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#Post#: 92196--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stuart Attwell - Crystal Palace v Man City (FA Cup Final)
DIR By: TA_Ref
Date: May 17, 2025, 3:22 pm
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I will agree with the majority and say that VAR made two
incorrect decisions.
I didn’t want to make a quick judgement on the possible red card
for Henderson because I wasn’t sure what the appropriate
sanction would be. Having watched it a few more times, I think
it is quite clearly DOGSO because even if Haaland does touch the
ball away from goal, it arguably gives him a better chance of
scoring a goal. Adam Nunn is in a very poor position, not
keeping up with play and so can’t be sure whether the handling
of the ball is outside the box (as a previous poster pointed
out).
I have already stated my opinion on the penalty earlier in the
thread. Silva is falling before any contact and when Mitchell
does make contact, Silva is literally on his knees. I praised
Kavanagh and Ben Toner for penalising simulation yesterday but
unfortunately this did not happen today. This was a prime
example of a player trying to the con the officials and has done
successfully. If anyone thinks this is a penalty then in my
opinion you support simulation because Silva falls into the
challenge.
Generally, I didn’t think Attwell was terrible. I think as
Claretman said, a mixed bag. He didn’t have much choice with
many cautions, they were all pretty stonewall. Good to see Ruben
Dias get booked for too much backchat. I think some Man City
players and fans need to remember the rules regarding head
injuries and the fact the referee has no choice but to quickly
stop the game.
Had the 4O Darren England been between the two benches rather
than on the touch line then we might have seen some red cards
after some back room staff from Palace and City squared up to
each other.
As previously stated, Adam Nunn did not have a particularly good
afternoon but Dan Robathan was excellent.
Not terrible but not great.
Massive congratulations to Crystal Palace who thoroughly
deserved their first major trophy. I hope the celebrations last
long into the night and beyond and enjoy those Thursday nights
under the lights, at Selhurst Park or abroad.
#Post#: 92197--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stuart Attwell - Crystal Palace v Man City (FA Cup Final)
DIR By: Affy_Moose
Date: May 17, 2025, 3:35 pm
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--- Quote from: Microscopist link ---
>
> [quote author=ARF link=topic=7012.msg92178#msg92178
date=1747503175]
> [quote author=Microscopist link=topic=7012.msg92175#msg92175
date=1747501979]
> VAR should have given them the opportunity to decide whether
it was a red card.
>
--- End Quote ---
No, VAR should not. That is not how it works.
[/quote]
Of course it is, we regularly see var not intervene on
subjective decisions. But where the referee has not clearly
seen the incident then he should be asked to take another look.
There have been other incidents recently where the referee has
been asked to review a decision and has produced a yellow card.
[/quote]
It isn’t and never has been how it works. VAR gets involved for
red cards, penalties, goals, and mistaken identity.
They clearly judged that Haaland lacked the sufficient required
elements of direction and/or control. I agree with that
judgement.
If they can’t advise for a red card, they can’t recommend
anything in this situation.
#Post#: 92198--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stuart Attwell - Crystal Palace v Man City (FA Cup Final)
DIR By: Microscopist
Date: May 17, 2025, 3:49 pm
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It isn’t and never has been how it works. VAR gets involved for
red cards, penalties, goals, and mistaken identity."
So it gets the criteria of being a decision relating to a
possible red card. The ref and AR have clearly missed an
important factor in that decision. It should therefore be the
referee on the field to make the decision, else why do we bother
sending the referee to the monitor and not just let the VAR
re-referee the game?
#Post#: 92199--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stuart Attwell - Crystal Palace v Man City (FA Cup Final)
DIR By: Claretman
Date: May 17, 2025, 3:57 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Listening to Hendersons interview post match with the bbc it
seems he was unaware he made contact with the ball outside the
area, not that it matters for sanctioning purposes.
#Post#: 92203--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stuart Attwell - Crystal Palace v Man City (FA Cup Final)
DIR By: TA_Ref
Date: May 17, 2025, 5:02 pm
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I would just like to point out what VAR gave the reason as to
why they didn’t think the Henderson incident was a red card. BBC
Sport said VAR didn’t get involved because ‘there wasn’t an
obvious goal scoring opportunity for Haaland, only a possible
chance.’
Now I would heavily criticise this statement because surely a
goal scoring opportunity would be defined as a chance to
possibly score a goal (like a 1v1). There is still nothing that
says a goal scoring opportunity would lead definitely lead to a
goal being scored. So how do the words obvious and possible
relate to a DOGSO incident when the whole point is deciding
whether a clear chance to score a goal has been prevented. If
something is possibly a DOGSO, then it is still DOGSO right?
Haaland would’ve rounded Henderson and more than likely got a
shot on goal. How is that only a possible goal scoring
opportunity? VAR’s wording seems pretty strange to me
#Post#: 92204--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stuart Attwell - Crystal Palace v Man City (FA Cup Final)
DIR By: flipmode
Date: May 17, 2025, 5:46 pm
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--- Quote from: Irishref1985 link ---
>
> It comes down to me about what’s clear and obvious? There is
contact for the penalty and Attwell gives it. For VAR to get
involved in that situation it’s not clear and obviously wrong.
Henderson very lucky for me. Handball
>
--- End Quote ---
Don’t agree with 99% of what you post but this nails it for me.
The Silva incident came nowhere near the clear and obvious
threshold for me, and I can see why the on field decision
remained.
Silva did make the most of the contact though, for sure.
Even in to the next day, I am still utterly baffled as to how no
OFR was suggested for the Henderson handball. That’s the very
purpose VAR was introduced.
As much as I wished it didn’t occur, it was sadly a very typical
Attwell performance; totally lacking of any sort of conviction
whatsoever.
#Post#: 92207--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stuart Attwell - Crystal Palace v Man City (FA Cup Final)
DIR By: bruntyboy
Date: May 17, 2025, 8:32 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Looking at the highlights I'm baffled as to how he awarded the
penalty in the first place given his position and the number of
players in between the incident. He surely didn't have a clear
view of the incident to be certain that it was a foul.
You've only got to look at the penalty originally awarded to
Chelsea the other night where there was a clear view of the
play.
#Post#: 92210--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stuart Attwell - Crystal Palace v Man City (FA Cup Final)
DIR By: Ashington46
Date: May 18, 2025, 3:07 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: bruntyboy link ---
>
> Looking at the highlights I'm baffled as to how he awarded the
penalty in the first place given his position and the number of
players in between the incident. He surely didn't have a clear
view of the incident to be certain that it was a foul.
>
> You've only got to look at the penalty originally awarded to
Chelsea the other night where there was a clear view of the
play.
>
--- End Quote ---
It took some time for him to award the penalty and my guess is
that the rest of the committee in the booth chirped in. Not a
referee's decision, it was awarded by the committee and I
reckon that this happens more and more these days. Eight people
involved in officiating one game of football, the mind boggles.
#Post#: 92212--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stuart Attwell - Crystal Palace v Man City (FA Cup Final)
DIR By: rustyref
Date: May 18, 2025, 3:41 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Ashington46 link ---
>
> [quote author=bruntyboy link=topic=7012.msg92207#msg92207
date=1747531977]
> Looking at the highlights I'm baffled as to how he awarded the
penalty in the first place given his position and the number of
players in between the incident. He surely didn't have a clear
view of the incident to be certain that it was a foul.
>
> You've only got to look at the penalty originally awarded to
Chelsea the other night where there was a clear view of the
play.
>
--- End Quote ---
It took some time for him to award the penalty and my guess is
that the rest of the committee in the booth chirped in. Not a
referee's decision, it was awarded by the committee and I
reckon that this happens more and more these days. Eight people
involved in officiating one game of football, the mind boggles.
[/quote]
There's no communication between VAR and the on-pitch officials
unless they tell them to delay the restart, and then again if
they recommend a review. They are not permitted to just discuss
decisions to help the referee. I really don't understand why
people find this so hard to understand and keep coming up with
incorrect conspiracy theories.
Given where the incident was and the slight delay in awarding
the penalty I would suggest that the active AR played a major
part in it.
#Post#: 92213--------------------------------------------------
Re: Stuart Attwell - Crystal Palace v Man City (FA Cup Final)
DIR By: dave26
Date: May 18, 2025, 3:42 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Ashington46 link ---
>
> [quote author=bruntyboy link=topic=7012.msg92207#msg92207
date=1747531977]
> Looking at the highlights I'm baffled as to how he awarded the
penalty in the first place given his position and the number of
players in between the incident. He surely didn't have a clear
view of the incident to be certain that it was a foul.
>
> You've only got to look at the penalty originally awarded to
Chelsea the other night where there was a clear view of the
play.
>
--- End Quote ---
It took some time for him to award the penalty and my guess is
that the rest of the committee in the booth chirped in. Not a
referee's decision, it was awarded by the committee and I
reckon that this happens more and more these days. Eight people
involved in officiating one game of football, the mind boggles.
[/quote]
Regarding your last twelve words above my reply would be and
still they can’t get it right at times , your spot on the mind
well and truly boggles
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