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#Post#: 62900--------------------------------------------------
DAVID ROCK - LINCOLN CITY v PORT VALE
DIR By: Jake the Peg
Date: April 17, 2023, 12:36 pm
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The Port Vale captain, Tom Conlon, was sent off by Rock after 33
minutes with Port Vale leading 2-1 and Lincoln already down to
ten men. The red card was issued after consultation with the
ARs and Fourth Official. It was recorded as violent conduct.
Today the red card has been rescinded. So can someone explain
what the officials saw and how come they have now unseen it?
#Post#: 62915--------------------------------------------------
Re: DAVID ROCK - LINCOLN CITY v PORT VALE
DIR By: RCG
Date: April 17, 2023, 2:35 pm
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There must have been video that actually showed the alleged
offence, which didnt get shown on TV.
#Post#: 62921--------------------------------------------------
Re: DAVID ROCK - LINCOLN CITY v PORT VALE
DIR By: Jake the Peg
Date: April 17, 2023, 3:34 pm
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But that doesn’t answer the question. What did the officials see
that made them certain it was a red card if video shows it
wasn’t?
#Post#: 62922--------------------------------------------------
Re: DAVID ROCK - LINCOLN CITY v PORT VALE
DIR By: TVOS
Date: April 17, 2023, 3:42 pm
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--- Quote from: Jake the Peg link ---
>
> But that doesn’t answer the question. What did the officials
see that made them certain it was a red card if video shows it
wasn’t?
>
--- End Quote ---
Not sure how you think someone on here can answer the question,
unless they are the officials in question or they were at the
game.
#Post#: 62924--------------------------------------------------
Re: DAVID ROCK - LINCOLN CITY v PORT VALE
DIR By: Jake the Peg
Date: April 17, 2023, 3:56 pm
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I was hoping someone could tell me how this could happen. I can
fully understand that officials don’t always see things so can’t
make a decision. I can’t understand how the ref, two ARs and the
fourth official all agreed that something happened which hadn’t.
After that defeat for Port Vale their manager parted company
with the club today.
#Post#: 62925--------------------------------------------------
Re: DAVID ROCK - LINCOLN CITY v PORT VALE
DIR By: rustyref
Date: April 17, 2023, 3:58 pm
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--- Quote from: Jake the Peg link ---
>
> But that doesn’t answer the question. What did the officials
see that made them certain it was a red card if video shows it
wasn’t?
>
--- End Quote ---
That isn't how it works. The officials make a decision based on
what they have seen at the time, there's no VAR so they can't
get it checked. If a team appeals it goes to a hearing, that
will be a 3 person panel of which at most one will be a former
referee. A decision being overturned doesn't mean the original
decision was incorrect, it just means the suspension doesn't
apply. Over the years we have seen some absolutely nailed on
red cards overturned on appeal.
#Post#: 62926--------------------------------------------------
Re: DAVID ROCK - LINCOLN CITY v PORT VALE
DIR By: Jake the Peg
Date: April 17, 2023, 4:25 pm
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I don’t get it. How can the red card be overturned if the
decision was correct. I’m not a ref so don’t understand this.
#Post#: 62927--------------------------------------------------
Re: DAVID ROCK - LINCOLN CITY v PORT VALE
DIR By: nemesis
Date: April 17, 2023, 4:43 pm
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--- Quote from: rustyref link ---
>
> [quote author=Jake the Peg link=topic=4804.msg62921#msg62921
date=1681763691]
> But that doesn’t answer the question. What did the officials
see that made them certain it was a red card if video shows it
wasn’t?
>
--- End Quote ---
That isn't how it works. The officials make a decision based on
what they have seen at the time, there's no VAR so they can't
get it checked. If a team appeals it goes to a hearing, that
will be a 3 person panel of which at most one will be a former
referee. A decision being overturned doesn't mean the original
decision was incorrect, it just means the suspension doesn't
apply. Over the years we have seen some absolutely nailed on
red cards overturned on appeal.
[/quote]
I understand his question. Missing things is understandable and
forgivable but seeing things that didn't happen raises
questions.
The vast majority of overturned red cards are as a result of
incorrect decisions and it is disingenuous to suggest otherwise.
With the occasional perverse overturning it's not usually clubs
like Port Vale who have been the beneficiaries.
#Post#: 62928--------------------------------------------------
Re: DAVID ROCK - LINCOLN CITY v PORT VALE
DIR By: TVOS
Date: April 17, 2023, 5:03 pm
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--- Quote from: Jake the Peg link ---
>
> I don’t get it. How can the red card be overturned if the
decision was correct. I’m not a ref so don’t understand this.
>
--- End Quote ---
Because video footage has later emerged that shows what happened
wasn't what one of the officials thought on first viewing.
#Post#: 62930--------------------------------------------------
Re: DAVID ROCK - LINCOLN CITY v PORT VALE
DIR By: ARF
Date: April 17, 2023, 6:03 pm
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--- Quote from: nemesis link ---
>
> Missing things is understandable and forgivable but seeing
things that didn't happen raises questions.
>
--- End Quote ---
To paraphrase Sir Humphrey - it is characteristic of every
incident occurring on the field of play that every individual in
attendance has a vivid recollection of them, and that every
individual's recollection of them differs violently from every
other individual's recollection.
It is an inexorable flaw of being human that information
received by the senses can become distorted when the brain
attempts to discern or recollect said information. I would call
it unseemly to imply anything other than human error as being
the cause of the mistake here, as you appear to be doing.
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