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#Post#: 281--------------------------------------------------
Re: original sin
By: alphaomega Date: March 14, 2013, 3:52 pm
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this is a long post so i will answer in pieces if that is ok?
[quote author=Amadeus link=topic=56.msg279#msg279
date=1363235502]
[quote]alphaomega: let us examine the issue
Original sin;
What is it?[/quote]
[font=courier]We can call it "original" but doesn't that simply
mean that it is the "first", the first time a man opposed God,
or pulled himself away from God, or sinned? The phrase "original
sin" is not scriptural at least not in the KJV. Adam and Even
did displease God, but none of their children were born sinners.
They did not know how to do anything else, so they sinned. We
all did, but we were not born sinners. We were not born with an
"original sin". We were perhaps as you say born outside of the
family and therefore were unable to do anything initially but
sin. We were dead so what else could be expected? Pleasing God
did not come naturally to us, but sinning did. It was and is the
way of man.[/font]
[/quote]
original is the first sin ; but it is also that from which all
other sin flows from
if i hit you ; that has nothing to do with if i steal from raina
both are wrong but but their connection is not to each other but
rather their connection to the original sin
as we go through this ; it is not my intention to be right
(though i certainly am not trying to mislead you either)
it is to bring out into the light theres more to this whole
story than just opposing the law
while Jesus was on this earth
he told several people thier sins where forgiven and yet; he
still went to the cross
combine this with there is a sin that leads to death ;
one we are told not to pray for
one that will not be forgiven
one that is unpardonable
----------------------------------- that being blasepheming the
Holy Spirit
as i stated ; that original sin was leaving the family of God
JESUS died on the cross completeing that which was needed to
kinsman redeem (bring a way for mankind back into the family of
God ) mankind.
to those who accepted Jesus as lord- savior- kinsman redeemer;
died to themselves ; and picked up their cross
and then they were brought into the family of God
Whince ; ( they meet more of the family) as they had the Holy
Spirit come into them
what was flesh/soul has now become soul/spirit ;this new
creation is of the family of GOD
but this state is only for the believers, and nobody was born a
believer
in the story ; A MAN BLIND FROM BIRTH
there certainly was such a man whom Jesus did bring site back
to;
but beyond that was the teaching lesson for all mankind
ALL WHO WHERE BORN ; ARE BORN BLIND or simply ....
because of original sin ( leaving the family of God)
all have the sin of being outside the family of God
you are getting that we might be outside the family of God at
birth ;
what are not seeing as of yet; is that is what original sin is
---
--- being outside the family of God
#Post#: 282--------------------------------------------------
Re: original sin
By: alphaomega Date: March 14, 2013, 4:40 pm
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[quote author=Amadeus link=topic=56.msg279#msg279
date=1363235502]
[quote]More importantly how is it transferred to us?[/quote]
[font=courier]I do not believe that it is... transferred to us,
that is:
1-"Yet say ye, Why? doth not the son bear the iniquity of the
father? When the son hath done that which is lawful and right,
and hath kept all my statutes, and hath done them, he shall
surely live.
2-The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear
the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the
iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be
upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him."
Ezek 18:19-20 [/font]
[quote]Does it affect us today?[/quote]
[font=courier]
3-We are affected by the sin of the first man Adam because being
separated from God, being out of communication with God, being
dead and we did not know how NOT to sin. We have followed the
lead of our flesh and it always, when followed, will lead us to
sin, repeatedly until.... but I won't get into that here.[/font]
[/quote]
*1-;
EACH PERSON is given his own choice ; each person is out of the
family of God
what is seen here is also that of nationality
to be a jew? still leaves you out of the family of GOD
SO WHAT SAY WE ABOUT those who are not of the same nationality
as us?
WHAT DO WE SAY about say CAIN ?
and the verse speaks to the fact the issue is not of who is your
father { because all are out of the family of God}
BUT RATHER it is up to the individual to seek God ; for you are
niether saved nor condemed by linage standards
for like all of mankind ; the law of God will test each person
individually
and since all fall short of fulfilling this ; the need for a
savior exists for each indidvidual.
*2-;
the soul that sinnith ;
each soul comes from Adam and with that is outside the family of
God
EACH SOUL individually needs keep the law ( which it can't) or
needs a savior
and kinsman redeemer to step in for him. What your human father
has done or not done ; matters not in this matter. being a Jew
OR descending from Japheth matters not in this matter.
*3-;
being out of communion with God; is being out of the family.
but being dead? this is not true
will we live eternally ---not if we remain outside the family ;
but we are alive
a cow on this earth is not dead
but you are right in that we follow the lead of the flesh ;
and as stated before
that flesh for the believer leaves the "us"
flesh/soul (old man) becomes soul/spirit ( the new man)
and again ; JESUS said to several your sins are forgiven ( but
your not family)
and thus he went to the cross to make a way for (kinsman
redeeming) mankind to become family (soul/spirit)
so its about family and sin is only one obsticle to this issue
====================
original sin is leaving the family
this causes more sins that each individual committs
Jesus comes and pays for those individual sins
those who believe (accepts) this
they die to the flesh (thier being righteous) and turn their
lives (soul) over to him
his action of dying on the cross completes the rule of the
kinsman ( family) redeemer
as family we recieve more family ( the holy spirit)
and original sin ( being outside the family) has been rectified
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