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#Post#: 3054--------------------------------------------------
Three acid tests?
DIR By: Oneoff
Date: September 6, 2015, 3:43 am
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Experience, plausibility, and the ‘inner voice’ are the three
factors that I am currently inclined to rely upon in my struggle
to resolve my own ‘instinctive’ faith in God.
For example, one of the things that ‘experience’ tells me, is
that there is no ‘stand apart’ class of people who are ‘born
again’ in the way that post Reformation Evangelicals claim.
Secondly, one of the things that plausibility tells me, is that
such as is pleasing and acceptable to God has to have remained
basically unchanged throughout the ages of man.
And thirdly one of the things that ‘the inner voice’ tells me,
is that whilst Jesus may well be the only ‘way, truth, and life’
for those who have heard what ‘we’ call the Gospel Message,
there just have to be other ‘ways’ for those myriads of mankind
who ‘die/have died’ without ever hearing that particular Gospel
Message. Although I have a problem when confronted by those who
have heard ‘our’ Gospel Message, but still choose to follow one
of the other ways chosen by those who have never heard ‘our’
Gospel message. Maybe the various ‘faiths’ (including
‘Christianity’) all come to God in a way that is acceptable to
God, albeit that they each detail their ‘way’ differently.
Giving credible consideration to “those myriads of mankind who
‘die/have died’ without ever hearing ‘our’ particular Gospel
Message” just has to be the central factor that, for me,
determines whether or not one’s faith passes both the
‘plausibility’ and the ‘inner voice’ tests. Apart from those few
who believe in Universal Reconciliation I have yet to find an
Evangelical Christian whose faith gives adequate consideration
to that factor (most don’t even give it a second thought).
#Post#: 3055--------------------------------------------------
Re: Three acid tests?
DIR By: Kerry
Date: September 7, 2015, 7:05 am
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--- Quote from: Oneoff link ---
>
> Experience, plausibility, and the ‘inner voice’ are the three
factors that I am currently inclined to rely upon in my struggle
to resolve my own ‘instinctive’ faith in God.
>
> For example, one of the things that ‘experience’ tells me, is
that there is no ‘stand apart’ class of people who are ‘born
again’ in the way that post Reformation Evangelicals claim.
--- End Quote ---
Experience says that; and the people who claim to be "born
again" can never answer the questions I ask them about Jesus'
conversation with Nicodemus. Their starting assumption is that
they know what it is and that Nicodemus was a dummy. I am
always suspicious of giving a text a self-congratulatory
interpretation. Notably they cannot explain where "born again"
is found in the Old Testament. How could Jesus expect
Nicodemus to know about it unless it was Old Testament material?
Secondly they can never explain why they can't move like the
wind as Jesus said those born again can do. Thirdly, they
seldom venture an opinion about what born of water and born of
Spirit means. Are those the same birth or are they two births?
They follow a vain tradition of men which does not relate to
reality and is not founded on a reasonable reading of the Bible.
--- Quote ---
> Secondly, one of the things that plausibility tells me, is
that such as is pleasing and acceptable to God has to have
remained basically unchanged throughout the ages of man.
--- End Quote ---
This is common sense, I think, and should be known by anyone
with the "smallest grain" of faith. This statement comes with
the proviso, of course, that God may behave differently
depending on what men do in certain cases; but the manner of
adapting to man's behavior has to be consistent. If God is
capricious God, we are wasting our time talking or thinking
about God since we could not understand anything about Him.
He could be completely different tomorrow.
This does not prove that God never changes; but the theory that
He does is not worth investigating since it leads nowhere. The
only assumption that could lead anywhere is that God is
consistent.
And if common sense isn't enough, we can rely on Scripture too
which says God does not change. I would say any person should
be able to discern that God does not change; and when He reads
the Scripture which states that, he should recognize at once
that that passage is true. He does not "believe" it just
because it's written down. It is something which can be known;
and some things are known even if we never put the idea
together in our own heads.
--- Quote ---
> And thirdly one of the things that ‘the inner voice’ tells me,
is that whilst Jesus may well be the only ‘way, truth, and life’
for those who have heard what ‘we’ call the Gospel Message,
there just have to be other ‘ways’ for those myriads of mankind
who ‘die/have died’ without ever hearing that particular Gospel
Message. Although I have a problem when confronted by those who
have heard ‘our’ Gospel Message, but still choose to follow one
of the other ways chosen by those who have never heard ‘our’
Gospel message. Maybe the various ‘faiths’ (including
‘Christianity’) all come to God in a way that is acceptable to
God, albeit that they each detail their ‘way’ differently.
--- End Quote ---
If we cab believe that God adapts His actions according to those
of men, then it is easy to believe that various faiths are a
response of Heaven to varying conditions on earth. It would
be tedious indeed if everyone thought alike. Variety is the
spice of life; and if we believe in God as Creator, we should
believe He likes variety when we see how varied life forms are.
I think of the spiritual hierarchy as resembling a tree. There
is a main trunk; but then there are various branches and smaller
branches on those. We may not perceive all the connections
because of our limited viewpoint; but the only tragedy is not
being "connected" to this Tree of Life. If we are severed,
then we must be grafted back on. Where we each as individuals
belong in the Tree of Life is unique. Every tribe, nation and
tongue have their areas; and I am convinced God is intent on
preserving them all, just as John asserts in Revelation. For
one to be missing would be a tragedy, like a beautiful tree
deformed by a big gap where one branch did not survive.
--- Quote ---
> Giving credible consideration to “those myriads of mankind who
‘die/have died’ without ever hearing ‘our’ particular Gospel
Message” just has to be the central factor that, for me,
determines whether or not one’s faith passes both the
‘plausibility’ and the ‘inner voice’ tests. Apart from those few
who believe in Universal Reconciliation I have yet to find an
Evangelical Christian whose faith gives adequate consideration
to that factor (most don’t even give it a second thought).
--- End Quote ---
They may be content believing in their own salvation; but they
may also be in a surprise or two if their hearts are not
softened. God may have to refashion the clay in order to lead
them to perfection.
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