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#Post#: 6157--------------------------------------------------
Birmingham Roller "breed" Question
DIR By: 2y4life
Date: April 18, 2011, 9:23 am
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I know this is something that has been done quite often but my
question is a bit different. In dogs, you can have a purebred
Golden Retriever that does not "retrieve" at all like my sister
in MN has, yet is still considered a true/purebred Golden
Retriever.
Now in our Birmingham Rollers, if a pure Birmingham Roller does
not roll at all and we're assuming the birds have never been
outcrossed and are pure, are they still considered Birmingham
Rollers? I know there's always this question of breed standard
but since we do apparently have a breed standard set for BRs, is
a non-rolling Birmingham Roller is still a Birmingham Roller,
just like a Golden Retriever is still a Golden Retriever even if
it doesn't retrieve?
#Post#: 6158--------------------------------------------------
Re: Birmingham Roller "breed" Question
DIR By: MOTHERLODELOFTS
Date: April 18, 2011, 9:31 am
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Of course it is , if it is a well bred bird it's strength
mentaly is over riding the roll impulse , such a bird still has
the capability to produce roll due to it's genetic package which
is Birmingham Roller. I don't think that I have ever had a bird
that didnt do at least something given time... there is a reason
that a Birmingham Roller can be reconized as such when thrown in
with many other various breeds.. with many of the color birds
this is not so even if they were painted a standard Birmingham
color
#Post#: 6162--------------------------------------------------
Re: Birmingham Roller "breed" Question
DIR By: wannaroll
Date: April 18, 2011, 9:58 am
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--- Quote from: MOTHERLODELOFTS link ---
>
> Of course it is , if it is a well bred bird it's strength
mentaly is over riding the roll impulse , such a bird still has
the capability to produce roll due to it's genetic package which
is Birmingham Roller. I don't think that I have ever had a bird
that didnt do at least something given time... there is a reason
that a Birmingham Roller can be reconized as such when thrown in
with many other various breeds.
>
--- End Quote ---
Scott, do you think with color birds that they are just not
going to be as consistant as the traditional BR's. I know you
have seen many a color bird kits over the years. Do you think
flyers with color have to cull more birds to fill a kit?
#Post#: 6165--------------------------------------------------
Re: Birmingham Roller "breed" Question
DIR By: BigShawn
Date: April 18, 2011, 10:33 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Scott, I like the honesty in all that you write. I think my
question to you is do you stock that same mentaly strong non
rolling BR like the breeder of the nonretriever?
--- Quote from: MOTHERLODELOFTS link ---
>
> Of course it is , if it is a well bred bird it's strength
mentaly is over riding the roll impulse , such a bird still has
the capability to produce roll due to it's genetic package which
is Birmingham Roller. I don't think that I have ever had a bird
that didnt do at least something given time... there is a reason
that a Birmingham Roller can be reconized as such when thrown in
with many other various breeds.. with many of the color birds
this is not so even if they were painted a standard Birmingham
color
>
--- End Quote ---
#Post#: 6168--------------------------------------------------
Re: Birmingham Roller "breed" Question
DIR By: 2y4life
Date: April 18, 2011, 10:36 am
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Again, this is not meant to be a color issue. Simply put, I know
there are several top flyers that occasionally (one or two every
couple of years), get BRs that simply don't roll. Since the
birds are pure BRs, they carry the ro gene but don't express it
for whatever reason. I, myself, believe that these birds should
still be called BRs, but do the rest of you consider them BRs if
they birds don't roll?
#Post#: 6169--------------------------------------------------
Re: Birmingham Roller "breed" Question
DIR By: joeb
Date: April 18, 2011, 10:44 am
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Tou,
I call them culls and I don't have any use for them. They don't
hang around here very long after they are 1 yr old and don't
roll with proper style and velocity.
Keep em spinning
Joe
#Post#: 6170--------------------------------------------------
Re: Birmingham Roller "breed" Question
DIR By: 2y4life
Date: April 18, 2011, 10:58 am
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--- Quote from: joeb link ---
>
> Tou,
> I call them culls and I don't have any use for them. They
don't hang around here very long after they are 1 yr old and
don't roll with proper style and velocity.
> Keep em spinning
> Joe
>
--- End Quote ---
Yes, I'd call them culls as well but again, the question is do
you still consider non-rolling Birmingham Rollers as Birmingham
Rollers?
#Post#: 6172--------------------------------------------------
Re: Birmingham Roller "breed" Question
DIR By: WhiteWing
Date: April 18, 2011, 11:11 am
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--- Quote from: 2y4life link ---
>
>
> Yes, I'd call them culls as well but again, the question is do
you still consider non-rolling Birmingham Rollers as Birmingham
Rollers?
>
--- End Quote ---
I think you have answered your own question with your Golden
Retriever example. Yes, it's still a Birmingham Roller even if
it doesn't roll. Just because he doesn't perform, doesn't mean
the pigeon changes breeds ;)
#Post#: 6173--------------------------------------------------
Re: Birmingham Roller "breed" Question
DIR By: Joe Asaro
Date: April 18, 2011, 11:46 am
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If a bird flips fast and stays with the kit and shows proper
wing action you could have a good kit bird that is one of the
late bloomers 1 year or longer to come in.The problem is now
days with all the death in the sky not very good odds of
reaching a birds potential. :( Joe
#Post#: 6174--------------------------------------------------
Re: Birmingham Roller "breed" Question
DIR By: MOTHERLODELOFTS
Date: April 18, 2011, 12:20 pm
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Absolutly not Shawn.. although some will claim goods out of such
birds including the other end of the spectrum that being roll
downs , and I don't doubt the results.. but we have to look past
just the F-1s , for myself the goal is to get some form of
consistancy. I have had other families in the past that hit all
over the board, some rolldowns and some stiffs with a few
inbetween, all out of the same pair. This is what you get from
breeding from both ends of the spectrum.
--- Quote from: BigShawn link ---
>
> Scott, I like the honesty in all that you write. I think my
question to you is do you stock that same mentaly strong non
rolling BR like the breeder of the nonretriever?[quote
author=MOTHERLODELOFTS link=topic=492.msg6158#msg6158
date=1303137096]
> Of course it is , if it is a well bred bird it's strength
mentaly is over riding the roll impulse , such a bird still has
the capability to produce roll due to it's genetic package which
is Birmingham Roller. I don't think that I have ever had a bird
that didnt do at least something given time... there is a reason
that a Birmingham Roller can be reconized as such when thrown in
with many other various breeds.. with many of the color birds
this is not so even if they were painted a standard Birmingham
color
>
--- End Quote ---
[/quote]
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