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#Post#: 10186--------------------------------------------------
Pensom's color birds
By: markmidmo Date: December 6, 2011, 4:51 pm
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I realize this is a hot issue, so with a chill in the air and
snow on the ground I thought I'd stir it up with Ralph Hilton's
own words.
As most know the Hilton family was probably one of the best
colorful families that has existed. Clear colors and consumate
performance were his hallmarks. What I didn't realize is that
wasn't always the case. Prior to 1969 his family was tightly
bred on two black check bronze cocks.
In the American Pigeon Journal Roller issue Gail Peterson quotes
from Hilton correspondence: 'At the time of Bill's death [1969]
I was aware of the many colors he was keeping, so I decided it
was important to maintain a stud of the same cross section of
what Pensom was breeding, to preserve the colors of the true
Pensom family of Rollers as I knew them to be. I have preserved
the Pensom family colors more than any other individual I know."
At the time of Mr. Hilton's death on October 9, 1979, in his
loft he had most of the colors that can be found today - all
from Pensom stock. So next time someone speaks disparagingly
of the yellows, recessive reds or even the whites, remember if
Ralph Hilton could breed these as top-notch flyers in the 1970s
then we should be able to do the same today if we just apply
sound breeding and selection principles.
#Post#: 10189--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: 2y4life Date: December 6, 2011, 5:26 pm
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This has been done to death and those hardcore Pensomnites and
color haters will never accept the truth. I even have a picture
of Pensom with a champion roller of his that was a champion
cream while Pensom was LIVING IN ENGLAND.
#Post#: 10191--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: markmidmo Date: December 6, 2011, 5:36 pm
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One of the things historical research has taught me is to ignore
current day recollections and go all the way back to source
documents. This absolutely burns the "haters". As I've
collected the writings of Evans, Smith, Palona, Hilton, Pensom
and others it's been interesting to compare them with the
discussion threads in the archives. One of my favorite quotes
from Ray Sanchez is that Pensom is probably the most misquoted
pigeon man to have lived.
#Post#: 10192--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: raul carreiro Date: December 6, 2011, 5:37 pm
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2y4life, Mark did say there was a cold chill in the air! I guess
he wants some free heat LOL!
#Post#: 10216--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: joeb Date: December 7, 2011, 12:34 pm
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Pensom did in fact keep and raise recessive yellows. There are
pictures of them in his book . Look at the bird on page 68. This
was a yellow badge hen bred by WHP from yellows imported from
Ken Payne by John Spuria and Stan Plona. Also the yellow badge
on page 109 bred off the same imports. The cream bar badge on
page 7, NBRC 36-13 was one of his favorites. According to his
writings he did not mix the yellows with his main family but he
did breed them contrary to what some on here will have you
believe.
Keep em spinning
Joe B
#Post#: 10218--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: Cliff Ball Date: December 7, 2011, 1:28 pm
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Joe,
You said."According to his writings he did not mix the yellows
with his main family..."
Can you provide us with a reference on this statement? I have
heard it said before, but in all my (substantial) readings of
Pensom's writings, I have never been able to substantiate this
claim. Nor did Chan Grover indicate it when a couple of us
visited him before he died. According to Chan, the yellows were
a part of the performance family that Pensom bred.
Cliff
#Post#: 10220--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: joeb Date: December 7, 2011, 1:45 pm
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Cliff,
I will dig around and find the specific reference.
Joe B
#Post#: 10222--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: Cliff Ball Date: December 7, 2011, 1:55 pm
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Thanks for your help, Joe. I know it's a pain, but it would
really help resolve an issue that has been kicked around in the
hobby for quite some time without real documentation.
Cliff
#Post#: 10223--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: Ty Coleman Date: December 7, 2011, 6:50 pm
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Mark. I have found two breeders of the old line Smith birds that
have Indigo in them. They have never outcrossed and maintain a
true family from the birds from him. I'm not going to call any
names and start a war about it because people would want to
question the integrity of the guy's and it's not worth my time
arguing about it being there because it's there. ;)
#Post#: 10224--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pensom's color birds
By: raul carreiro Date: December 7, 2011, 7:05 pm
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[quote author=Ty Coleman link=topic=808.msg10223#msg10223
date=1323305417]
Mark. I have found two breeders of the old line Smith birds that
have Indigo in them. They have never outcrossed and maintain a
true family from the birds from him. I'm not going to call any
names and start a war about it because people would want to
question the integrity of the guy's and it's not worth my time
arguing about it being there because it's there. ;)
[/quote]
Hi Ty, I dont see any reason why anyone would question the
interigty of the old line Smith birds that have Indigo in them.
Is not Indigo just a color modifier?
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