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#Post#: 10226--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: Ty Coleman Date: December 7, 2011, 7:17 pm
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Raul, I even questioned the guy's to start with. I have always
thought indigo wasn't in the origional imports until I ran
across these guy's. The first documented indigo was in a giant
racing homer, I have since found out it was in the west of
england tumblers, and therefore leads me to think it was in the
formation of the breed. Until you breed a indigo to a spread
bird you will call it bronze 99% of the time.
#Post#: 10227--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: raul carreiro Date: December 7, 2011, 7:28 pm
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[quote author=Ty Coleman link=topic=808.msg10226#msg10226
date=1323307061]
Raul, I even questioned the guy's to start with. I have always
thought indigo wasn't in the origional imports until I ran
across these guy's. The first documented indigo was in a giant
racing homer, I have since found out it was in the west of
england tumblers, and therefore leads me to think it was in the
formation of the breed. Until you breed a indigo to a spread
bird you will call it bronze 99% of the time.
[/quote]
Ty, most keep on saying this color or that color was not in the
original imports, thats fine but what was behind the Imports?
Pensom imported birds from various sources did he not? To me it
is logical that only those sources knew the truth about what was
or wasnt in these birds!
#Post#: 10228--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: 2y4life Date: December 7, 2011, 7:33 pm
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Cliff and Ty, which is more of a "color/rare" bird, cream or
yellow? Or do most roller guys consider them in the same class
of "color" and weak?
#Post#: 10229--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: Ty Coleman Date: December 7, 2011, 9:28 pm
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I agree Raul !
Tou, they are both dilute ash red, just different terms used by
different fanciers. Cream is normaly used to describe the bar
birds while yellow normally describes the check birds or the rec
yellow birds. We are a opinionated bunch and untruths run wild
all over our hobby. If I had weak yellows and shared them with
allot of people the opinion would be they are weak, and just the
opposite if they were good. There is good and bad birds of all
color's. Turner line andalusions are all over the place and they
represent there self real well so the over all opinion is that
andalusion birds are very good, there are also very poor ones
around also. Any color can be bred to be good and also poor.
#Post#: 10230--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: Ty Coleman Date: December 7, 2011, 9:34 pm
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Cliff, you fishing ? I felt sure you knew our dilute came from
WHP via Larry Pridmore. But I guess a document would be nice to
read to discredit it, lol
#Post#: 10232--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: Roll Down Date: December 7, 2011, 11:59 pm
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Just a F.Y.I. for Pensom breeders.
The very first bird banded in the newly formed original Pensom
Roller Club was a yellow bred by Joe Hein PRC 001 45.
(Documented in a letter from Joe Hein to Jerry Selinger -- which
he still has in his possession.) -- the letter not the yellow
LOL
Geo.
#Post#: 10234--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: Cliff Ball Date: December 8, 2011, 8:25 am
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Ty,
Yes, but knowing that fact doesn't dispel the notion that
Pensom's dilutes were not in the "mainstream" of his family. The
evidence that I have seen to date indicates that dilutes were
just as much a part of his family, though fewer in number, as
any other quality spinner of any other color. If Joe can find a
reference to disprove that, then maybe those purists have a
valid point. If not, then it validates the point that it is just
another rediculous notion perpetuated by a few color-prejudiced
roller fanciers with some kind of purist agenda.
Cliff
#Post#: 10235--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: Cliff Ball Date: December 8, 2011, 8:28 am
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[quote author=Roll Down link=topic=808.msg10232#msg10232
date=1323323951]
Just a F.Y.I. for Pensom breeders.
The very first bird banded in the newly formed original Pensom
Roller Club was a yellow bred by Joe Hein PRC 001 45.
(Documented in a letter from Joe Hein to Jerry Selinger -- which
he still has in his possession.) -- the letter not the yellow
LOL
Geo.
[/quote]
George,
Thanks. There is ample evidence of the presence of dilute in the
birds that Pensom obtained, bred and flew. But, for some reason,
some of these guys today live and die by the notion that they
were not part of the "mainstream" of his family. I know, it's
absurd, but that is their contention.
Cliff
#Post#: 10236--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: Cliff Ball Date: December 8, 2011, 8:35 am
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[quote author=2y4life link=topic=808.msg10228#msg10228
date=1323307995]
Cliff and Ty, which is more of a "color/rare" bird, cream or
yellow? Or do most roller guys consider them in the same class
of "color" and weak?
[/quote]
Tou,
Personally, I don't consider any of them as "rare" or "colored".
there are thousands of them around and they are consistantly
found among the winning kits from time to time in bars, checks,
grizzles, etc. Granted, there are fewer of them, but there may
be a host of reasons for that occurrence. That said, the creams
and yellow checks seem to be of the stronger character,
better-feathered and the better-performing than the recessive
yellows. But I have seen excellent performances in all the
varieties of yellow.
Cliff
#Post#: 10239--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: 2y4life Date: December 8, 2011, 9:58 am
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Oh, I'm not discounting Yellows at all because I know they can
perform. Dick Kollman said one of the best birds he saw when he
judged the NCF last year was a yellow bird in Don Simpson's 2010
Championship kit.
I know there are alot of guys that still consider yellow to be a
"color/rare" bird and my question is "Is cream considered to be
a rare color too like yellow is among many fanciers?"
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