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#Post#: 7386--------------------------------------------------
North Central World Cup Regionals
By: Cliff Ball Date: May 26, 2011, 11:04 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Congratulations to Jay Knepp for qualifying in the North Central
Region with a very tough judge! Even though there are one or two
competitors that don't put any stock in regional wins, it is
still a credit to Jay and his family of birds, the Turner
family, to come out at the top of a field of thirty kits.....I
don't care what anyone says about it trying to discredit the
accomplishment! Jay's team is always finishing near the top.
Well done, Jay.
Cliff
#Post#: 7388--------------------------------------------------
Re: North Central World Cup Regionals
By: MOTHERLODELOFTS Date: May 26, 2011, 11:28 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Good job Jay !!! Cliff, why would you try to start a negative
problem so early in the morning ? Jay had a few families on the
property when I was there , not just Turners. His cream will
rise to the top as everybodys. As always the finals is where the
rubber meets the road , but first you have to get there.. And
again good job Jay , good to see you stepping up to the plate
beyond the 11 bird.
Scott
#Post#: 7389--------------------------------------------------
Re: North Central World Cup Regionals
By: Cliff Ball Date: May 26, 2011, 11:48 am
---------------------------------------------------------
It's lunch time here, Scott...but Good Morning to you. I agree.
The cream definitely rises to the top...of the regions....and of
the country. I spoke with Jay to be sure what birds he flew, and
it was a kit of yearling (2010) Turners that qualified for him.
Interesting note: it was a kit of yearlings that won it for me
also over my old-bird team. So now it's a tough call as to
whether to stay with the young birds (were they just lucky?) or
whether to go with the old-birds, even though they had a bad
day. I am training both kits and will decide, depending on how
they hold up under the preparation for the finals.
Cliff
PS I didn't mention any names in my post...but if the shoe
fits...for goodness sakes, wear it! LOL!
#Post#: 7390--------------------------------------------------
Re: North Central World Cup Regionals
By: MOTHERLODELOFTS Date: May 26, 2011, 12:03 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Cliff it is beyond my understanding on why you would care what
he flew. Around here we could care less what is flown , it is
much more about the flyer.
As for you and your fly, with what seems to be a solid judge
looking for real breaks vrs activity. I would be careful a
youngbird team that is still in development and a knack for
quick triggers, not that a youngbird team can't be good. But
they can certainly be inconsistant as a real working team as a
team depending on the day.
[quote author=Cliff Ball link=topic=562.msg7389#msg7389
date=1306428483]
It's lunch time here, Scott...but Good Morning to you. I spoke
with Jay to be sure what birds he flew, and it was a kit of
yearling (2010) Turners that qualified for him. Interesting
note: it was a kit of yearlings that won it for me also over my
old-bird team. So now it's a tough call as to whether to stay
with the young birds (were they just lucky?) or whether to go
with the old-birds, even though they had a bad day. I am
training both kits and will decide, depending on how they hold
up under the preparation for the finals.
Cliff
PS I didn't mention any names in my post...but if the shoe
fits...for goodness sakes, wear it! LOL!
[/quote]
#Post#: 7392--------------------------------------------------
Re: North Central World Cup Regionals
By: joeb Date: May 26, 2011, 12:10 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Well done Jay!
Scott, I tend to agree with you on the old birds vs the young
ones as the YB kits tend to be a little more inconsistent. But
if I had a kit of yearlings that I thought could cut the
mustard, I wouldn't hesitate to go with them.
Keep em spinning
Joe B
#Post#: 7394--------------------------------------------------
Re: North Central World Cup Regionals
By: MOTHERLODELOFTS Date: May 26, 2011, 12:38 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
You know Joe I was just thinking on this. I think if it is one
of those days where birds just want to fly due to bad air then a
youngbird team is more inclined to work more settled down where
the oldbirds are more on the stiff side.
But if it is a day with more of a charge in the air then the
Y/Bs will roll more in a over amped mode where a solid old bird
team will excel.
Kind of along the lines of one stormy regionial fly I refused to
fly either by A team or B team due to it was just a moot point
along with fearing losses for nothing. With a yard full of
people bending my ear about just flying something I turned loose
a scrub kit of mainly strong stiff cocks. They got pushed over
the hill in an instant out of sight , not that it mattered as
figured the fly was over for me at that point anyway.
A bit later they fought their way back and with the wind as a
stimulant actually mustered some breaks , the wind added depth
as it tends to do and I ended up qualifying. There was a real
lesson learned on that one for me. If I remember right in the
finals my A team ended up 12th under John Weins and I was ribbed
about not flying the scrub kit since that is what qualified me ,
most of which was culled over time.
[quote author=joeb link=topic=562.msg7392#msg7392
date=1306429804]
Well done Jay!
Scott, I tend to agree with you on the old birds vs the young
ones as the YB kits tend to be a little more inconsistent. But
if I had a kit of yearlings that I thought could cut the
mustard, I wouldn't hesitate to go with them.
Keep em spinning
Joe B
[/quote]
#Post#: 7401--------------------------------------------------
Re: North Central World Cup Regionals
By: Cliff Ball Date: May 26, 2011, 2:16 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Scott
I care because we fly the same family of birds....because we
swap birds..... and because, I know he has a few birds from
other families and I want to know which birds are excelling. If
you give birds to a flyer whom you were monitoring, wouldn't you
care if your birds did well? Kinda like Tony wanting to see his
Ruby influenced Fullerton birds do well. I bet KGB was very
pleased when you did very well with his birds, and I bet he
monitored how you did with them. I suspect you traded a few back
and forth and compared notes. That's all it is. It is beyond my
understanding why you would care! LOL! I do agree that many
have good birds, and often times, it is the better managed birds
that win.
Cliff
[quote author=MOTHERLODELOFTS link=topic=562.msg7390#msg7390
date=1306429390]
Cliff it is beyond my understanding on why you would care what
he flew. Around here we could care less what is flown , it is
much more about the flyer.
As for you and your fly, with what seems to be a solid judge
looking for real breaks vrs activity. I would be careful a
youngbird team that is still in development and a knack for
quick triggers, not that a youngbird team can't be good. But
they can certainly be inconsistant as a real working team as a
team depending on the day.
[quote author=Cliff Ball link=topic=562.msg7389#msg7389
date=1306428483]
It's lunch time here, Scott...but Good Morning to you. I spoke
with Jay to be sure what birds he flew, and it was a kit of
yearling (2010) Turners that qualified for him. Interesting
note: it was a kit of yearlings that won it for me also over my
old-bird team. So now it's a tough call as to whether to stay
with the young birds (were they just lucky?) or whether to go
with the old-birds, even though they had a bad day. I am
training both kits and will decide, depending on how they hold
up under the preparation for the finals.
Cliff
PS I didn't mention any names in my post...but if the shoe
fits...for goodness sakes, wear it! LOL!
[/quote]
[/quote]
#Post#: 7402--------------------------------------------------
Re: North Central World Cup Regionals
By: MOTHERLODELOFTS Date: May 26, 2011, 2:30 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
No Cliff we never swap birds as there is no reason to .. Nor do
I track my birds in others hands as I don't need to pump my ego
.. Kenny and I have two seperate programs and directions where
the birds is concerned.
In fact the same holds true with all those that I stay in
contact with , we rarely talk about families as there are far
more important things to discuss where these birds are
concerned.
This game is far more about individule effort and stock sence
than particular families. Like I have said before, it isn't
about the family it is about finding the right few key birds to
build a program around where you don't have to rely on the
numbers game to try and be competitive.
[quote author=Cliff Ball link=topic=562.msg7401#msg7401
date=1306437405]
Scott
I care because we fly the same family of birds....because we
swap birds..... and because, I know he has a few birds from
other families and I want to know which birds are excelling. If
you give birds to a flyer whom you were monitoring, wouldn't you
care if your birds did well? Kinda like Tony wanting to see his
Ruby influenced Fullerton birds do well. I bet KGB was very
pleased when you did very well with his birds, and I bet he
monitored how you did with them. I suspect you traded a few back
and forth and compared notes. That's all it is. It is beyond my
understanding why you would care! LOL! I do agree that many
have good birds, and often times, it is the better managed birds
that win.
Cliff
[quote author=MOTHERLODELOFTS link=topic=562.msg7390#msg7390
date=1306429390]
Cliff it is beyond my understanding on why you would care what
he flew. Around here we could care less what is flown , it is
much more about the flyer.
As for you and your fly, with what seems to be a solid judge
looking for real breaks vrs activity. I would be careful a
youngbird team that is still in development and a knack for
quick triggers, not that a youngbird team can't be good. But
they can certainly be inconsistant as a real working team as a
team depending on the day.
[quote author=Cliff Ball link=topic=562.msg7389#msg7389
date=1306428483]
It's lunch time here, Scott...but Good Morning to you. I spoke
with Jay to be sure what birds he flew, and it was a kit of
yearling (2010) Turners that qualified for him. Interesting
note: it was a kit of yearlings that won it for me also over my
old-bird team. So now it's a tough call as to whether to stay
with the young birds (were they just lucky?) or whether to go
with the old-birds, even though they had a bad day. I am
training both kits and will decide, depending on how they hold
up under the preparation for the finals.
Cliff
PS I didn't mention any names in my post...but if the shoe
fits...for goodness sakes, wear it! LOL!
[/quote]
[/quote]
[/quote]
#Post#: 7403--------------------------------------------------
Re: North Central World Cup Regionals
By: Cliff Ball Date: May 26, 2011, 2:55 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Scott
You bring up an interesting point. Should we fly the birds that
we qualified with, in the finals? Is there any unwritten,
unspoken expectations for any flyer to try to fly as many of the
regional winning birds as he can, in the finals? I think, most
will tend to think, any win goes to the flyer ( NOT THE BIRDS)
and the make up of his teams, are 100% at his sole discretion.
Cliff
[quote author=MOTHERLODELOFTS link=topic=562.msg7394#msg7394
date=1306431488]
You know Joe I was just thinking on this. I think if it is one
of those days where birds just want to fly due to bad air then a
youngbird team is more inclined to work more settled down where
the oldbirds are more on the stiff side.
But if it is a day with more of a charge in the air then the
Y/Bs will roll more in a over amped mode where a solid old bird
team will excel.
Kind of along the lines of one stormy regionial fly I refused to
fly either by A team or B team due to it was just a moot point
along with fearing losses for nothing. With a yard full of
people bending my ear about just flying something I turned loose
a scrub kit of mainly strong stiff cocks. They got pushed over
the hill in an instant out of sight , not that it mattered as
figured the fly was over for me at that point anyway.
A bit later they fought their way back and with the wind as a
stimulant actually mustered some breaks , the wind added depth
as it tends to do and I ended up qualifying. There was a real
lesson learned on that one for me. If I remember right in the
finals my A team ended up 12th under John Weins and I was ribbed
about not flying the scrub kit since that is what qualified me ,
most of which was culled over time.
[quote author=joeb link=topic=562.msg7392#msg7392
date=1306429804]
Well done Jay!
Scott, I tend to agree with you on the old birds vs the young
ones as the YB kits tend to be a little more inconsistent. But
if I had a kit of yearlings that I thought could cut the
mustard, I wouldn't hesitate to go with them.
Keep em spinning
Joe B
[/quote]
[/quote]
#Post#: 7405--------------------------------------------------
Re: North Central World Cup Regionals
By: Cliff Ball Date: May 26, 2011, 3:15 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Hehehehe. You're so full of it, Scott. Sorry, my friend. I just
don't believe you when you say that in your first couple of
years after getting birds from KGB that you didn't try any other
birds from him, or didn't compare notes on performance and
production of certain pairs. It has nothing to do with pumping
your ego. It's called cultivating friendship and comraderie in
the sport.....finding our how certain pairings and certain
sub-lines are producing.
And this line of yours, "we rarely talk about families as there
are far more important things to discuss where these birds are
concerned.This game is far more about individule effort and
stock sence than particular families".....is this the real Scott
Campbell? We have all heard you post specifically and
consistantly about the stability and problems you believe are
inherent in specific families that you have little experience
with, such as the Turners. I don't ever believe I have heard you
reference the fact that it may be individual birds at fault. You
always fault the family!
And I am definitely filing this statement away of yours for
posterity..."This game is far more about individule effort and
stock sence than particular families. Like I have said before,
it isn't about the family it is about finding the right few key
birds to build a program around where you don't have to rely on
the numbers game to try and be competitive".....though I agree
whole-heartedly! LOL!
Cliff
[quote author=MOTHERLODELOFTS link=topic=562.msg7402#msg7402
date=1306438220]
No Cliff we never swap birds as there is no reason to .. Nor do
I track my birds in others hands as I don't need to pump my ego
.. Kenny and I have two seperate programs and directions where
the birds is concerned.
In fact the same holds true with all those that I stay in
contact with , we rarely talk about families as there are far
more important things to discuss where these birds are
concerned.
This game is far more about individule effort and stock sence
than particular families. Like I have said before, it isn't
about the family it is about finding the right few key birds to
build a program around where you don't have to rely on the
numbers game to try and be competitive.
[quote author=Cliff Ball link=topic=562.msg7401#msg7401
date=1306437405]
Scott
I care because we fly the same family of birds....because we
swap birds..... and because, I know he has a few birds from
other families and I want to know which birds are excelling. If
you give birds to a flyer whom you were monitoring, wouldn't you
care if your birds did well? Kinda like Tony wanting to see his
Ruby influenced Fullerton birds do well. I bet KGB was very
pleased when you did very well with his birds, and I bet he
monitored how you did with them. I suspect you traded a few back
and forth and compared notes. That's all it is. It is beyond my
understanding why you would care! LOL! I do agree that many
have good birds, and often times, it is the better managed birds
that win.
Cliff
[quote author=MOTHERLODELOFTS link=topic=562.msg7390#msg7390
date=1306429390]
Cliff it is beyond my understanding on why you would care what
he flew. Around here we could care less what is flown , it is
much more about the flyer.
As for you and your fly, with what seems to be a solid judge
looking for real breaks vrs activity. I would be careful a
youngbird team that is still in development and a knack for
quick triggers, not that a youngbird team can't be good. But
they can certainly be inconsistant as a real working team as a
team depending on the day.
[quote author=Cliff Ball link=topic=562.msg7389#msg7389
date=1306428483]
It's lunch time here, Scott...but Good Morning to you. I spoke
with Jay to be sure what birds he flew, and it was a kit of
yearling (2010) Turners that qualified for him. Interesting
note: it was a kit of yearlings that won it for me also over my
old-bird team. So now it's a tough call as to whether to stay
with the young birds (were they just lucky?) or whether to go
with the old-birds, even though they had a bad day. I am
training both kits and will decide, depending on how they hold
up under the preparation for the finals.
Cliff
PS I didn't mention any names in my post...but if the shoe
fits...for goodness sakes, wear it! LOL!
[/quote]
[/quote]
[/quote]
[/quote]
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