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#Post#: 77548--------------------------------------------------
Re: Newcastle v West Ham - Rob Jones
DIR By: Failed Ref
Date: March 31, 2024, 5:25 am
---------------------------------------------------------
I disagree. He made have made contact but there was no intent (I
wish that was in the laws now), he was committed and entitled to
clear the ball. That Gordon got in front of him is, imho,
irrelevant. Gordon was too late to get the ball. Many observers
would agree - not all - and because of that VAR should have kept
out of it.
#Post#: 77550--------------------------------------------------
Re: Newcastle v West Ham - Rob Jones
DIR By: Ref95
Date: March 31, 2024, 5:29 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Adam link ---
>
> [quote author=Failed Ref link=topic=5839.msg77543#msg77543
date=1711878410]
> I totally and absolutely agree with Ref95. There is a total
lack of understanding here. Phillips started his kick when he
was in a realistic position to kick the ball and from then on
committed to doing so. Phillips was entitled to do what he did
at the commencement of his swing of the boot without fouling
Gordon and when later contact was made Phillips was beyond the
point of no return. IMHO a lack of any feel or empathy for what
was going on. Whatever happened to that high bar for VAR
intervention?
> No wonder Phillips felt aggrieved.
>
--- End Quote ---
But it doesn't matter! Just because he didn't see him coming
doesn't mean it isn't a foul. He ploughs through the back of
him, he was too slow and AG got there first. Its a penalty every
day of the week.
[/quote]
But the key point here is that he didn’t get there first, he
never gets to the ball, and has no realistic possibility of
getting the ball if the contact doesn’t occur. The only player
ever in possession of the ball is Phillips.
I fully support that it’s a clear penalty if Gordon gets a touch
on the ball before Phillips kicks through the back of him, but
this was not the case in this scenario.
#Post#: 77551--------------------------------------------------
Re: Newcastle v West Ham - Rob Jones
DIR By: Failed Ref
Date: March 31, 2024, 5:51 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Look at the action of Phillips. At the moment he starts to clear
the ball he is entitled to do so. Gordon is on the blind side of
him and Phillips would believe that his action in following
through to clear the ball which he is entitled to do so would be
legitimate. What happens subsequently is irrelevant, it is after
the event. Phillips initial action is within the LOG and
therefore he should not be penalised. All Gordon does is to
arrive late to block the clearance. Phillips did nothing wrong
so how can he be penalised?
Quite a ridiculous decision in my view and certainly VAR should
have kept out of it.
#Post#: 77552--------------------------------------------------
Re: Newcastle v West Ham - Rob Jones
DIR By: Joecphillips
Date: March 31, 2024, 6:16 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: rustyref link ---
>
> [quote author=Joecphillips link=topic=5839.msg77533#msg77533
date=1711851440]
> [quote author=rustyref link=topic=5839.msg77527#msg77527
date=1711836898]
> [quote author=Joecphillips link=topic=5839.msg77522#msg77522
date=1711832312]
> [quote author=Adam link=topic=5839.msg77519#msg77519
date=1711831125]
> Some people here (perhaps with some red and white tinted
glasses) seem to be missing some fundamental points here.
>
> Anyone who's played football knows it is incredibly clever
play by AG to position himself in such a way that allows him to
win possession of the ball.
>
> Secondly how is that not a penalty. When AG places his foot in
front of the ball and KP the ball is essentially his. He gets
kicked through. Therefore a stonewall penalty.
>
> Finally, some people here think that because it's a "genuine
attempt to play the ball" it's not a penalty. 95% of penalties
given are for these so called "genuine attempts" so quit the
rubbish please!
>
--- End Quote ---
I considered that so I have sought opinions from others who are
equally as shocked, maybe some people here have their defend
referees tinted glasses on, typical reaction from other people I
spoke to is shock that the video was for a penalty and not a
foul against newcastle
[/quote]
Presumably not opinions from referees then? I can accept people
thinking it wasn't a penalty. but I can't possibly see how any
referee would think this could possibly be a defensive free
kick.
[/quote]
Qualified enough to know bs when they see it, even had newcastle
fans comment on how it was never a penalty tonight at work
[/quote]
So not referees then 😂
[/quote]
Talk about arrogance, if a defender challenges an opponent with
no intention of playing the ball just cause contact and impede
the opponent how can it not be a free kick.
#Post#: 77553--------------------------------------------------
Re: Newcastle v West Ham - Rob Jones
DIR By: rustyref
Date: March 31, 2024, 7:35 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Joecphillips link ---
>
> [quote author=rustyref link=topic=5839.msg77539#msg77539
date=1711874781]
> [quote author=Joecphillips link=topic=5839.msg77533#msg77533
date=1711851440]
> [quote author=rustyref link=topic=5839.msg77527#msg77527
date=1711836898]
> [quote author=Joecphillips link=topic=5839.msg77522#msg77522
date=1711832312]
> [quote author=Adam link=topic=5839.msg77519#msg77519
date=1711831125]
> Some people here (perhaps with some red and white tinted
glasses) seem to be missing some fundamental points here.
>
> Anyone who's played football knows it is incredibly clever
play by AG to position himself in such a way that allows him to
win possession of the ball.
>
> Secondly how is that not a penalty. When AG places his foot in
front of the ball and KP the ball is essentially his. He gets
kicked through. Therefore a stonewall penalty.
>
> Finally, some people here think that because it's a "genuine
attempt to play the ball" it's not a penalty. 95% of penalties
given are for these so called "genuine attempts" so quit the
rubbish please!
>
--- End Quote ---
I considered that so I have sought opinions from others who are
equally as shocked, maybe some people here have their defend
referees tinted glasses on, typical reaction from other people I
spoke to is shock that the video was for a penalty and not a
foul against newcastle
[/quote]
Presumably not opinions from referees then? I can accept people
thinking it wasn't a penalty. but I can't possibly see how any
referee would think this could possibly be a defensive free
kick.
[/quote]
Qualified enough to know bs when they see it, even had newcastle
fans comment on how it was never a penalty tonight at work
[/quote]
So not referees then 😂
[/quote]
Talk about arrogance, if a defender challenges an opponent with
no intention of playing the ball just cause contact and impede
the opponent how can it not be a free kick.
[/quote]
It isn't arrogance at all, I'm just pointing out that just
because a group of blokes down the pub or at work don't think it
was a penalty doesn't mean that it wasn't a penalty. If you
head over to another forum where everyone is a referee most
people think it was a clear penalty. And the MoTD producers and
presenters clearly thought it was a penalty as they didn't even
discuss it, and we know how they usually jump all over and
disect anything even vaguely controversial.
#Post#: 77561--------------------------------------------------
Re: Newcastle v West Ham - Rob Jones
DIR By: Joecphillips
Date: March 31, 2024, 9:46 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: rustyref link ---
>
> [quote author=Joecphillips link=topic=5839.msg77552#msg77552
date=1711883819]
> [quote author=rustyref link=topic=5839.msg77539#msg77539
date=1711874781]
> [quote author=Joecphillips link=topic=5839.msg77533#msg77533
date=1711851440]
> [quote author=rustyref link=topic=5839.msg77527#msg77527
date=1711836898]
> [quote author=Joecphillips link=topic=5839.msg77522#msg77522
date=1711832312]
> [quote author=Adam link=topic=5839.msg77519#msg77519
date=1711831125]
> Some people here (perhaps with some red and white tinted
glasses) seem to be missing some fundamental points here.
>
> Anyone who's played football knows it is incredibly clever
play by AG to position himself in such a way that allows him to
win possession of the ball.
>
> Secondly how is that not a penalty. When AG places his foot in
front of the ball and KP the ball is essentially his. He gets
kicked through. Therefore a stonewall penalty.
>
> Finally, some people here think that because it's a "genuine
attempt to play the ball" it's not a penalty. 95% of penalties
given are for these so called "genuine attempts" so quit the
rubbish please!
>
--- End Quote ---
I considered that so I have sought opinions from others who are
equally as shocked, maybe some people here have their defend
referees tinted glasses on, typical reaction from other people I
spoke to is shock that the video was for a penalty and not a
foul against newcastle
[/quote]
Presumably not opinions from referees then? I can accept people
thinking it wasn't a penalty. but I can't possibly see how any
referee would think this could possibly be a defensive free
kick.
[/quote]
Qualified enough to know bs when they see it, even had newcastle
fans comment on how it was never a penalty tonight at work
[/quote]
So not referees then 😂
[/quote]
Talk about arrogance, if a defender challenges an opponent with
no intention of playing the ball just cause contact and impede
the opponent how can it not be a free kick.
[/quote]
It isn't arrogance at all, I'm just pointing out that just
because a group of blokes down the pub or at work don't think it
was a penalty doesn't mean that it wasn't a penalty. If you
head over to another forum where everyone is a referee most
people think it was a clear penalty. And the MoTD producers and
presenters clearly thought it was a penalty as they didn't even
discuss it, and we know how they usually jump all over and
disect anything even vaguely controversial.
[/quote]
Plenty of people here seem to know the decision was bs,
according to var you're entitled to challenge for a ball on the
opponents chest but not a ball you have under full control in
case a player tries to initiate contact and succeeds
#Post#: 77564--------------------------------------------------
Re: Newcastle v West Ham - Rob Jones
DIR By: rustyref
Date: March 31, 2024, 10:19 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Joecphillips link ---
>
> [quote author=rustyref link=topic=5839.msg77553#msg77553
date=1711888521]
> [quote author=Joecphillips link=topic=5839.msg77552#msg77552
date=1711883819]
> [quote author=rustyref link=topic=5839.msg77539#msg77539
date=1711874781]
> [quote author=Joecphillips link=topic=5839.msg77533#msg77533
date=1711851440]
> [quote author=rustyref link=topic=5839.msg77527#msg77527
date=1711836898]
> [quote author=Joecphillips link=topic=5839.msg77522#msg77522
date=1711832312]
> [quote author=Adam link=topic=5839.msg77519#msg77519
date=1711831125]
> Some people here (perhaps with some red and white tinted
glasses) seem to be missing some fundamental points here.
>
> Anyone who's played football knows it is incredibly clever
play by AG to position himself in such a way that allows him to
win possession of the ball.
>
> Secondly how is that not a penalty. When AG places his foot in
front of the ball and KP the ball is essentially his. He gets
kicked through. Therefore a stonewall penalty.
>
> Finally, some people here think that because it's a "genuine
attempt to play the ball" it's not a penalty. 95% of penalties
given are for these so called "genuine attempts" so quit the
rubbish please!
>
--- End Quote ---
I considered that so I have sought opinions from others who are
equally as shocked, maybe some people here have their defend
referees tinted glasses on, typical reaction from other people I
spoke to is shock that the video was for a penalty and not a
foul against newcastle
[/quote]
Presumably not opinions from referees then? I can accept people
thinking it wasn't a penalty. but I can't possibly see how any
referee would think this could possibly be a defensive free
kick.
[/quote]
Qualified enough to know bs when they see it, even had newcastle
fans comment on how it was never a penalty tonight at work
[/quote]
So not referees then 😂
[/quote]
Talk about arrogance, if a defender challenges an opponent with
no intention of playing the ball just cause contact and impede
the opponent how can it not be a free kick.
[/quote]
It isn't arrogance at all, I'm just pointing out that just
because a group of blokes down the pub or at work don't think it
was a penalty doesn't mean that it wasn't a penalty. If you
head over to another forum where everyone is a referee most
people think it was a clear penalty. And the MoTD producers and
presenters clearly thought it was a penalty as they didn't even
discuss it, and we know how they usually jump all over and
disect anything even vaguely controversial.
[/quote]
Plenty of people here seem to know the decision was bs,
according to var you're entitled to challenge for a ball on the
opponents chest but not a ball you have under full control in
case a player tries to initiate contact and succeeds
[/quote]
Keeping referring to decisions as "bs" isn't really helping to
enhance your point of view.
#Post#: 77570--------------------------------------------------
Re: Newcastle v West Ham - Rob Jones
DIR By: ChippenhamCherry
Date: March 31, 2024, 11:23 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Gordon's foot isn't even facing the ball at the point he is
kicked. He's gone to hook the ball from in front of Phillips,
missed and then impeded Phillips' kick. Clear foul by Gordon and
defensive free-kick should have been the outcome for me.
If Gordon had tried to get in between the ball and Phillips with
his foot facing the ball, like he did for the first penalty,
then I'd have understood it being a penalty. But the fact he's
gone for the hooked foot around Phillips and missed the ball,
means he is the one committing the foul.
#Post#: 77572--------------------------------------------------
Re: Newcastle v West Ham - Rob Jones
DIR By: Joecphillips
Date: March 31, 2024, 12:03 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: rustyref link ---
>
> [quote author=Joecphillips link=topic=5839.msg77561#msg77561
date=1711896416]
> [quote author=rustyref link=topic=5839.msg77553#msg77553
date=1711888521]
> [quote author=Joecphillips link=topic=5839.msg77552#msg77552
date=1711883819]
> [quote author=rustyref link=topic=5839.msg77539#msg77539
date=1711874781]
> [quote author=Joecphillips link=topic=5839.msg77533#msg77533
date=1711851440]
> [quote author=rustyref link=topic=5839.msg77527#msg77527
date=1711836898]
> [quote author=Joecphillips link=topic=5839.msg77522#msg77522
date=1711832312]
> [quote author=Adam link=topic=5839.msg77519#msg77519
date=1711831125]
> Some people here (perhaps with some red and white tinted
glasses) seem to be missing some fundamental points here.
>
> Anyone who's played football knows it is incredibly clever
play by AG to position himself in such a way that allows him to
win possession of the ball.
>
> Secondly how is that not a penalty. When AG places his foot in
front of the ball and KP the ball is essentially his. He gets
kicked through. Therefore a stonewall penalty.
>
> Finally, some people here think that because it's a "genuine
attempt to play the ball" it's not a penalty. 95% of penalties
given are for these so called "genuine attempts" so quit the
rubbish please!
>
--- End Quote ---
I considered that so I have sought opinions from others who are
equally as shocked, maybe some people here have their defend
referees tinted glasses on, typical reaction from other people I
spoke to is shock that the video was for a penalty and not a
foul against newcastle
[/quote]
Presumably not opinions from referees then? I can accept people
thinking it wasn't a penalty. but I can't possibly see how any
referee would think this could possibly be a defensive free
kick.
[/quote]
Qualified enough to know bs when they see it, even had newcastle
fans comment on how it was never a penalty tonight at work
[/quote]
So not referees then 😂
[/quote]
Talk about arrogance, if a defender challenges an opponent with
no intention of playing the ball just cause contact and impede
the opponent how can it not be a free kick.
[/quote]
It isn't arrogance at all, I'm just pointing out that just
because a group of blokes down the pub or at work don't think it
was a penalty doesn't mean that it wasn't a penalty. If you
head over to another forum where everyone is a referee most
people think it was a clear penalty. And the MoTD producers and
presenters clearly thought it was a penalty as they didn't even
discuss it, and we know how they usually jump all over and
disect anything even vaguely controversial.
[/quote]
Plenty of people here seem to know the decision was bs,
according to var you're entitled to challenge for a ball on the
opponents chest but not a ball you have under full control in
case a player tries to initiate contact and succeeds
[/quote]
Keeping referring to decisions as "bs" isn't really helping to
enhance your point of view.
[/quote]
Should I call it Coote working to the best of his ability,
unfortunately for him that is lacking?
Going back to my point of mentioning fans of other teams saying
it’s not a foul that was in part of me being questioned because
of the team I support, maybe we should question if the defence
from certain people here is simply because of their support for
referees, you mentioned other forums if I go to a teams forum
they defend their team no matter what here it’s the referees
defended no matter their mistakes.
Also you mentioned the show who employ Newcastles biggest fan
didn’t discuss their favourable decisions shocking.
At the very least as shown by the discussion here with others
disagreeing with you the only thing clear and obvious is VAR
being misused
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