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#Post#: 53283--------------------------------------------------
Re: M OLIVER - Man C v Man U
DIR By: jacksamuel21
Date: October 3, 2022, 3:46 pm
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--- Quote from: Whistleblower link ---
>
> [quote author=TheThingFromLewes
link=topic=4015.msg53267#msg53267 date=1664820399]
> [quote author=Whistleblower link=topic=4015.msg53250#msg53250
date=1664806337]
> Oliver is now developing into one of the best referees this
country has seen in the last fifty years ( maybe from before
that but I don't remember that far back so can't properly
comment ). I believe he is approaching equal status with Jack
Taylor, George Courtney and, in the highest ascription of praise
I can bestow, perhaps getting very, very close to Joe Worrall.
>
--- End Quote ---
How would you compare him to say Howard Webb?
[/quote]
A really interesting question. Howard Webb of course achieved
every major honour in the world of football refereeing and was
an outstanding practitioner. I don't think Michael Oliver has
quite attained the standard of Webb in his pomp yet but I think
he will and might well just slightly edge past him. Were Howard
Webb to have had a more felicitous World Cup Final then I might
be tempted to say that hardly anyone could eclipse him but I
think Michael Oliver might just do so.
It's hard to compare different eras and different styles but I
am quite clear that Oliver is already superior to Graham Poll
and will be considered the outstanding referee of his
generation, easily on a par with Courtney and Webb
[/quote]
Oliver hasn’t given 3 yellow cards in a game yet😉 Taylor
has had his version of that though
#Post#: 53298--------------------------------------------------
Re: M OLIVER - Man C v Man U
DIR By: flipmode
Date: October 4, 2022, 3:31 am
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I thought the early yellow really took the sting out of what
could possibly have beena feisty derby. Such composed refereein
from Oliver.
Our broadcast didn't show it, but it looked like a good non flag
from Simon Bennett (via comms discussion?) to not flag Foden
offside for the sixth goal.
If I'm being ultra picky, I didn't think what minimal contact
(if any) merited the penalty at the end, but by then the game
was won and Un*ted needed that goal to win the half I guess?
[emoji6]
#Post#: 53308--------------------------------------------------
Re: M OLIVER - Man C v Man U
DIR By: Microscopist
Date: October 4, 2022, 6:13 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: flipmode link ---
>
> I thought the early yellow really took the sting out of what
could possibly have beena feisty derby. Such composed refereein
from Oliver.
> Our broadcast didn't show it, but it looked like a good non
flag from Simon Bennett (via comms discussion?) to not flag
Foden offside for the sixth goal.
>
> If I'm being ultra picky, I didn't think what minimal contact
(if any) merited the penalty at the end, but by then the game
was won and Un*ted needed that goal to win the half I guess?
[emoji6]
>
--- End Quote ---
In defence of Oliver, that was a very clever bit of play by
Martial. He stepped across Cancelo's path with his right leg
allowed the ball to run across him and when he felt the slight
contact of Cancelo's shin with his calf spiraled to the ground.
Rodney Marsh would have been proud of that. Whether you
consider it good play or diving is, I suppose, a matter of
opinion but you must admire the artistry.
#Post#: 53311--------------------------------------------------
Re: M OLIVER - Man C v Man U
DIR By: Microscopist
Date: October 4, 2022, 6:19 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: TVOS link ---
>
> [quote author=Ref Watcher link=topic=4015.msg53243#msg53243
date=1664797652]
> [quote author=Ref Fan link=topic=4015.msg53241#msg53241
date=1664795944]
> [quote author=Hendo link=topic=4015.msg53227#msg53227
date=1664748610]
> Masterclass. End of.
>
--- End Quote ---
You're in good company Hendo. Dermot also referred to it as a
Masterclass particularly praising the YC so early in the game.
There was some comment though about only 2 minutes being added
after the 90.
Can we just clarify - is time expected to be added for goals
scored, or only if there is excessive delay in the restart?
Same with subs.
Must admit I was expecting 4 minutes, but then United would be
relieved they couldn't be subjected to more punishment
[/quote]
The Laws say:
Allowance is made by the referee in each half for all playing
time lost in that half through ... any significant delay to a
restart (e.g. goal celebrations).
So no mandatory 30 seconds per goal that the pundits are so keen
to tell us about.
Saving United from more punishment? They had scored the
previous two goals. Surely they were cut off in their prime
when on a comeback ;).
[/quote]
"So no mandatory 30 seconds per goal that the pundits are so
keen to tell us about."
Isn't that covered by "any significant delay to a restart (e.g.
goal celebrations)"?
[/quote]
I think the 30 seconds for a goal idea came from an attempt to
justify some "Fergie" time in the 2009 Manchester Derby at Old
Trafford.
#Post#: 53344--------------------------------------------------
Re: M OLIVER - Man C v Man U
DIR By: ajb95
Date: October 5, 2022, 3:29 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: flipmode link ---
>
> I thought the early yellow really took the sting out of what
could possibly have beena feisty derby. Such composed refereein
from Oliver.
> Our broadcast didn't show it, but it looked like a good non
flag from Simon Bennett (via comms discussion?) to not flag
Foden offside for the sixth goal.
>
> If I'm being ultra picky, I didn't think what minimal contact
(if any) merited the penalty at the end, but by then the game
was won and Un*ted needed that goal to win the half I guess?
[emoji6]
>
--- End Quote ---
Cancelo came straight through the back of red 9 so a clear
penalty and well spotted.
In response to whistleblower above, Oliver is a class above
Graham poll who was a bang average ref who used his inflated ego
and personality to manage games
#Post#: 53348--------------------------------------------------
Re: M OLIVER - Man C v Man U
DIR By: ARF
Date: October 5, 2022, 4:22 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: ajb95 link ---
>
> [quote author=flipmode link=topic=4015.msg53298#msg53298
date=1664872273]
> I thought the early yellow really took the sting out of what
could possibly have beena feisty derby. Such composed refereein
from Oliver.
> Our broadcast didn't show it, but it looked like a good non
flag from Simon Bennett (via comms discussion?) to not flag
Foden offside for the sixth goal.
>
> If I'm being ultra picky, I didn't think what minimal contact
(if any) merited the penalty at the end, but by then the game
was won and Un*ted needed that goal to win the half I guess?
[emoji6]
>
--- End Quote ---
Cancelo came straight through the back of red 9 so a clear
penalty and well spotted.
In response to whistleblower above, Oliver is a class above
Graham poll who was a bang average ref who used his inflated ego
and personality to manage games
[/quote]
Agree that it's a definite penalty IMO.
Would disagree about Poll though - I think he was one of the
best of a very good crop we had around in the early-mid 00s
(irrespective of his "ego"). I don't think you get to do the
League Cup Final, FA Cup Final, UEFA Cup Final and referee at
two World Cups being a "bang average" referee.
#Post#: 53352--------------------------------------------------
Re: M OLIVER - Man C v Man U
DIR By: Whistleblower
Date: October 5, 2022, 6:30 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: ARF link ---
>
> [quote author=ajb95 link=topic=4015.msg53344#msg53344
date=1664958555]
> [quote author=flipmode link=topic=4015.msg53298#msg53298
date=1664872273]
> I thought the early yellow really took the sting out of what
could possibly have beena feisty derby. Such composed refereein
from Oliver.
> Our broadcast didn't show it, but it looked like a good non
flag from Simon Bennett (via comms discussion?) to not flag
Foden offside for the sixth goal.
>
> If I'm being ultra picky, I didn't think what minimal contact
(if any) merited the penalty at the end, but by then the game
was won and Un*ted needed that goal to win the half I guess?
[emoji6]
>
--- End Quote ---
Cancelo came straight through the back of red 9 so a clear
penalty and well spotted.
In response to whistleblower above, Oliver is a class above
Graham poll who was a bang average ref who used his inflated ego
and personality to manage games
[/quote]
Agree that it's a definite penalty IMO.
Would disagree about Poll though - I think he was one of the
best of a very good crop we had around in the early-mid 00s
(irrespective of his "ego"). I don't think you get to do the
League Cup Final, FA Cup Final, UEFA Cup Final and referee at
two World Cups being a "bang average" referee.
[/quote]
I think Poll was a very good referee but for some reason,
politics probably, got to a much higher echelon than his talent
merited. Nowhere near as good as either Oliver or Anthony Taylor
in my view and light years away from Courtney and Worrall.
#Post#: 53353--------------------------------------------------
Re: M OLIVER - Man C v Man U
DIR By: Deanspen
Date: October 5, 2022, 10:46 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Talk about “cool calm and collected”!!…..masterclass.
#Post#: 53356--------------------------------------------------
Re: M OLIVER - Man C v Man U
DIR By: dave26
Date: October 5, 2022, 1:18 pm
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I’m not sure you can really compare Oliver and Webb with Poll
the game has changed so much since Poll left the scene , his and
Webbs management of games in those days was exceptional I think
if they both applied it to how it is played today it wouldn’t
work.
#Post#: 53360--------------------------------------------------
Re: M OLIVER - Man C v Man U
DIR By: Whistleblower
Date: October 5, 2022, 3:30 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: dave26 link ---
>
> I’m not sure you can really compare Oliver and Webb with Poll
the game has changed so much since Poll left the scene , his and
Webbs management of games in those days was exceptional I think
if they both applied it to how it is played today it wouldn’t
work.
>
--- End Quote ---
That's a very fair point. Certainly there is a huge change in
the game and the way it is refereed since the time of Poll. I
think Webb was probably in a transitional period so perhaps one
can reasonably compare Poll with Webb ( Webb wins ) and Webb
with Oliver ( fairly even I would say )
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