Fashion Trends of
Blacks
>
> What I find to be especially disturbing is how many of our
young White men and women follow the fashion trends of Blacks.
White males wearing their hat backwards might seem like a petty
thing to complain about. Perhaps, but even in something as
seemingly insignificant as this, it shows the degree of
influence that Black ‘culture’ has had on our way of life.
>
> White males didn’t do this sort of thing until around the late
80s or early 90s when Black ‘rap’ music took hold of the nation.
It’s been downhill ever since. The backwards baseball cap thing
popular among Black males is, in my view, indicative of them as
a people. Everything they do is backwards. They are largely
unwilling to assimilate to the norms of White civilization, and
it shows in their attitudes, including at times in the smallest
of ways. These are subtle acts of defiance by Blacks, a sort of
“**** you!” to the White man and a declaration that “we’re
different than you!”
--- End Quote ---
Yes (note Skate's backwards baseball cap):
HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VoahUBEMzwQ
--- Quote ---
> What a stark contrast all of this is to prior generations of
White Americans. Consider the 1950s when America, according to
some observers, was at its pinnacle in terms of national unity,
civility, and morality. People used to dress up when they went
shopping or even to the grocery store as strange as that may
sound to our ears. It wasn’t rare to see men in the stands at a
professional baseball game wearing suits and women wearing
dresses.
--- End Quote ---
::)
--- Quote ---
> Part of understanding all of this is recognizing that no one
puts on their daily clothes without thinking about it. None of
it is accidental. Yes, there are persons who give little thought
as to what they wear, but that doesn’t mean they wouldn’t care
if they dressed up like a clown or a disheveled hobo. Most of us
attire ourselves a certain way because this is how we want to
portray ourselves to others. Our clothes, then, serve as a
reflection of ourselves and what we want others to think of us.
Thus, when a gang member attires himself in a thuggish way or
anyone else for that matter, they are sending a message. They
are signaling to others. They are portraying themselves, as well
as messaging their values and worldview (however slight it may
be).
>
> Most people don’t think about it much, but this is what is
occurring. A corporate professional for a large city bank, for
example, would not think of wearing cowboy boots and a cowboy
hat to work. He wouldn’t wear pajamas to the office either. He
knows he has an image he wants to project, one that comports
with his vocation and the policies of his company.
>
> Thus, when Americans dress like slobs it’s a peek inside their
little world.
--- End Quote ---
Our enemies want bankers to be our rolemodels. Got it.
(Go back up to the video and note Mr X wearing a Western suit
(1:15:00). And having his building guarded by robots (1:06:00).
Additionally, note the names of the robots.)
--- Quote ---
> What young White woman in the 1950s would want to dress the
way our women do today? What young White man in the 1950s would
want to emulate the lowest fashions and degrading practices of
Blacks? I suspect there would have been very few, if any.
>
> Times have changed, and that not for the better. We have been
feeling for decades the effects of the disastrous social and
political changes that occurred beginning in the 1960s.
--- End Quote ---
Thank you Counterculture!
--- Quote ---
> One can see the downward progression by simply observing the
clothing standards of each new decade. Current trends, sadly,
indicate that it will only get worse.
--- End Quote ---
HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXbIy0qWhnc
#Post#: 18391--------------------------------------------------
Re: Counterculture and Western Civilisation
DIR By: 90sRetroFan
Date: March 12, 2023, 6:05 pm
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Our enemies want the US to look as un-American as possible:
HTML https://twitter.com/Culture_Crit/status/1634336550564646913
--- Quote ---
> America could have looked like this. We were so close...
>
>
[img]
HTML https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fq5UWd0X0AAQzq2?format=jpg&name=900x900[/img]
>
>
[img]
HTML https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fq5UedCXoAAk_sh?format=jpg&name=900x900[/img]
>
>
[img]
HTML https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fq5UkUBXwAExeq-?format=jpg&name=small[/img]
>
>
[img]
HTML https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fq5UurqWwAEpuhK?format=jpg&name=small[/img]
>
>
[img]
HTML https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fq5VtLPXwAE7XzA?format=jpg&name=small[/img]
--- End Quote ---
Would you even know the above photos are of the US just by
looking at them? They could be of any Western country.
In contrast, in the below you instantly know which country you
are looking at:
[img]
HTML https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/69/NormsRestaurant_LaCienega.JPG/800px-NormsRestaurant_LaCienega.JPG[/img]
HTML https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/22/Burbank_bob%27s_big_boy_patio_1.jpg/800px-Burbank_bob%27s_big_boy_patio_1.jpg
HTML https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/ca/Johnnie%27s_Coffee_Shop_for_Wiki_1.jpg/800px-Johnnie%27s_Coffee_Shop_for_Wiki_1.jpg
[img]
HTML https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/17/Caribbean_Motel_NJ.JPG/800px-Caribbean_Motel_NJ.JPG[/img]
HTML https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/76/McDonald%27s_%28520_Oxford_St_W%29_-_London%2C_ON.jpg/800px-McDonald%27s_%28520_Oxford_St_W%29_-_London%2C_ON.jpg
HTML https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e3/Silk_City_Diner_4655_in_Sabina.jpg/800px-Silk_City_Diner_4655_in_Sabina.jpg
HTML https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c3/Bendix_Diner.jpg/800px-Bendix_Diner.jpg
HTML https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d9/Salemdiner.jpg/800px-Salemdiner.jpg
HTML https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d6/Angel%27s_-_Florida%27s_oldest_diner_-_July_2008_02.jpg/800px-Angel%27s_-_Florida%27s_oldest_diner_-_July_2008_02.jpg
HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WNpuIHbK3-I
#Post#: 18428--------------------------------------------------
Re: Counterculture and Western Civilisation
DIR By: 90sRetroFan
Date: March 14, 2023, 11:12 pm
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Counterculture according to Duchesne:
HTML https://twitter.com/dr_duchesne/status/1635742793136996354
--- Quote ---
> White women have been manipulated into wearing pants
--- End Quote ---
while he was praising video of woman (note face shape)
deliberately wearing Western clothes on the street amidst mostly
Counterculture clothes:
HTML https://twitter.com/ElijahSchaffer/status/1635645979750981632
Recall:
HTML https://trueleft.createaforum.com/human-evolution/re-sexual-dimorphism-preferences/msg1258/#msg1258
--- Quote ---
> it wasn't that long ago when even women wearing trousers was
considered unacceptable in Western civilization (whereas women
in other civilizations have worn trousers alongside men
uncontroversially):
>
>
HTML https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trousers#Society
>
> [quote] Based on Deuteronomy 22:5 in the Bible ("The woman
shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man"), some groups,
including the Amish, Hutterites, some Mennonites, some Baptists,
a few Church of Christ groups, and most Orthodox Jews, believe
that women should not wear trousers. These groups permit women
to wear underpants as long as they are hidden. By contrast, many
Muslim sects approve of pants as they are considered more modest
than any skirt that is shorter than ankle length.
--- End Quote ---
[/quote]
HTML https://trueleft.createaforum.com/colonial-era/re-genghis-khan/msg4142/#msg4142
--- Quote ---
> Interactions between Ottomans and Britons occurred throughout
history, but in the 18th century, European visitors and
residents in the Ottoman Empire markedly increased, and exploded
in the 19th century.[1] As such, fashion is one method to gauge
the increased interactions. Historically, Europeans clothing was
more delineated between male and female dress. Hose and trousers
were reserved for men, and skirts were for women.[2] Conversely,
in the Ottoman Empire, the male and female dress was more
similar. A common item worn by both was the şalvar, a
voluminous undergarment in white fabric shaped like what is
today called "harem pants".[3] To British women traveling in the
Ottoman Empire, the şalvar quickly became a symbol of
freedom because they observed that Ottoman women had more rights
than British women did. Lady Mary Wortley Montague (1689–1762),
whose husband was the British Ambassador to Constantinople,
noted in her travels in her "Embassy Letters" that Ottoman women
"possessed legal property rights and protections that far
surpassed the rights of Western women".[4] These female
travelers often gained an intimate view of Ottoman culture,
since as women, they had easier access to the Muslim Elite
harems than did men.[5] Şalvar successfully spread into
Europe at the end of the 19th century as various female
suffragists and feminists used şalvar as a symbol of
emancipation. Other British women of distinction, such as Lady
(Janey) Archibald Campbell (1845–1923), and Lady Ottoline
(Violet Anne) Morrell (1873–1938) wore şalvar "in an
attempt to symbolize their refusal of traditional British
standards and sexual differences".[6] Şalvar also spread
beyond Europe when Amelia Jenks Bloomer modified these "Turkish
trousers" to create American "bloomers".[7]
--- End Quote ---
#Post#: 18535--------------------------------------------------
Re: Counterculture and Western Civilisation
DIR By: 90sRetroFan
Date: March 21, 2023, 6:00 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Our enemies complain about Counterculture-inspired decrease in
the sexual dimorphism of clothes:
HTML https://vdare.com/posts/the-forgotten-1960s-unisex-craze
--- Quote ---
> “Unisex” had a lot to do with Late Sixties wars over hair. In
the 1960s, males got their hair cut only by male barbers.
> ...
> But in the 1970s it became cool for guys to get their hair cut
by women. Hair salons put out signs declaring themselves
“unisex” to advertise that the opposite sex was okay to come in.
> ...
> Nobody today remembers how hard Society pushed “unisex”
androgyny in the 1970s. For example, from the Sears catalog:
>
>
HTML https://www.unz.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/03/Screen-Shot-2023-03-21-at-6.20.45-AM.png
>
>
HTML https://www.unz.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/03/Screen-Shot-2023-03-21-at-6.21.40-AM.png
>
--- End Quote ---
I made a similar point (but in a positive tone) back here:
HTML https://trueleft.createaforum.com/questions-debates/re-dress-decolonization/msg5864/#msg5864
Contrast with the high sexual dimorphism of Western clothes:
HTML https://www.brides.com/thmb/WTQiJ4pOLBIX6A_ZnBtTk9aIboU=/1500x0/filters:no_upscale():max_bytes(150000):strip_icc()/wedding-dress-code-explained-v2-d929658adb614430be36ee20caaea7fe.png
This is how superior the Counterculture was.
With that said, one possible criticism is that, despite the
Counterculture designers' good intentions, they had forgotten to
remove Western button placement:
HTML https://trueleft.createaforum.com/issues/dress-decolonization/msg5632/?topicseen#msg5632
thus even the clothes pictured in the enemy post are inferior to
non-Western clothes, none of which use sexually dimorphic button
placement. This problem was solved only with the tracksuits I
mentioned in the second link which used zips instead of buttons:
--- Quote ---
>
HTML https://vintagedancer.com/wp-content/uploads/80s-shell-tracksuits-windbreakers-jackets-mens-women.jpg
--- End Quote ---
#Post#: 18904--------------------------------------------------
Re: Counterculture and Western Civilisation
DIR By: 90sRetroFan
Date: April 16, 2023, 4:46 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Our enemies academically agree with us regarding Western vs
American architecture:
HTML https://twitter.com/Culture_Crit/status/1646631882937729027
[img]
HTML https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FtoCFw1WAAIjfXi?format=jpg&name=medium[/img]
vs
[img]
HTML https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FtoDXQ-WYAAjlC2?format=jpg&name=900x900[/img]
The only difference is that their opinion of the former is:
--- Quote ---
> Will mankind ever construct a building as perfect as this
again?
--- End Quote ---
whereas ours is:
HTML https://trueleft.createaforum.com/true-left-vs-right/western-civilization-is-ugly-48/msg6679/?topicseen#msg6679
Bonus commercial:
HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PN61cFkwMyc
Can you imagine Fry Kids inside the Western building? Neither
can I.
#Post#: 20601--------------------------------------------------
Re: Counterculture and Western Civilisation
DIR By: 90sRetroFan
Date: June 23, 2023, 4:11 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Culture Critic's anti-Americanism on display again:
HTML https://twitter.com/Culture_Crit/status/1672293334780395521
--- Quote ---
> New York City's Woolworth Building is just that - nicknamed
the "Cathedral of Commerce", it is one of the finest early
skyscrapers in the world, and a monument to the economic
dominance of the city in the early 20th Century.
--- End Quote ---
[img width=853
height=1280]
HTML https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FzUdGX5X0AAUTbx?format=jpg&name=large[/img]
--- Quote ---
> He believed civic buildings deserved the necessary expenditure
to make them beautiful. Fortunately, he worked during a time of
vast appetite for elaborate ornamentation and high-budget
historicism, before the Great Depression killed many such
ambitions.
--- End Quote ---
[img]
HTML https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FzUeW8PWYAUG_DH?format=jpg&name=900x900[/img]
--- Quote ---
> For the Woolworth Building, Gilbert drew inspiration from his
prior trips across Europe, incorporating intricate carvings,
gargoyles and grotesques into the 15th and 16th Century-inspired
neo-Gothic facade.
--- End Quote ---
[img]
HTML https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FzUejdAXsAg1LDc?format=jpg&name=900x900[/img]
--- Quote ---
> The main entrance is a marvel of Gothic design, consisting of
a three-story Tudor arch surrounded in elaborate stone details.
--- End Quote ---
[img]
HTML https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FzUephmWAAAgpmX?format=png&name=900x900[/img]
--- Quote ---
> Stepping inside, the lobby is an eclectic mix of styles, and
rich with detailed bronze fittings. Its Byzantine-style mosaics,
vaulted ceiling and stained glass skylight make an extravagant
welcome.
--- End Quote ---
[img]
HTML https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FzUesgGX0AIkq-n?format=jpg&name=900x900[/img]
Again, can you imagine Fry Kids (see previous post) inside the
Woolworth Building? Neither can I.
Or, for that matter, Grimace? But here is some pro-American
news:
HTML https://finance.yahoo.com/news/mcdonalds-exec-grimaces-return-fuels-the-awakening-of-the-brand-143232859.html
--- Quote ---
> Grimace's return fuels the 'awakening of the brand'
> ...
> According to McDonald’s chief marketing and customer
experience officer Tariq Hassan, it's all part of the fast food
company's plan to become a "cultural icon" and use that status
to drive the business.
>
>
[img]
HTML https://s.yimg.com/ny/api/res/1.2/tCROtcCUj3J3x0DaWw2SRA--/YXBwaWQ9aGlnaGxhbmRlcjt3PTk2MDtoPTc4NjtjZj13ZWJw/https://s.yimg.com/os/creatr-uploaded-images/2023-06/5305a0e0-102b-11ee-bb5e-6dcd25726809[/img]
>
> Grimace, a fast-food marketing icon in the 1980s, has taken
over McDonald's social media as part of an omnichannel marketing
initiative promoting a special meal for the character's
birthday.
--- End Quote ---
This is what American aesthetics are supposed to be like!
HTML https://relevantmagazine.com/current/buzzworthy/mcdonalds-celebrates-grimaces-birthday-with-retro-video-game/
HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jk61dHLut7A
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