DIR Return Create A Forum - Home
---------------------------------------------------------
Stony Brook Fans
HTML https://sbufan.createaforum.com
---------------------------------------------------------
*****************************************************
DIR Return to: SBU Football
*****************************************************
#Post#: 20893--------------------------------------------------
Re: 2012-2020: Future of SBU Football - Conference Affiliation,
FBS Football, etc
DIR By: Hammertime
Date: January 11, 2018, 4:33 am
---------------------------------------------------------
VA_SEAWOLF .. I appreciate you putting together that really good
synopsis to why you think SB belongs in a power 5 conference.
But I have one tiny, little problem that could put the breaks on
to this pipe dream. MONEY!!!!!$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.
Just think of the money that is needed to upgrade every single
athletic facility SB has.. It would cost hundreds of millions of
dollars to bring it up to par with the likes of Michigan, Pitt,
Oregon Maryland etc.. Where is that money coming from, NYS??
Coumo would never allow that to happen.. Look what he did with
that twenty five million dollars that was earmarked for science,
but after that program got squashed SB tried to funnel that into
athletics. Big state daddy took it right back... Bottom line is.
SB doesnt have the booster, Alumni to invest that kind of money
back into athletics to be in par with the big, ACC, Big10
schools.. Mr. James Simons can make that happen with a stroke of
his pen, but just like all the other wealthy, non athletic
boosters SB has, they could care less about sports!
IFCU would have to be expanded several thousand more seats and
that cant be done because of structural reasons. LaValle stadium
would have to most likely torn down and rebuilt to around 40,000
seats. What about the baseball field and seating area? Something
SB doesnt even have.. etc. etc. etc.......
I can go on and on to why this university will not go into the
power conference in my life time. G5?? , maybe. Even that is a
far cry in my lifetime for all the reasons I outlined..
Baby steps, lots of athletic money and a history of winning and
beating bigger school will eventually get you an invite and a
move up into a G5 conference ..
p.s. Warney was the main reason why SB had a hard time playing
big school in fear of us beating them.. That came from Pikiel
mouth to my ears. I dont think the AAU affiliation mattered at
that time... But, what do I know.. I never even step one foot
into SB classroom.
#Post#: 20894--------------------------------------------------
Re: 2012-2020: Future of SBU Football - Conference Affiliation,
FBS Football, etc
DIR By: ry1nik
Date: January 11, 2018, 7:15 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: VA_Seawolf link ---
>
> A whole lot of small minded thinking in this thread.
Fortunately Heilbron and Stanley along with their predecessors
disagree with you, otherwise we'd probably still be in D3.
>
> Being in a power conference, or even an FBS conference may
seem like a pipe dream, but as an FCS school, we fit the profile
of a power conference school to the T. We're the public flagship
institution for the state of New York and unlike the other three
campuses, we're actually near the economic and population engine
of the state. We're not some directional backup to the backup
school that many of the other FCS programs are. I'm from VA and
JMU is a fantastic school. I even considered going there, but at
the end of the day, it's the kind of place you choose to go when
you don't get into UVA or Tech. SBU doesn't have that issue. NY
state students WANT to come here. We're the best public option
in the state for NYC and Long Island residents. That's 12
million people within an hour of the campus. You can't ignore
that.
>
> Academically, I'm not sure you guys realize this, but we're in
the AAU:
>
>
HTML https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_American_Universities#Membership
>
> Only the best research schools are in the AAU and you have to
be invited in by existing members. Look at those schools
gentlemen, you can't keep any better company than that. I'm not
going to say we're peers to Berkely, the Ivies, Stanford, Rice,
etc. I won't go that far, but when those schools invite you into
their club? That means something. Iowa St.? Rutgers? Pittsburgh?
Oregon? Maryland? Those are our academic peers and they're damn
good schools. Those schools also want to play us in sports which
is part of why we're able to get OOC games against schools like
Michigan St., Washington, etc.
>
> Of all the public schools in the AAU with football, only two
have the sport in the FCS. UC Davis, and us. Buffalo is the only
FBS public school in the club that's in a G5 conference. Every
single other school; literally every single one is in a power
conference. The only thing stopping us is that unlike the power
conference schools that have been around for over 150 years,
we've only been around 60, so we're the new kids on the block.
We're ascending at an astonishing rate given how young we are as
a school. Don't let the current attendance and fan apathy fool
you. Institutionally, we're a power school in every way.
Enrollment, research, you name it. The athletics just need to
catch up which they are. I'd drop the small minded thinking
guys. We're not a Boise State who can tear it up on the field
for decades but still never sniff a power conference because of
their junior college level academics. We're better than that.
>
> Our academics and location are why I think come the next round
of realignment in 7-8 years we could get called up to a better
conference. University presidents make realignment decisions on
who they want to align themselves with, and the upside of an AAU
flagship school within an hour of 12 million people makes SBU a
risk worth taking. Our floor is higher than Buffalo, because
unlike Buffalo, we're not hours away from most of the state in
the frigid cold with nothing to do. They're going to be the ones
not wanting us to move up. On the recruiting trail for football,
the only thing they have over us is they're FBS and we're FCS.
We win in pretty much every other category.
>
> In the meantime, keep fielding competitive FCS teams, and
really put out a good basketball product. Nothing can put your
school on the map faster than good basketball. People still
remember those GMU and VCU final four runs and Gonzaga went from
a nobody to a well known school thanks to their basketball.
>
--- End Quote ---
"Nothing can put your school on the map faster than good
basketball. People still remember those GMU and VCU final four
runs and Gonzaga went from a nobody to a well known school
thanks to their basketball. " This statement weakens the case
for big-time football and its link to putting a school on the
map. GMU, VCU, and Gonzaga do not have football...let alone FBS
football.
Athletics exist ultimately to support the academic mission and
student experience. Most people would rather have a degree from
MIT or Harvard (small athletic profile) than U. of Georgia or
Alabama (large profile). Since SBU is already in the AAU, no
need to connect AAU membership with the athletic profile of
other AAU schools to try and make a case for FBS football. SBU
is already in the AAU group.
#Post#: 20895--------------------------------------------------
Re: 2012-2020: Future of SBU Football - Conference Affiliation,
FBS Football, etc
DIR By: Chairman of the Board
Date: January 11, 2018, 8:01 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: VA_Seawolf link ---
>
> A whole lot of small minded thinking in this thread.
Fortunately Heilbron and Stanley along with their predecessors
disagree with you, otherwise we'd probably still be in D3.
>
> Being in a power conference, or even an FBS conference may
seem like a pipe dream, but as an FCS school, we fit the profile
of a power conference school to the T. We're the public flagship
institution for the state of New York and unlike the other three
campuses, we're actually near the economic and population engine
of the state. We're not some directional backup to the backup
school that many of the other FCS programs are. I'm from VA and
JMU is a fantastic school. I even considered going there, but at
the end of the day, it's the kind of place you choose to go when
you don't get into UVA or Tech. SBU doesn't have that issue. NY
state students WANT to come here. We're the best public option
in the state for NYC and Long Island residents. That's 12
million people within an hour of the campus. You can't ignore
that.
>
> Academically, I'm not sure you guys realize this, but we're in
the AAU:
>
>
HTML https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_American_Universities#Membership
>
> Only the best research schools are in the AAU and you have to
be invited in by existing members. Look at those schools
gentlemen, you can't keep any better company than that. I'm not
going to say we're peers to Berkely, the Ivies, Stanford, Rice,
etc. I won't go that far, but when those schools invite you into
their club? That means something. Iowa St.? Rutgers? Pittsburgh?
Oregon? Maryland? Those are our academic peers and they're damn
good schools. Those schools also want to play us in sports which
is part of why we're able to get OOC games against schools like
Michigan St., Washington, etc.
>
> Of all the public schools in the AAU with football, only two
have the sport in the FCS. UC Davis, and us. Buffalo is the only
FBS public school in the club that's in a G5 conference. Every
single other school; literally every single one is in a power
conference. The only thing stopping us is that unlike the power
conference schools that have been around for over 150 years,
we've only been around 60, so we're the new kids on the block.
We're ascending at an astonishing rate given how young we are as
a school. Don't let the current attendance and fan apathy fool
you. Institutionally, we're a power school in every way.
Enrollment, research, you name it. The athletics just need to
catch up which they are. I'd drop the small minded thinking
guys. We're not a Boise State who can tear it up on the field
for decades but still never sniff a power conference because of
their junior college level academics. We're better than that.
>
> Our academics and location are why I think come the next round
of realignment in 7-8 years we could get called up to a better
conference. University presidents make realignment decisions on
who they want to align themselves with, and the upside of an AAU
flagship school within an hour of 12 million people makes SBU a
risk worth taking. Our floor is higher than Buffalo, because
unlike Buffalo, we're not hours away from most of the state in
the frigid cold with nothing to do. They're going to be the ones
not wanting us to move up. On the recruiting trail for football,
the only thing they have over us is they're FBS and we're FCS.
We win in pretty much every other category.
>
> In the meantime, keep fielding competitive FCS teams, and
really put out a good basketball product. Nothing can put your
school on the map faster than good basketball. People still
remember those GMU and VCU final four runs and Gonzaga went from
a nobody to a well known school thanks to their basketball.
>
--- End Quote ---
with all that said though (and i agree with it), why can't we
get regular attendance.
another thing ill add is that you point out the academic
accolades. and those are great. and i hate that college sports
have become infected with money. but the plain fact is that
they are money machines. so that takes a back seat to ticket
sales, TV deals, merchandise, concessions, media coverage, etc.
What im saying is that kids come to SB for academics and that's
great, but we are missing the athletics powerhouse-ness.
i turn on local tv from time to time. and what do they
broadcast? softball, european soccer, NFL reruns, etc. Because
that's what locals want to watch. not SB Lacrosse. not fordham
basketball. not hofstra baseball.
how many locals even tune in to st johns bball??? over a UNC
game? michigan on a winter saturday afternoon??? ive been to
ONE game at carnesecca in 37 years, and that's because they were
playing SB. and im a college hoops fanatic.
if that's what stations air on TV, it's reflective of how few
attend our games.
i guess what im saying is- asses in seats drives the process, so
i am fooled by attendance.
and there's no attendance because there's no atmosphere.
if there was stuff to do, kids would stick around. but they
dont.
maybe im wrong but if im an FBS conference, the first thing i
look at is attendance, fan support, revenues, record, etc. we
just dont pass the test.
apathy is a bigger problem for the U and we have a whole
separate thread on that.
* * *
im not saying we wont get there. i just dont know how soon, or
whether we can really fill a stadium, or ever create the type of
atmosphere that would, say, attract Gameday. over/under, ill
say 2035 and maybe even take the over. GO SB
#Post#: 20899--------------------------------------------------
Re: 2012-2020: Future of SBU Football - Conference Affiliation,
FBS Football, etc
DIR By: NoVA_Seawolf
Date: January 11, 2018, 3:06 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Hammertime, money wouldn't be an issue due in large part to the
media contracts of these bigger conferences. The Big Ten TV deal
will pay somewhere in the neighborhood of $50M per school next
year. That's an unreal amount of money. Granted, I don't think
the money will be quite that high in the future, but there will
always be adequate money from the TV partners of power
conferences to get the media rights for those leagues.
You also assume I'm talking about moving to the Big Ten or ACC
tomorrow. That's not what I mean. In 50 years, I do believe we
could get there and by that point the alumni, donor, and
fanbases will be at a point to support inclusion into the power
structure. We're a good school that will be at 30k enrollment in
the not too distant future. It's not at all unreasonable to
think we could be in a power conference 50 years down the road
for the reasons I stated. Again, the school is only 60 years old
right now.
If you want to talk short term, (the next 8 years) I believe we
could move into the MAC or AAC today with our current
facilities. All we'd need is a moderate expansion of the stadium
and we're fine. You act like we're decades away from being FBS
when really all it takes is for SH's phone to ring. Coastal and
Liberty are FBS today and we frequently laid the beatdown on
both of them in the Big South. Coastal's stadium was smaller
than ours when they got the invite. The bar is lower than you
think. There's going to be a BIG reshuffling of conferences come
the middle of the next decade and I anticipate SBU will get an
FBS invite somewhere in the middle of all that chaos.
--- Quote from: ry1nik link ---
>
>
> "Nothing can put your school on the map faster than good
basketball. People still remember those GMU and VCU final four
runs and Gonzaga went from a nobody to a well known school
thanks to their basketball. " This statement weakens the case
for big-time football and its link to putting a school on the
map. GMU, VCU, and Gonzaga do not have football...let alone FBS
football.
>
> Athletics exist ultimately to support the academic mission and
student experience. Most people would rather have a degree from
MIT or Harvard (small athletic profile) than U. of Georgia or
Alabama (large profile). Since SBU is already in the AAU, no
need to connect AAU membership with the athletic profile of
other AAU schools to try and make a case for FBS football. SBU
is already in the AAU group.
>
--- End Quote ---
No, it doesn't weaken it at all. If you want to get on the map
quickly and get a bunch of buzz around your school and programs,
all you need is a deep run in the NCAA tournament. The momentum
of that alone could bring an FBS invite along with it.
Basketball can get you attention quickly, but if you want to
sustain that and become a household name, football is key.
Football drives the realignment and media bus. Basketball is our
best bet to make a splash in the short term simply because
nobody gives a damn about FCS football and the barriers to
upgrading Olympic sports/basketball are much lower. Getting
killed by Kentucky brought us more publicity than anything we've
ever done in football. People just don't care about the FCS.
#Post#: 20901--------------------------------------------------
Re: 2012-2020: Future of SBU Football - Conference Affiliation,
FBS Football, etc
DIR By: Chairman of the Board
Date: January 11, 2018, 4:31 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote ---
> There's going to be a BIG reshuffling of conferences come the
middle of the next decade and I anticipate SBU will get an FBS
invite somewhere in the middle of all that chaos.
>
--- End Quote ---
just curious for more color on this, as it's intriguing. what
are you basing this on and thanks for your thoughts.
#Post#: 20903--------------------------------------------------
Re: 2012-2020: Future of SBU Football - Conference Affiliation,
FBS Football, etc
DIR By: NoVA_Seawolf
Date: January 11, 2018, 8:45 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Chairman of the Board link ---
>
> [quote]There's going to be a BIG reshuffling of conferences
come the middle of the next decade and I anticipate SBU will get
an FBS invite somewhere in the middle of all that chaos.
>
--- End Quote ---
just curious for more color on this, as it's intriguing. what
are you basing this on and thanks for your thoughts.
[/quote]
Schools in the Big 12, Oklahoma specifically aren't very happy
with the league and could be looking elsewhere towards another
conference once the GOR for the Big 12 expires in 2025. Big Ten,
SEC, and Pac 12 could all be destinations. Oklahoma was heavily
in favor of the Big 12 expanding last year, but the league
decided against it:
HTML https://www.sbnation.com/college-football/2017/9/22/16350026/bob-bowlsby-big-12-commissioner-contract<br
/>
There's also the issue of CUSA, which overexpanded in 2013
taking mediocre schools only because they were in big media
markets having their TV revenue drop from ~2M per school per
year to just 200k per year per school. That small amount of TV
money, when combined with all the travel they have to do in that
league poses a huge problem for CUSA that they'll have to
address. A split or some kind of reshuffling with the Sun Belt
may happen down the road.
HTML http://www.sunherald.com/sports/college/conference-usa/university-of-southern-mississippi/article83199052.html
Then there's always the spectre of Big East expansion.
Potentially bringing Uconn back into the fold.
HTML http://www.courant.com/sports/uconn-huskies/hc-jacobs-column-uconn-big-east-0219-20170218-column.html
Any one of these events could have a trickle down effect through
all of the conferences. Realignment never happens in a vacuum.
The biggest catalyst is likely to be anything involving the Big
12, and then the moves would happen from there. There could be a
lot of movement like in the great realignment of 2010-13, and
this time SBU will hopefully be in prime position to claim a
spot with our great academics, competitive programs and great
facilities.
There's also the possibility of the CAA football schools moving
to FBS as independents, then forming a new conference later. OR
that league forming as a part of the eastern split of CUSA.
Liberty going to FBS as independent has opened the door for
other schools to do the same.
HTML https://pilotonline.com/sports/columnist/harry-minium/minium-ncaa-exception-for-liberty-was-right-call-but-could/article_cccaf7d1-88de-5c93-bf5d-1943f64e9aaa.html
Interesting times are ahead! I also wouldn't be too shocked if a
move to the A10 or CAA happened for us before 2025. I used to be
vehemently anti CAA calling it a lateral move, but I'm starting
to reconsider my stance on that one.
#Post#: 20905--------------------------------------------------
Re: 2012-2020: Future of SBU Football - Conference Affiliation,
FBS Football, etc
DIR By: Chairman of the Board
Date: January 12, 2018, 8:02 am
---------------------------------------------------------
thanks! makes sense.
#Post#: 23797--------------------------------------------------
Re: 2012-2020: Future of SBU Football - Conference Affiliation,
FBS Football, etc
DIR By: Chairman of the Board
Date: November 1, 2018, 3:06 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
2 year extension for priore:
HTML http://sbufan.createaforum.com/general-discussion/shawn-heilbron/msg23796/#new<br
/>
#Post#: 23798--------------------------------------------------
Re: 2012-2020: Future of SBU Football - Conference Affiliation,
FBS Football, etc
DIR By: ecasadoSBU
Date: November 1, 2018, 3:54 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
The dreaded contract extension (for some of you) is here!
Lets go Seawolves!!! Make us Championship caliber Priore!!
#Post#: 23799--------------------------------------------------
Re: 2012-2020: Future of SBU Football - Conference Affiliation,
FBS Football, etc
DIR By: Hammertime
Date: November 1, 2018, 4:47 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Chairman of the Board link ---
>
> 2 year extension for priore:
HTML http://sbufan.createaforum.com/general-discussion/shawn-heilbron/msg23796/#new
>
--- End Quote ---
Not a shocker. I said all along he would get an extension. 2
years though is too long. Year to year is acceptable. Oh,
well. His record with getting SB to the Playoffs doesnt warrent
a 2 year extension. Anyway, what do I know..
*****************************************************
Page 33 of 35
DIR Previous Page
DIR Next Page