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#Post#: 1618--------------------------------------------------
The new wave of STers vs the Old wave
DIR By: Tollison
Date: September 28, 2013, 10:20 pm
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I am considered a new wave STer. The old wave is still around.
I started playing in WC in Dec 2006, and started playing ST at a
competitive level around the STWC 07 games.
Old wave consists of I suppose, Shoop, Amir?, Drew, Chakra, CMK,
Chaise, etc.
One big problem between the fight against us is the old wave is
very conservative and the new wave is very open.
Old wave players feel it is useless to play public sheep tag
games and it would be best for them to play private games which
leaves, and left, the sheep tag community to stop growing.
Chakra did a great job trying to keep west alive, but he was
basically doing it by himself. Looking back in the past I don't
remember the likes of Drew, Shoop, etc. playing public games
much at all. The elite players, the ones who play the best and
the ones who draw crowds, are the ones who should be in public
games all the time. I was drawn to StH by Spade, an StH shaman
back in 07. He was diamonding and I had never seen such a
thing! I wanted to play just like him so I did. I ended up
becoming competitive at ST.
One problem I had with sheep tag as a new waver is I was heavily
scrutinized for my gameplay. The pros all mocked me and I felt
I had no chance at ever becoming as good as them. The pros
being the old wave. Amir, chakra, shroomy, and StH clan members
were the only ones I ever wanted to play with back in the day
because they actually encouraged me to get better at the game.
Shoop, Drew, Sidey, maybe magoo, Divineright, cel, and other
competitive players negatively affected me and I had become
worse from their scrutiny. I was at a time in my life where
warcraft was my life and they sought to destroy it. I know as a
fact right now that I was having constant anxiety attacks back
in the day because of all of this. All I wanted to be was a
good st player and a good friend, but the people I just listed
were hindering me from doing so. I had no inspiration to
backlash at them because all I wanted were friends to enjoy my
favorite game with.
Sheep tag is relatively inactive compared to earlier times, and
I believe if the elites weren't so sadistic, meaning they find
pleasure from hurting others, that sheep tag would be more
active today. No one wants to play with someone that bashes
them. It hurts people more than you think it does.
Please, old sters, elite and competitive players, seek to play
public games and to be nice to your st peers. It's the only way
that people want to stick around.
#Post#: 1620--------------------------------------------------
Re: The new wave of STers vs the Old wave
DIR By: MasteR[StH]
Date: September 28, 2013, 11:10 pm
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almost 7 years is not "new waver"... if this was the NFL you'd
almost be retired....
also drew and i would play extensive games of 8 or 6 vs 2(him
and I) or w/e the map would allow. was fun.
brought in some people. some had no interest.
its not that old wavers feel its useless to play public. its
just that we are OLD. most of us are full time students hell
some of us are even full time employees some place. we don't
have time to sit down recruit people. we want to log on and play
when we know games are and with people we can enjoy playing
with. not people we have to carry.
*Comment Section meaning don't take this **** too hard*
the new wave open? open to what 30 seconds of sheep then dying
cause they got bored or want to do the "sickest SHlT"
yes they mocked you for your game play ^^ yea we'll go with that
^^
if this was so dramatic for you how can you say "maybe magoo"
wouldn't you remember it vividly?
also you mention sadistic and my name is not even in this post
WTF 8)
#Post#: 1621--------------------------------------------------
Re: The new wave of STers vs the Old wave
DIR By: MasteR[StH]
Date: September 28, 2013, 11:14 pm
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also as far as recruiting pubs the map's were similar at least
in my opinion. may it easier to switch over..
grr map is just crap...
#Post#: 1622--------------------------------------------------
Re: The new wave of STers vs the Old wave
DIR By: Tollison
Date: September 28, 2013, 11:43 pm
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almost 7 years IS new waver. If we still have old wavers such
as drew, shoop etc. then people like cel and i are considered
relatively new.
8 vs 2 isn't what brought me into st. 4v4 did.
Yes you do find it useless to play public games. All you ever
look for is private games, ed. you can't refute that.
You mentioned that they mocked my gameplay, but that isn't
relevant for you to talk about. I was mentioning why they
mocked me affected my gameplay and personality negatively which
is a drawback of the ST community.
Your claim for being busy is irrelevant. You play WC, and you
play ST, so there is no excuse to not play public sheep tag
games except for your own enjoyment. This was exactly my point.
I suggest you stop using such a negative viewpoint, ed. You're
very counterproductive in your arguments.
#Post#: 1627--------------------------------------------------
Re: The new wave of STers vs the Old wave
DIR By: Map
Date: September 29, 2013, 4:58 am
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New waver is probably 2008/2009 but 2006 is not something new,
trust me.
Ed is completely right. The people you mentioned are rarely
playing Sheep Tag. Why should they waste their less time to
recruit / train people? It is your respectively our job to
practice with them. As I see Shya and some other people try to
recruit but mostly they are too impatient.
EDIT: There are a lot talented public Sheeptagger who can mass
good and aim for the right sheep/ use of golem, speed etc.
Huge surprise when I had been playing a public game and most of
them could mass, even exactly.
#Post#: 1630--------------------------------------------------
Re: The new wave of STers vs the Old wave
DIR By: Shyamora[SkS]
Date: September 29, 2013, 5:23 am
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Yea mappy ^^ I think I might've had some influence in that.
Right now I'm the only 'old' sheeptagger still active besides
CMK, and I'm the one person in this community that's actually
hosting sheeptag games purely for public, so what you're saying
is not completely right.
What Ed said, about the oldies having no time to play is true,
though tbh, it seems like they lost interest mostly. Sheeptag
nowadays isn't as it was in the 'old' days, and they miss that /
think it's not as attractive to play anymore.
The negative attitude is something that defines the sheeptag
community, and I personally loath it most of all. Clan SoR that
I just created will for example not allow any negative attitudes
in. But yea, sheeptaggers in general are idiots with a brain
capacity of a newt, so violent / agressive behaviour is
something to be expected.
I have posted and asked for people to host more public games
before, and I continiously ask people to do so on Bnet, but so
far there's nobody else trying to carry the load with me. One 15
minute session with pub players can already make a difference if
several people do it, so the 'having no time' thing is bullshit.
You want to enjoy proper sheeptag, then you should feel
responsible for keeping it alive aswell.
#Post#: 1633--------------------------------------------------
Re: The new wave of STers vs the Old wave
DIR By: Tollison
Date: September 29, 2013, 8:14 am
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Indeed, Shya. If we want a lively sheep tag community we must
all want to play the game publicly.
ESPECIALLY THE LEGENDS such as cow, chaise, drew, shoop, sidey,
amir, CMK, etc.
Consider it like this. Sheep Tag is a circus looking for
potential FREAKSHOWS. The legends I just listed are the main
attraction. They are the ones who inspire others to play sheep
tag.
Spade and Drew were my reasons for joining sheep tag. They
played the game so well and I wanted to play it just like them.
I never felt so challenged in my life to try to be like them!
#Post#: 1637--------------------------------------------------
Re: The new wave of STers vs the Old wave
DIR By: MasteR[StH]
Date: September 29, 2013, 11:54 am
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"almost 7 years IS new waver. If we still have old wavers such
as drew, shoop etc. then people like cel and i are considered
relatively new."
7 years.... thats 2555 days... 7 years is almost as long as it
takes to be a doctor... 7 years is 7 winters... i dont consider
that new.
i never said 8vs2 brought you in.... i never said it was the
best way. i said that's what drew and I did. it worked to get
some people and some people didn't want in to the clan....
"Yes you do find it useless to play public games. All you ever
look for is private games, ed. you can't refute that. "
interesting that you can tell me what i care about..... lol
You mentioned that they mocked my gameplay, but that isn't
relevant for you to talk about. I was mentioning why they
mocked me affected my gameplay and personality negatively which
is a drawback of the ST community.
tollison- how old are you? sticks and stones.
"Your claim for being busy is irrelevant. You play WC, and you
play ST, so there is no excuse to not play public sheep tag
games except for your own enjoyment. This was exactly my point.
"
lol how is there no excuse?? "sorry professor i was recruiting
pubs to build farms to defend against wolves." or " yea i cant
work from 3-10 that is prime recruiting time cause that is when
kids get out of school"
"I suggest you stop using such a negative viewpoint, ed. You're
very counterproductive in your arguments."
was not negative... if you are talking about the section i told
you not to take too hard. well then clearly you didn't listen.
#Post#: 1642--------------------------------------------------
Re: The new wave of STers vs the Old wave
DIR By: Tollison
Date: September 29, 2013, 2:25 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: MasteR[StH ---
> link=topic=175.msg1637#msg1637 date=1380473696]
> "almost 7 years IS new waver. If we still have old wavers
such as drew, shoop etc. then people like cel and i are
considered relatively new."
> 7 years.... thats 2555 days... 7 years is almost as long as it
takes to be a doctor... 7 years is 7 winters... i dont consider
that new.
>
> i never said 8vs2 brought you in.... i never said it was the
best way. i said that's what drew and I did. it worked to get
some people and some people didn't want in to the clan....
>
> "Yes you do find it useless to play public games. All you
ever look for is private games, ed. you can't refute that. "
> interesting that you can tell me what i care about..... lol
>
> You mentioned that they mocked my gameplay, but that isn't
relevant for you to talk about. I was mentioning why they
mocked me affected my gameplay and personality negatively which
is a drawback of the ST community.
> tollison- how old are you? sticks and stones.
>
> "Your claim for being busy is irrelevant. You play WC, and
you play ST, so there is no excuse to not play public sheep tag
games except for your own enjoyment. This was exactly my point.
"
> lol how is there no excuse?? "sorry professor i was recruiting
pubs to build farms to defend against wolves." or " yea i cant
work from 3-10 that is prime recruiting time cause that is when
kids get out of school"
>
> "I suggest you stop using such a negative viewpoint, ed.
You're very counterproductive in your arguments."
> was not negative... if you are talking about the section i
told you not to take too hard. well then clearly you didn't
listen.
>
>
--- End Quote ---
I'm sorry I shouldn't be talking about old wave and new wave.
The people who are virtuous in ST don't play to recruit players.
They play to play. It's a circus with no audience.
I was showing you why mentioning 8v2 was pointless to bring up.
the 4v4, the competitive games, are what attracted me to sheep
tag. That is where the circus displays their main attraction.
Yes I can tell you what you care about by your actions. Common
sense, Ed.
Sticks and stones is irrelevant. I was young and emotional at
the time and I let people run all over me. Not anymore. The
point is that your attitude is discouraging to new players.
Kids don't want to help their parents if they call them dumb,
retarded, stupid etc.
Try to avoid name calling, ed. It's a naive and immature
mistake. I'm not a professor so don't call me that. You are
clearly trying to be disrespectful and it isn't appreciated.
Ed, you have time to play public sheep tag games with other good
sheep tag friends, but you choose to play private sheep tag
games instead. You can't recruit new players in a private
match. !+!-2.
Do not make fun of my previous gameplay. It is
counterproductive to my skill. It would be better if you tried
to help me. You can't be taught if you're being slandered
instead. Just like with everyone else. All of the ST community
except for a few SLANDER ALL SHEEP TAGGERS FOR THEIR MISTAKES,
BUT DO NOTHING TO HELP THEM. No tips are given from ed, drew,
cel, shoop, and many other players. All of you would rather
bash sheep taggers which makes you all horrible and unfit to be
teachers.
There is no surprise that the ST community deminished. There
are less players in WC than ever before just because a lot of
people quit for their own personal reason, and WC3 isn't a
mainstream game to buy, but one factor of the tiny ST community
we have and have had is because of its own players. I've seen
many people leave the st community because they simply got BORED
of st. It's mad boring to be gawked at for your skill by much
better players. Those lesser players MODELED AFTER THE TOP DOGS
and the top dogs are PUSHING THEM DOWN. ?
Activity of the ST community is low because of a failure of
leadership and less wc activity. Thats just it.
This is what I meant by old wave vs new wave. The old wave of
players don't care for new wave players nor care to bring any in
at all. They want their precious public game fix.
The world of ST is now solely in Europe. East and West have
died and any attempts in colonizing Asia has failed. So ed, if
you want to see more activity in ST then go play public games in
Europe.
Europe = the last stand.
#Post#: 1651--------------------------------------------------
Re: The new wave of STers vs the Old wave
DIR By: MasteR[StH]
Date: September 29, 2013, 3:08 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
"I'm sorry I shouldn't be talking about old wave and new wave."
its a neat point i just don't agree with your time frame but
really does it matter..
"The people who are virtuous in ST don't play to recruit
players. They play to play. It's a circus with no audience. "
virtuous... people recruiting does not make some one better than
some one who wants to only play vs the best of the best.
I was showing you why mentioning 8v2 was pointless to bring up.
the 4v4, the competitive games, are what attracted me to sheep
tag. That is where the circus displays their main attraction."
when you say competitive game do you mean like when you were a
pub on ultimate map that is what attracted you to st?
or you talking about 4v4 on revo format that was used before 3v5
became the norm?
"Yes I can tell you what you care about by your actions. Common
sense, Ed."
again i do not find it useless play public games.... just cause
i don't do it does not mean i don't care. i am a full time
student and employed so forgive me when i log on i don't want to
play a game of GRR map. i want to play with the cmks the drews
the Grims of the world. which brings me back to main reason the
drews cele and i dont recruit. we are busy.
"Sticks and stones is irrelevant. I was young and emotional at
the time and I let people run all over me. Not anymore. The
point is that your attitude is discouraging to new players.
Kids don't want to help their parents if they call them dumb,
retarded, stupid etc."
my attitude to the brand new players is actually very nice...
its when people have been playing for 7 years and then die 1st
9/10 times/afk as wolf i get annoyed.
secondly 99% of my flames/comments/opinions/thoughts are in
whispers. CMK seems to enjoy them ^^ 8) so they would never hear
if i had anything bad to say. perception of me is not reality.
"Try to avoid name calling, ed. It's a naive and immature
mistake. I'm not a professor so don't call me that. You are
clearly trying to be disrespectful and it isn't appreciated. "
clever? ??? just brush off valid points. its like defusing a
bully with humor. well done i guess ???
"Ed, you have time to play public sheep tag games with other
good sheep tag friends, but you choose to play private sheep tag
games instead. You can't recruit new players in a private
match. !+!-2."
ok let me break this down in an example outside of st.
lets say you like racing cars. but you only can race cars for
1-2 hours a day.
so when that window opens should i take my car around the block
causally for a few laps. (pub games)
or would u like to go as fast as you can vs the best drivers in
the game (private games)
if i had a million dollars or still lived at my parents house or
was still in high school i would pub more but when i log for my
small window of play time id like to play vs the best of the
best.
"Do not make fun of my previous gameplay. It is
counterproductive to my skill. It would be better if you tried
to help me. You can't be taught if you're being slandered
instead. Just like with everyone else. All of the ST community
except for a few SLANDER ALL SHEEP TAGGERS FOR THEIR MISTAKES,
BUT DO NOTHING TO HELP THEM. No tips are given from ed, drew,
cel, shoop, and many other players. All of you would rather
bash sheep taggers which makes you all horrible and unfit to be
teachers. "
want my advice. set small goals for yourself. average game clock
is 10 minutes. do what you need to do to get to 9 minutes. then
after u reach 9 minute then so on till it reaches zero.
"There is no surprise that the ST community deminished. There
are less players in WC than ever before just because a lot of
people quit for their own personal reason, and WC3 isn't a
mainstream game to buy, but one factor of the tiny ST community
we have and have had is because of its own players. I've seen
many people leave the st community because they simply got BORED
of st. It's mad boring to be gawked at for your skill by much
better players. Those lesser players MODELED AFTER THE TOP DOGS
and the top dogs are PUSHING THEM DOWN. ?"
to say this is main reason would be wrong but it does not help
-- correct.
"Activity of the ST community is low because of a failure of
leadership and less wc activity. Thats just it."
failure of leadership... you can bring a sheep to water but you
cant make it drink.
and less active is true. prime st time was 2006 most people
would say. that is 7 almost 8 years ago. people moved on.
peoples priorities changes. this would/should of happened no
matter how great this game is. life changes.
"This is what I meant by old wave vs new wave. The old wave of
players don't care for new wave players nor care to bring any in
at all. They want their precious public game fix."
i think you mean private game fix..... i think. idk so i wont
comment as i am unclear what you mean
"The world of ST is now solely in Europe. East and West have
died and any attempts in colonizing Asia has failed. So ed, if
you want to see more activity in ST then go play public games in
Europe."
with bots as good as they are now. realms are pointless. OK ill
go play public games. you go to class and work for me.
"Europe = the last stand."
Europe just to happen to have the host bots. realms are
pointless
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