DIR Return Create A Forum - Home
---------------------------------------------------------
RateTheRef
HTML https://ratetheref.createaforum.com
---------------------------------------------------------
*****************************************************
DIR Return to: General Discussion
*****************************************************
#Post#: 105748--------------------------------------------------
Re: Chris Kavanagh - West Ham vs Arsenal
DIR By: El Referee
Date: May 12, 2026, 6:19 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: yfc54 link ---
>
> Banning players from being in the six yard box for corners
sounds simple enough but would it really work? The forwards
would just pile in on the keeper and the defenders would still
do everything they could to stop it.And what about free kicks,
would they be included because the grappling goes on there as
well.
> Let's face it. If this incident had taken place in the Palace
v Everton match for instance it wouldn't have received anywhere
near the amount of coverage.
> Maybe a few cards or penalties are needed rather than a major
rule change especially as the authorities usually over
complicate what we would see as simple changes.
>
--- End Quote ---
Completely agree.
You then add that if attackers can then go into the 6 yard box
once the corner is taken; we'll start having VAR checks for if
the attackers big toe ventured into the 6 yard box a nth of a
second before it should have.
Its a nice idea in theory. But has more complications than
people think
#Post#: 105751--------------------------------------------------
Re: Chris Kavanagh - West Ham vs Arsenal
DIR By: bmb
Date: May 12, 2026, 7:00 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Even more simple the PGMO could tell the shareholders to do one
and from game week 1 next season, every referee to be instructed
by them to book every single player involved in any grappling
prior to a corner and if they continue then give them a second
yellow. Couple of red cards and it will soon stop. It would
require every referee to do so and for the PGMO to stand strong
and take the hardline instead of caving in and forgetting about
it after a week or 2 which is what usually happens!
#Post#: 105765--------------------------------------------------
Re: Chris Kavanagh - West Ham vs Arsenal
DIR By: Adam
Date: May 12, 2026, 1:11 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Having heard the audio, Darren England has looked out for
himself and himself only in that situation. Hes done Kav right
over, hes unsure its enough for a foul but sends him over even
though hes not convinced its clear and obvious. Its not clear
and obvious if the 2 of them in VAR are unsure. Im not happy
after hearing how the decision was arrived at.
You can tell England is petrified to take responsibility and
make a decision himself.
#Post#: 105769--------------------------------------------------
Re: Chris Kavanagh - West Ham vs Arsenal
DIR By: TA_Ref
Date: May 12, 2026, 1:36 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Adam link ---
>
> Having heard the audio, Darren England has looked out for
himself and himself only in that situation. Hes done Kav right
over, hes unsure its enough for a foul but sends him over even
though hes not convinced its clear and obvious. Its not clear
and obvious if the 2 of them in VAR are unsure. Im not happy
after hearing how the decision was arrived at.
>
--- End Quote ---
In my opinion, from what I have just watched, I would have to
disagree with that. Darren England spotted the foul straight
away and described it accurately within a couple of replays. Of
course, some different angles show different things and the one
that he was watching which was low down looking into the box
didn’t give much away. Akil Howson rightly pointed out the other
couple of incidents that were occurring.
Darren England’s problem with VAR is that the more he watches
incidents and replays, he allows himself to get convinced
easily. It was the same with the potential handball in the Man
City vs Wolves game. He was going to clear that quite quickly
but the more he watched it, the more he was convinced that it
was a handball so he recommend and a review (and was eventually
rejected by Hallam).
For me, I’m still happy with the process and the correct outcome
was reached.
Edit - Also, Kavanagh gave him nothing to go off of either
regards to an on field decision which left the potential scope
for a review wide open.
#Post#: 105771--------------------------------------------------
Re: Chris Kavanagh - West Ham vs Arsenal
DIR By: Ancientref
Date: May 12, 2026, 1:47 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I am unconvinced that VAR did a good job on this. I disagree
with the concept that grappling must impact , holding is holding
, pushing is pushing and why do it if it is not going to impact
? But in this case I do feel that consideration should have been
given to why the arm was there. If it was a deliberate movement
to affect the goalkeeper then it is correctly disallowed under
the perverted system we are playing whereby all the potential
penalties are disregarded, but if it was as a result of the
players position being disturbed by being held or pushed from
behind then the choice is goal or penalty.
Surely this should have been part of the check.
#Post#: 105772--------------------------------------------------
Re: Chris Kavanagh - West Ham vs Arsenal
DIR By: rustyref
Date: May 12, 2026, 1:54 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: TA_Ref link ---
>
> [quote author=Adam link=topic=8015.msg105765#msg105765
date=1778609473]
> Having heard the audio, Darren England has looked out for
himself and himself only in that situation. Hes done Kav right
over, hes unsure its enough for a foul but sends him over even
though hes not convinced its clear and obvious. Its not clear
and obvious if the 2 of them in VAR are unsure. Im not happy
after hearing how the decision was arrived at.
>
--- End Quote ---
In my opinion, from what I have just watched, I would have to
disagree with that. Darren England spotted the foul straight
away and described it accurately within a couple of replays. Of
course, some different angles show different things and the one
that he was watching which was low down looking into the box
didn’t give much away. Akil Howson rightly pointed out the other
couple of incidents that were occurring.
Darren England’s problem with VAR is that the more he watches
incidents and replays, he allows himself to get convinced
easily. It was the same with the potential handball in the Man
City vs Wolves game. He was going to clear that quite quickly
but the more he watched it, the more he was convinced that it
was a handball so he recommend and a review (and was eventually
rejected by Hallam).
For me, I’m still happy with the process and the correct outcome
was reached.
Edit - Also, Kavanagh gave him nothing to go off of either
regards to an on field decision which left the potential scope
for a review wide open.
[/quote]
For me the process wasn't right, but they somehow got to the
right outcome. Kavanagh immediately said that he couldn't see a
foul, then as soon as he sees it on the screen he says foul, so
that feels like a clear and obvious error. His view was clearly
blocked off and based on what he said had he seen it real time
he would have penalised it. But VAR recommended a review when
they weren't really sure, plus also asked him to be sure he was
happy with the other potential fouls not being an issue.
#Post#: 105773--------------------------------------------------
Re: Chris Kavanagh - West Ham vs Arsenal
DIR By: gooner
Date: May 12, 2026, 2:03 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: rustyref link ---
>
> Kavanagh immediately said that he couldn't see a foul, then as
soon as he sees it on the screen he says foul, so that feels
like a clear and obvious error. His view was clearly blocked
off and based on what he said had he seen it real time he would
have penalised it.
>
--- End Quote ---
hi,
exactly this [emoji106]
let's hope this is the end of the matter [emoji16]
regards,
gnr
#Post#: 105783--------------------------------------------------
Re: Chris Kavanagh - West Ham vs Arsenal
DIR By: Joecphillips
Date: May 12, 2026, 2:47 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: rustyref link ---
>
> [quote author=TA_Ref link=topic=8015.msg105769#msg105769
date=1778610978]
> [quote author=Adam link=topic=8015.msg105765#msg105765
date=1778609473]
> Having heard the audio, Darren England has looked out for
himself and himself only in that situation. Hes done Kav right
over, hes unsure its enough for a foul but sends him over even
though hes not convinced its clear and obvious. Its not clear
and obvious if the 2 of them in VAR are unsure. Im not happy
after hearing how the decision was arrived at.
>
--- End Quote ---
In my opinion, from what I have just watched, I would have to
disagree with that. Darren England spotted the foul straight
away and described it accurately within a couple of replays. Of
course, some different angles show different things and the one
that he was watching which was low down looking into the box
didn’t give much away. Akil Howson rightly pointed out the other
couple of incidents that were occurring.
Darren England’s problem with VAR is that the more he watches
incidents and replays, he allows himself to get convinced
easily. It was the same with the potential handball in the Man
City vs Wolves game. He was going to clear that quite quickly
but the more he watched it, the more he was convinced that it
was a handball so he recommend and a review (and was eventually
rejected by Hallam).
For me, I’m still happy with the process and the correct outcome
was reached.
Edit - Also, Kavanagh gave him nothing to go off of either
regards to an on field decision which left the potential scope
for a review wide open.
[/quote]
For me the process wasn't right, but they somehow got to the
right outcome. Kavanagh immediately said that he couldn't see a
foul, then as soon as he sees it on the screen he says foul, so
that feels like a clear and obvious error. His view was clearly
blocked off and based on what he said had he seen it real time
he would have penalised it. But VAR recommended a review when
they weren't really sure, plus also asked him to be sure he was
happy with the other potential fouls not being an issue.
[/quote]
A factor that should be considered is that he will be heading to
the screen expecting to see a foul, so how much of that was
confirmation bias? I think there has only been 1 review where
the on field referee has stuck to his decision so he is put in a
bad position.
I also think the trossard incident was dismissed too quickly and
more needed to be shown and even checked further before calling
him to the screen as saying “I’m going to recommend an on field
review for a possible foul on the goalkeeper but there are some
other incidents to look at” says this is a foul we’re unsure of
the others but they didn’t get the same attention
I also think there is a huge discrepancy in what is classed as
impactful based on whether it is a defender or attacker
#Post#: 105801--------------------------------------------------
Re: Chris Kavanagh - West Ham vs Arsenal
DIR By: dtrv2
Date: May 12, 2026, 3:15 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I think the audio and the follow up discussion from Webb is
pretty much what I've been saying. CK clearly has no view
(although Hussin does say he didn't see a foul) which opens it
up to VAR to essentially make the decision (in comparison to
other similar incidents earlier this season). And as Webb says,
the Trossard incident is negligible and the Rice foul is not
'impactful', i.e. player wouldn't have challenged regardless,
leaving the only decision to check as the three fouls on Raya.
Having said that, it is surprising to hear England begin to
doubt what he can obviously see, and therefore to send CK to the
screen, although in hindsight, fortunately he did as otherwise
that would have been a very important error at both ends of the
table!
#Post#: 105828--------------------------------------------------
Re: Chris Kavanagh - West Ham vs Arsenal
DIR By: Claretman
Date: May 12, 2026, 5:30 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
So we are going to continue to allow grappling, holding and
manhandling at set pieces instead of trying to cut it out what a
surprise. Why on earth does the shenanigans have anything to do
with whether a player is impacted from playing the ball, it
shouldnt be allowed period.
Usual cop out from Webb saying we consult with the what football
wants brigade trying to deflect from his own deficiences in his
management process.
I didnt like wrestling when it was on itv sat afternoon and i
dont like it on a football field either. The game is fast
becoming unwatchable.
*****************************************************
Page 8 of 10
DIR Previous Page
DIR Next Page