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#Post#: 17334--------------------------------------------------
Re: Referee replaced during matches
By: John Treleven Date: April 27, 2020, 10:17 am
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The 3-6 defeat at Wembley in 1953 is/was often talked of as
England's first defeat by an overseas nation
although that overlooks Eire winning at Goodison in 1949
Also neglected is the return match in Budapest later in the
season when Hungary proved that the first match was no fluke
HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pt8MLOoYAhQ
#Post#: 17335--------------------------------------------------
Re: Referee replaced during matches
By: bmb Date: April 27, 2020, 11:32 am
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[quote author=John Treleven link=topic=869.msg17334#msg17334
date=1588000647]
The 3-6 defeat at Wembley in 1953 is/was often talked of as
England's first defeat by an overseas nation
although that overlooks Eire winning at Goodison in 1949
Also neglected is the return match in Budapest later in the
season when Hungary proved that the first match was no fluke
[/quote]
They might be neglected here but in Hungary the matches are
shown on M4 (the national sports channel) every anniversary,
along with all the Olympic wins, world cup matches etc. Hard to
believe 70 years ago Hungary was the top team in the world and
was so for a number of years especially when you see the state
of the game there now.
It really fell apart in 1956, after the revolution the National
team players all defected along with most of the
athletes/handball players/water polo players etc who had been
allowed to leave for the Olympics just before the brutal end of
the revolution. Very few returned home after those olympics &
sport was simply not important anymore. During the USSR
occupation sport was the only thing permissible to show any
national pride, the defections were a huge embarrassment to the
USSR and the retaliation quite brutal. For Hungarians there was
no national pride left. Handball/Water polo recovered well,
they are more popular, especially water polo. Football is only
really now starting to starting to slowly recover but
generations of fans have been lost to foreign leagues. Big
strides have been made the past 10 years or so, Mr Orbán is a
big footballing man & a government scheme to see all NBI teams
with modern stadiums is going well, there has been some new
academies but the emphasis has been on new stadia not on
improving coaching and the facilities related to that aspect so
the academies are lacking. The success in the Euros 2016 has
helped and both Vidi & Fradi have made the group stages of the
Europa League across the last 2 seasons so it is improving. Hard
now though to try and compete with the CL/EL/PL/Serie
A/Bundesliga in terms of fan engagement, our youngsters want to
see sort of football at home and don't. Our top league is
anything between the bottom of L2 & mid championship depending
on the day, the team, the referee! There is so much amateurish
stuff still, cup games being played midday because there are no
floodlights, and 2nd division has only recently started having
official 4th officials, a referee manager stuck in the 80's and
yet we have the best league president we could wish for. Mr
Csányi is ace but too naive & too reliant on reports on progress
given to him by people stuck in the past where the reality is
progress is too slow and not correctly focused. It's fun
watching it grow though & I do love every bit of our league, we
just need another few 10's of thousands like me! Haha!
Sorry I derailed!
#Post#: 17345--------------------------------------------------
Re: Referee replaced during matches
By: John Treleven Date: April 28, 2020, 12:01 pm
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Sat 11th Dec 1971
Huddersfield Town v Crystal Palace
Div. 1
Leslie "Les" Hayes (Doncaster) replaced Dennis Pugh (Chester)
who had been taken ill before the match (Hayes did the whole
match)
#Post#: 17354--------------------------------------------------
Re: Referee replaced during matches
By: jad Date: April 29, 2020, 7:15 am
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[quote author=John Treleven link=topic=869.msg17329#msg17329
date=1587994843]
J.J. Baxter - the elusive first name is still needed for this
RAF man (Warrant Officer)
Interestingly listed as Hereford (a typo?) as he joined the F.L.
refs list in 56-57 as Royston (Hertford) as stationed at nearby
RAF Bassingbourn
[/quote]
The footballfacts.ru web-site sometimes reproduces the relevant
pages of match programmes. The programmes for West Bromwich
Albion vs Portsmouth (3 December 1955) and Chelsea vs Preston
North End (31 March 1956) both list Mr Baxter as coming from
Hereford, but that for Aston Villa vs Nottingham Forest (30
April 1958) indicates Bassingbourn, Herts. Perhaps he was
reposted. I am afraid I can't help with the first name.
An afterthought: sending a serving member of the armed forces to
a Warsaw Pact country in 1955 was a very odd thing to do.
#Post#: 17355--------------------------------------------------
Re: Referee replaced during matches
By: jad Date: April 29, 2020, 7:28 am
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The match between Hungary and the USSR was a return fixture.
The first match was played in Moscow at the Dinamo Stadium on 26
September 1954. That game was also refereed by Arthur Ellis,
though the linesmen came from Czechoslovakia and Finland. What
I find curious is that both games finished 1-1. Given that
Hungary at that time were, as bmb says, the top team in the
world and that the Soviet Union was still an emerging football
nation, I can't help wondering if these were 'diplomatic' draws.
#Post#: 17358--------------------------------------------------
Re: Referee replaced during matches
By: John Treleven Date: April 29, 2020, 11:08 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Arthur Ellis when appointed to internationals was often allowed
to bring his own two lino's.
He often took his younger brother Frank, then operating in the
Yorkshire League, as one of them
Frank ran a line at 1964 Charity Shield
#Post#: 17359--------------------------------------------------
Re: Referee replaced during matches
By: mande70 Date: April 29, 2020, 12:13 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=jad link=topic=869.msg17354#msg17354
date=1588162534]
[quote author=John Treleven link=topic=869.msg17329#msg17329
date=1587994843]
J.J. Baxter - the elusive first name is still needed for this
RAF man (Warrant Officer)
Interestingly listed as Hereford (a typo?) as he joined the F.L.
refs list in 56-57 as Royston (Hertford) as stationed at nearby
RAF Bassingbourn
[/quote]
The footballfacts.ru web-site sometimes reproduces the relevant
pages of match programmes. The programmes for West Bromwich
Albion vs Portsmouth (3 December 1955) and Chelsea vs Preston
North End (31 March 1956) both list Mr Baxter as coming from
Hereford, but that for Aston Villa vs Nottingham Forest (30
April 1958) indicates Bassingbourn, Herts. Perhaps he was
reposted. I am afraid I can't help with the first name.
An afterthought: sending a serving member of the armed forces to
a Warsaw Pact country in 1955 was a very odd thing to do.
[/quote]
Baxter was not the ref for the west brom v pompey match in 55,
it was r.e tarratt [horsham]
Baxter's first name was James [Jim] report in Daily Herald 14
Oct 1957, lists him at a court case after fans threw objects at
him in reprisal for one of his decisions at the Bournemouth v
Southend match.
#Post#: 17362--------------------------------------------------
Re: Referee replaced during matches
By: bmb Date: April 29, 2020, 4:09 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=mande70 link=topic=869.msg17359#msg17359
date=1588180403]
[quote author=jad link=topic=869.msg17354#msg17354
date=1588162534]
[quote author=John Treleven link=topic=869.msg17329#msg17329
date=1587994843]
J.J. Baxter - the elusive first name is still needed for this
RAF man (Warrant Officer)
Interestingly listed as Hereford (a typo?) as he joined the F.L.
refs list in 56-57 as Royston (Hertford) as stationed at nearby
RAF Bassingbourn
[/quote]
The footballfacts.ru web-site sometimes reproduces the relevant
pages of match programmes. The programmes for West Bromwich
Albion vs Portsmouth (3 December 1955) and Chelsea vs Preston
North End (31 March 1956) both list Mr Baxter as coming from
Hereford, but that for Aston Villa vs Nottingham Forest (30
April 1958) indicates Bassingbourn, Herts. Perhaps he was
reposted. I am afraid I can't help with the first name.
An afterthought: sending a serving member of the armed forces to
a Warsaw Pact country in 1955 was a very odd thing to do.
[/quote]
Baxter was not the ref for the west brom v pompey match in 55,
it was r.e tarratt [horsham]
Baxter's first name was James [Jim] report in Daily Herald 14
Oct 1957, lists him at a court case after fans threw objects at
him in reprisal for one of his decisions at the Bournemouth v
Southend match.
[/quote]
Probably the famous cushions! In the old main stand we had
wooden seats and you could rent a cushion for them - they were
like a 1 foot x 1 foot 2 inch thick brick, heavy but launched
right could go quite a distance and they blimmin hurt when you
got hit with them! In the good old days instead of shouting
abuse at referees when a decision was deemed dreadful the main
stand would launch cushions en masse! Being little and sat right
at the front of that stand I had a fair few bruises over the
years from those darn things! I have one hanging on my balcony
that was rescued from a cupboard when the old ground was being
torn down.
#Post#: 17365--------------------------------------------------
Re: Referee replaced during matches
By: John Treleven Date: April 30, 2020, 5:46 am
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I have another (cushion) !!!
#Post#: 17376--------------------------------------------------
Re: Referee replaced during matches
By: jad Date: May 1, 2020, 6:02 am
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I should perhaps have specified that in the first two games I
mentioned W.O. Baxter was a linesman.
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