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#Post#: 9361--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is It Always Wise To Cull?
DIR By: tom wingfield
Date: October 10, 2011, 2:51 pm
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i will tell you all from first hand experance , not many if any
of the old hands in this sport would not of culled 514 in a
heart beat if the bird was sick... i've seen many great birds
culled for sickness with out any treatment. by them... a lot
more people these days try to treat them... i do
#Post#: 9362--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is It Always Wise To Cull?
DIR By: Tony Chavarria
Date: October 10, 2011, 2:53 pm
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Hi Joe, in reading your post above, wherein I quoted the
following:
--- Quote from: joeb link ---
>
> ... If 514 had a form of cocci that I could not cure and be
100% sure she would not infect the rest of my loft, she would be
gone. JMHO respectfully! Keep em spinning Joe B
--- End Quote ---
I see that the long and short of it is you would have medicated
514. You would have attempted saving her. :D I can see your
point though, that if she is incurable and transmits disease to
birds around her, you would cull her. :'( That does makes
sense as she loses much value with being a chronic carrier of
disease. Although, I read once somewhere that these birds can be
cured with a month or so long treatment of various antibiotics
and supplements that treat deep tissue or something like that.
A good discussion no matter what each individuals decides to do.
It is ultimately a personal choice that is weighed against some
level of risk vs value... ;)
#Post#: 9364--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is It Always Wise To Cull?
DIR By: Cliff Ball
Date: October 11, 2011, 9:02 am
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Tony,
You asked, "Is it practical and affordable to take every bird
that comes down with the sniffles to an avian vet? I don't think
so."
I guess my response would still be YES. I just don't have many
birds that come down with "the sniffles". So when one becomes
ill, I want to know what I am dealing with. You may recall my
story a couple years ago about the bird that I saw fall off the
perch dead in the stock loft. When something like that happens,
I want to know why and how to treat it...SPECIFICALLY. And you
don't need an Avian vet, though one is preferred. Most any small
animal/exotics vet can handle a fecal float, respiratory panel,
and testing for mycotic (fungal) infections, coccidiosis, PMV
and/or paratyphoid or other diagnostics for the basics. Many of
these diseases manifest similar symptoms. The only one I feel
fairly certain about treating is canker...which I almost never
see, and can mimic respiratory inficetions in adults. If we make
our own diagnosis, and we are wrong, the sick bird is likely to
succomb before we figure it out...and other birds as well...
"I would guess that very few do..." I would guess that it's a
matter of finances and priorities.
Cliff
#Post#: 9365--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is It Always Wise To Cull?
DIR By: Tony Chavarria
Date: October 11, 2011, 10:18 am
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Hi Cliff,
So obviously, based on your post above, you would medicate.
Thanks for clarifying your reasons and logic.
Cliff, my asking the rhetorical question and answer: "Is it
practical and affordable to take every bird that comes down with
the sniffles to an avian vet? I don't think so." is to suggest
some things might merely be an over reaction to a minor problem.
That in no way implies I myself have many birds coming down with
"the sniffles", it is merely to suggest that there are other
less involved and expensive ways to handle a bird that is coming
down with something. Equating a bird with the sniffles to a bird
that falls dead off a perch is a bit of conflating... ;D
What you did by involving a vet when your bird fell dead off a
perch was a very wise thing to do. Getting a proper diagnosis so
that this problem did not rapidly spread to your other birds was
obviously a high priority as it would be to most fanciers.
Surprising incident created a high priority situation that
demanded some money be spent. Few would think otherswise. ;)
A bird with the sniffles is not something that would cause me to
rush the bird to the vet, period.
Sniffles = low priority thus minimal medicine expense (all in
one products, etc)
Bird falling dead = high priority and unlimited budget for
proper diagnosis and treatment
BTW: What ended up being the problem with the bird and what was
the treatment that the vet recommended? Did it spread to any
other birds? Did more die in the same manner? Thanks! :D
#Post#: 9368--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is It Always Wise To Cull?
DIR By: n00bR0113rs
Date: October 11, 2011, 10:45 am
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I voted "yes" on the poll, If the offspring of the 514 hen that
you have bred are better then your foundation hen, then cull it,
but if you are moving backwards and have birds that are not up
the the 514 hen standards then medicate and save the 514 Hen.
I would really stop and think really hard if i was going
forwards or backwards on my breeding program to breed better
birds.
Although i have not been in that position to cull a bird yet
since im still a rookie, after i see my birds in the air i would
raise up the standard everytime to make better birds. If
offsprings are equal/ pass the foundation pair of breeders then
i would cull.
#Post#: 9369--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is It Always Wise To Cull?
DIR By: Cliff Ball
Date: October 11, 2011, 10:50 am
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Tony,
The diagnosis was roundworms.....even though I worm every Spring
and Fall. The hen was fat and healthy on the outside...no
advance warning signs or symptoms. A massive hatching of larvae
and susequent migration of larva through and into vital organs
(the liver in this case) caused the demise of the bird...not
your typical death from host emaciation by the roundworm adults.
The vet recommended worming every 90 days. I lost no other birds
from that outbreak.
Cliff
#Post#: 9370--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is It Always Wise To Cull?
DIR By: Tony Chavarria
Date: October 11, 2011, 11:05 am
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Hi Cliff, so the bird kinda exploded on the inside! :-\
I remember a while back a thread regarding worming and should it
be down and how often. It got pretty heated for a bit. Have you
been following that prescription to worm every 90 days? What
product are you using? Thanks
#Post#: 9371--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is It Always Wise To Cull?
DIR By: Cliff Ball
Date: October 11, 2011, 11:32 am
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The avian pathologist recommended alternating the use of
Moxydectin (Siegal & Sons), which is ok during breeding;
Ivomectin (for pigeons...not the cattle or sheep wormers); and
Worm out gel (Foys).
Cliff
#Post#: 9373--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is It Always Wise To Cull?
DIR By: Tony Chavarria
Date: October 11, 2011, 1:12 pm
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Thank you
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