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#Post#: 16533--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bombing ISIL in Syria
DIR By: rapids_60
Date: September 29, 2014, 10:43 pm
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--- Quote from: trollslayer link ---
>
> Why wasn't immunity given?
--- End Quote ---
Basically because neither the Iraqi people nor government wanted
American forces in the country, much less with immunity.
Changes to the SOFA agreement were a convenient excuse to back
out of something they'd previously agreed to. That's the long
and short of it.
There may be- sort of- a SOFA agreement currently in place.
Signed, but without a vote of Parliament. It's iffy.
#Post#: 16534--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bombing ISIL in Syria
DIR By: trollslayer
Date: September 29, 2014, 10:48 pm
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--- Quote from: rapids_60 link ---
>
> Basically because neither the Iraqi people nor government
wanted American forces in the country, much less with immunity.
Changes to the SOFA agreement were a convenient excuse to back
out of something they'd previously agreed to. That's the long
and short of it.
>
> There may be- sort of- a SOFA agreement currently in place.
Signed, but without a vote of Parliament. It's iffy.
>
--- End Quote ---
It's iffy? Obama didn't want troops in Iraq. He campaigned on
it. He pulled them out. Nothing too hard to figure out there.
He could have done an executive action and had Malaki sign it.
This is what has been done in the past. Instead Obama insisted
the SOFA be run through the Iraqi Parliment.
Look at what's been done in Afghanistan as far as a SOFA and
compare it to what Obama wanted in Iraq. What he expected in
Iraq was completely unprecedented.
#Post#: 16535--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bombing ISIL in Syria
DIR By: rapids_60
Date: September 29, 2014, 11:10 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: trollslayer link ---
>
> He could have done an executive action and had Malaki sign it.
This is what has been done in the past.
>
--- End Quote ---
No.... it isn't. Bush's SOFA in 2008 was approved by both the
Iraqi cabinet and Parliament. In fact the Iraqi's insisted on
removal of protections for US contractors- and got it.
So now you guys want him to take Executive action? Isn't that
an unconstitutional dictator-ish, America-ruining power grab? I
could swear it was just a few weeks ago. ;D
#Post#: 16537--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bombing ISIL in Syria
DIR By: trollslayer
Date: September 30, 2014, 3:17 am
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--- Quote from: rapids_60 link ---
>
> No.... it isn't. Bush's SOFA in 2008 was approved by both
the Iraqi cabinet and Parliament. In fact the Iraqi's insisted
on removal of protections for US contractors- and got it.
>
> So now you guys want him to take Executive action? Isn't
that an unconstitutional dictator-ish, America-ruining power
grab? I could swear it was just a few weeks ago. ;D
>
--- End Quote ---
You continue to side step the meat of the matter here Rapids.
Which is it? Did Obama "end the war" or did the Iraqi people
throw us out?
It seems we've heard both sides of the coin from this
administration. Could you clarify this?
#Post#: 16543--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bombing ISIL in Syria
DIR By: rapids_60
Date: September 30, 2014, 1:53 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: trollslayer link ---
>
>
> You continue to side step the meat of the matter here Rapids.
>
--- End Quote ---
He says, ignoring the fact he got the facts completely wrong on
previous SOFA agreements, lol.
I didn't sidestep anything. You can end a war without removing
all the troops. We still have troops in Europe. Are we
fighting a war there?
Obama DID end the war. That is a separate matter from bringing
residual personnel back home, which he also did. Difference
being on that matter his hand was forced.
#Post#: 16544--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bombing ISIL in Syria
DIR By: trollslayer
Date: September 30, 2014, 2:25 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: rapids_60 link ---
>
> He says, ignoring the fact he got the facts completely wrong
on previous SOFA agreements, lol.
>
>
--- End Quote ---
Ummm, no. I didn't. It's what happened. As long as we're on
the topic, how many approved the Afghanistan SOFA? The quick
answer is one. The new president. Obama removed this option
from Malaki. It appears Obama may ave learned his lesson.
However if you wish to want to continue to push the notion that
the leader of the free world is incapable of getting a SOFA
agreement with a country like Iraq that's ok too.
HTML http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/us-afghanistan-sign-security-pact-to-allow-american-forces-to-remain-in-country/2014/09/30/48f555ce-4879-11e4-a046-120a8a855cca_story.html
--- Quote ---
> You can end a war without removing all the troops. We still
have troops in Europe. Are we fighting a war there?
> Obama DID end the war.
--- End Quote ---
Obama didn't end the war. But another thread for another day.
He did repeatedly say he brought the troops home. So did he
bring the troops home or were they forced home by the Iraqi
government? Please lets not try avoiding the obvious outcome
semantically.
#Post#: 16549--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bombing ISIL in Syria
DIR By: Linda Lou
Date: September 30, 2014, 5:35 pm
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I still say pull all our soldiers out of there and let those
a-holes blast the $hit out of each other until the end of days.
#Post#: 16551--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bombing ISIL in Syria
DIR By: trollslayer
Date: September 30, 2014, 6:02 pm
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I used to think that, no longer. Too many people, too many
innocent people being killed simply for their beliefs. Convert
to Islam move pay us or die. Live under Sharia law or die.
Reminds me too much of what we fought and died for during WWII.
Nazism is alive and well, just under a different name.
#Post#: 16552--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bombing ISIL in Syria
DIR By: rapids_60
Date: September 30, 2014, 8:18 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: trollslayer link ---
>
> Ummm, no. I didn't. It's what happened.
>
--- End Quote ---
You said:
--- Quote ---
> He could have done an executive action and had Malaki sign it.
This is what has been done in the past.
--- End Quote ---
That is NOT what has been done in the past.
Bush not only waited for approval of Iraq's parliament, but he
capitulated when they insisted on no protection for US
contractors.
#Post#: 16553--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bombing ISIL in Syria
DIR By: rapids_60
Date: September 30, 2014, 8:21 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: trollslayer link ---
>
> I used to think that, no longer. Too many people, too many
innocent people being killed simply for their beliefs. Convert
to Islam move pay us or die. Live under Sharia law or die.
Reminds me too much of what we fought and died for during WWII.
Nazism is alive and well, just under a different name.
>
--- End Quote ---
We fought and died during WWII on behalf of a population that
was not only grateful, but actively helped us rebuild their
countries into something worthwhile.
Iraq OTOH would rather continue to fight religious wars and kill
each other than build a decent homeland. Half the time they
shoot at us when we are trying to help. The other half would
rather die at the hands of a fellow Muslim than have us Infidels
interfere
We need to leave- now- and slam the door shut. If they start
to generate terrorists who cross the border, bomb that worthless
wasteland back into a glass parking lot.
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