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#Post#: 11426--------------------------------------------------
My thoughts on numerous playthrougs and end-game bonuses
By: goku94 Date: January 6, 2013, 2:27 pm
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Hi everybody. Hi, doctor Nick.
I was thinking about the idea of giving up and starting over the
whole campaign. Well, not many games have something like that,
so I value it a lot. I have never finished the currently
existing chapters on hardcore, but I imagine, that after doing
so, the second playthrough must get really boring. You know, you
already defeated every stinking epic boss, hords of creeps and
all that on the highest difficulty level. And you also get a
"huge bonus" for when you start over, so it doesn't get any more
interesting. It gets easier. There was even talk of eliminating
professions, so that you don't have to think about such stuff.
But this is a valuable part of the game, very uniqe in games
generally. So, after you beat the game on hardcore, you can put
it away for good and maybe wait for some bugfixes or, I don't
know, anything. But I have an idea, that could make the game
more interesting for those, who beat it on the highest level, or
maybe even on extreme. I know it may be difficult to make, or
even impossible, but that's the only reasonable bonus for
finishing hardcore.
In every chapter, there could be a bonus area available, for
those, who managed to do it. You could enter it via a bonus
quest, and through a special portal, magical runes drawn on the
ground, with help of a wizard, or simply enter a mine or a cave.
This area should be extremaly difficult. You would enter it only
after finishing all other non-main quests, with a maximum level
and all most powerful items currently available. It should be so
difficult, that even with those things you would have problems
with survivng. There, as you wouldn't level up anymore, you
would find more powerful items, item sets, synthesis items,
bonus luck and honor and upgrades for spells, skills and espers
- things, that would not change your chosen skills, only expand
them with special effects. One or two quests, some bonus story
and hard, long minigames would also be included. And most of
all, a new, special boss, let's say a Legendary Boss. Those
Legendary Bosses would be the most difficult enemies in the game
and would drop even more powerful stuff. With this stuff, next
chapters would be easier, so that you could focus on the new
content - and the old content, except for main plot, would be
skipable. These areas would only be playable on hardcore and
extreme.
This way, the second hardcore playthrough would be a lot more
crazy and interesting. I know it sounds crazy, and you probably
think "this guy doesn't know, what he's talking about, we don't
have time for this". Yeah, I already realised that. It's just an
idea. After all, this campaign already beats every other game
into a pulp. You said you would welcome every idea.
Well, thank you for attention.
goku94
#Post#: 11427--------------------------------------------------
Re: My thoughts on numerous playthrougs and end-game bonuses
By: doomlord Date: January 6, 2013, 3:25 pm
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Nice idea you got there pal. I totally approve of this, no
matter what Aero might say.
#Post#: 11428--------------------------------------------------
Re: My thoughts on numerous playthrougs and end-game bonuses
By: Shinokyofu Date: January 6, 2013, 3:47 pm
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Okay, first things first.
I don't exactly agree with you about the hardcore thing. I mean,
how many times will you replay the campaign? If you could beat
the game in hardcore doing all the things you could do(100% of
the game), you could say "oh well, i've done everything i could
do here" then pass to another game. Then, after some time has
passed, when you're without that many game choices and with lots
of free time, you replay it again. Well, that said, the campaign
isn't complete, and I get you point of view. You're not wrong,
but perphaps expecting so much of it?
We can only "give up" for now, but later(when the campaign is
completed or almost) we will get "The End" to do too. I've heard
of Aero some projects of doing bonus things(you could say, new
game+ bonuses, if you know the term)for the ones who load a "The
End"
Now, about the "Legendary Areas". Personally i thing that would
be beyond difficult(perphaps impossible like you've said) to be
made, but i like the idea and the concept. I mean, i would get
very excited, that's for sure. I love new things that you
discovery in a game when you think you already did everything(if
the game is good enough, that is...)
Yet, i remember you that TCO isn't exactly a easy campaign. I
mean, not all of us are such hardcore gamers that can beat even
the Touhou games or such hardcore games with ease. Within a
normal point of view, to beat later epic bosses in hardcore can
be .... HARDCORE.
"So Shino, are you saying that my idea is bad?" No, the idea is
very good. Perphaps not a legendary area, but a alternative mode
of the same map, with new monsters and stuff...that wouldn't be
bad, indeed...Ahem! But there's a limit of how difficult a boss
can be, because if it's too difficult, it's unbeatable, but if
it's not difficult enough, the main concept breaks. Besides,
your idea looks, like i've said already, difficult to be made,
perphaps impossible.
Now just to end this post(it's getting too long, and i'm getting
lazy), you should, at least, wait for the end of the campaign.
It'll get more difficult. Have you seen the bosses that Aero
will put there? They're fucking difficult to the point i've
given up defeating then now(in the campaign i'll get revenge
though). Well, perphaps you're even more of a hardcore player
than i thought and have already defeated them....Well, i can't
help then. Too much hardcoreness for me to handle :P.
PS: Doom, don't you think it is a little too unrealistic? I
mean, is it even possible to do this? It would be interesting
with it is though [-).
#Post#: 11429--------------------------------------------------
Re: My thoughts on numerous playthrougs and end-game bonuses
By: chimto Date: January 6, 2013, 6:42 pm
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Great idea... except that our dear Aero can't be bothered with
it.
#Post#: 11431--------------------------------------------------
Re: My thoughts on numerous playthrougs and end-game bonuses
By: Aeroblyctos Date: January 7, 2013, 2:55 am
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Hey,
The basic idea is almost same with the Elite and Epic bosses.
There's something optional, something very challenging in each
chapter. Except that you can go enter these areas when you've
done specific things.
I'm actually positive to this but I want to link Game Points to
this. Right now Game Points are useless, but they'll be used for
Interludes. Why not for this too?
Also I wonder how this idea will actually work. Like, 1 extra
optional quest per chapter or what?
#Post#: 11432--------------------------------------------------
Re: My thoughts on numerous playthrougs and end-game bonuses
By: goku94 Date: January 7, 2013, 6:25 am
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Well, you're right. Maybe Epic bosses in later chapters are
unbeatable on hardcore. This way, the bonus could help in
defeating them. One bonus quest per chapter would be perfectly
awesome, as long as it would contain bonus story and would be a
little more complicated then usual. You know, for example you
would have to search for special items all over the chapter and
then solve a puzzle using them. And the special rewards would
help with epic bosses - perfect! I know it would take a lot of
time for you to create, but, you know, you've been working on
this project for years, you know you love it.
Now, I'm quiting gaming until june, so bye. I hope the basic
campaign will be finisjed by then. Good luck.
#Post#: 11433--------------------------------------------------
Re: My thoughts on numerous playthrougs and end-game bonuses
By: doomlord Date: January 7, 2013, 8:04 am
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[quote author=Shinokyofu link=topic=1296.msg11428#msg11428
date=1357508869]
PS: Doom, don't you think it is a little too unrealistic? I
mean, is it even possible to do this? It would be interesting
with it is though [-).
[/quote]
Nah the concept for these legendary arenas are simple enough. We
create the arena then block the entrance with an invulnerable
gate that can only be opened if the player have achieved the
necessary criteria like accumulating a specific quantity of Game
Points or playing on Hardore, etc.
#Post#: 11434--------------------------------------------------
Re: My thoughts on numerous playthrougs and end-game bonuses
By: Shinokyofu Date: January 7, 2013, 5:36 pm
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[quote author=Doomlord link=topic=1296.msg11433#msg11433
date=1357567485]
[quote author=Shinokyofu link=topic=1296.msg11428#msg11428
date=1357508869]
PS: Doom, don't you think it is a little too unrealistic? I
mean, is it even possible to do this? It would be interesting
with it is though [-).
[/quote]
Nah the concept for these legendary arenas are simple enough. We
create the arena then block the entrance with an invulnerable
gate that can only be opened if the player have achieved the
necessary criteria like accumulating a specific quantity of Game
Points or playing on Hardore, etc.
[/quote]
When you put that way it looks simple...I don't know. It sounded
a lot more complicated when i read it...or so i've imagined.
#Post#: 11436--------------------------------------------------
Re: My thoughts on numerous playthrougs and end-game bonuses
By: Aeroblyctos Date: January 8, 2013, 1:37 am
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The plan to what to create there takes like 10x more time than
actually doing the thing.
#Post#: 11443--------------------------------------------------
Re: My thoughts on numerous playthrougs and end-game bonuses
By: hamza_tm Date: January 8, 2013, 2:22 pm
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Firstly the main point is that the game does not get THAT boring
after you finish hardcore. Why? Because when you start again you
can choose a completely different skill set for your heroes. In
this way there are just tons of skill combinations to explore
per playthrough which adds a massive amount of replay value.
There are also alternative item builds to try. Caster Fradz
stacking greater magic balls, can you win with that? It's pretty
damn hard I can tell you :)
Anyway the hardcore bosses aren't exactly easy, they all take
very specific strategies to beat and only that strategy can
work. So when you say Legendary boss that is harder than the
others, that doesn't make sense until you clarify how to make
them harder. The strategy can always be learnt, do you want a
boringly long fight or one that requires ridiculous timing of
things to win? Or perhaps bosses that require controlling your
heroes separately at the same time?
Anyway nice idea, if you can help thinking up more ideas for
what kinda stuff to create that would be awesome!
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