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#Post#: 51002--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sat 13th – Mon 15th AUG 2022
By: Mackem ref Date: August 11, 2022, 6:46 am
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I agree the approach is cautious and in my opinion wrong.
Attendance at SG1 seminars and PL 4th official appointments
could easily happen when a referee is in SG2 in preparation for
promotion. You get promoted because you’re refereeing well. When
you then don’t receive regular appointments, you lack form and
then find adapting to PL life even more challenging. I hope this
approach doesn’t come back to haunt SG1 given 4 of the most
experienced and appointed officials have retired. Busy season
ahead for Oliver, Taylor, Tierney and Pawson I think to help
close the experience gap. Here’s hoping Mr Riley’s successor is
a bit more forward thinking with their succession planning!
#Post#: 51004--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sat 13th – Mon 15th AUG 2022
By: Hendo Date: August 11, 2022, 7:30 am
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Agree with everything said, far too cautious and in some ways
must be a bit dispiriting for those promoted.
If memory serves me correct when Steve Dunn was promoted he was
appointed to Spurs v Villa in either the 1st or 2nd round of
matches in his first season. He did have too bad a career after
that!
#Post#: 51006--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sat 13th – Mon 15th AUG 2022
By: TheThingFromLewes Date: August 11, 2022, 8:33 am
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[quote author=Whistleblower link=topic=3871.msg51000#msg51000
date=1660212287]
[quote author=referee12 link=topic=3871.msg50997#msg50997
date=1660207163]
I thought with dean Atkinson etc reitiring it would give more
prem games to ref for Harrington and Salisbury? I think they
both didn't do many last season so an improvement on that is a
start- one of them could have replaced Oliver with him coming
back from Finland after the supercup?
surely Bramell has to get a run of games in the next couple of
prem match days otherwise what's the point of him getting
promoted
[/quote]
Riley's method is to promote someone then give them several 4th
appointments and attendance at many SG1 seminars and training
sessions before allowing them to referee a match between two
teams whom they would have refereed many times in the
Championship previously. It's an ultra cautious approach which I
think was largely formed out of the experience of Attwell's
first and rather disastrous spell refereeing in the PL. In my
view it is too cautious and yet I suppose Hooper has been quite
a successful product of this system. He didn't have the easiest
starts in SG1 but has been given time to develop his confidence
and now is quite a decent referee though I cannot ever see him
being one of the 'big hitters'.
[/quote]
Luckily Lord Elleray isn’t in post any more….
#Post#: 51007--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sat 13th – Mon 15th AUG 2022
By: bmb Date: August 11, 2022, 8:40 am
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I think lessons were learned after Stuart Attwell was promoted
before he was ready but as a result they have gone too far the
other way. They know who the candidates are so get them on 4O
duties & attending SG1 seminars after Christmas, get them
integrating with the SG1 group. Start of the season get them on
games straight away, maybe involving the newly promoted teams,
they will have refereed them in the championship, they'll know
them, maybe feel that little bit more confident with them, it
gives them their first games under their belt and they can grow
from there. When Simon Hooper had a rough spell they sent him
straight to AFCB, he has a long history at the club and a very
positive one, he's very well liked there and that game did his
confidence the world of good & helped get him back on track. I'm
sure most of the referees have grounds/teams they are extra
confident with because of a positive history as well as those
they perhaps don't perform well at - Kevin Friend was never the
same at AFCB after he had collapsed in the tech area & ended up
in hospital is an example. His performances in games involving
AFCB were never up to standard after that, but always had been
before. Use that prior positivity to help give them a good start
#Post#: 51015--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sat 13th – Mon 15th AUG 2022
By: exile Date: August 11, 2022, 12:55 pm
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Just been told this is the first time Harrington has refereed
Southampton in the league, apparently he's taken charge of a cup
game with them v Coventry. Does anyone know if this is true?
#Post#: 51016--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sat 13th – Mon 15th AUG 2022
By: tomp Date: August 11, 2022, 1:56 pm
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[quote author=exile link=topic=3871.msg51015#msg51015
date=1660240509]
Just been told this is the first time Harrington has refereed
Southampton in the league, apparently he's taken charge of a cup
game with them v Coventry. Does anyone know if this is true?
[/quote]
Yes that’s correct. He’s never refereed Southampton in the
league but was in the middle for their 2-1 win over Coventry in
the 4th round of the FA Cup last season.
#Post#: 51020--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sat 13th – Mon 15th AUG 2022
By: rustyref Date: August 11, 2022, 2:37 pm
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[quote author=bmb link=topic=3871.msg51007#msg51007
date=1660225219]
I think lessons were learned after Stuart Attwell was promoted
before he was ready but as a result they have gone too far the
other way. They know who the candidates are so get them on 4O
duties & attending SG1 seminars after Christmas, get them
integrating with the SG1 group. Start of the season get them on
games straight away, maybe involving the newly promoted teams,
they will have refereed them in the championship, they'll know
them, maybe feel that little bit more confident with them, it
gives them their first games under their belt and they can grow
from there. When Simon Hooper had a rough spell they sent him
straight to AFCB, he has a long history at the club and a very
positive one, he's very well liked there and that game did his
confidence the world of good & helped get him back on track. I'm
sure most of the referees have grounds/teams they are extra
confident with because of a positive history as well as those
they perhaps don't perform well at - Kevin Friend was never the
same at AFCB after he had collapsed in the tech area & ended up
in hospital is an example. His performances in games involving
AFCB were never up to standard after that, but always had been
before. Use that prior positivity to help give them a good start
[/quote]
They definitely learned from Attwell, he was pushed way too
quickly and it badly backfired. He deserves a lot of credit for
his mental strength as I don't think many referees would have
recovered from that.
The problem in giving the newly promoted referees the promoted
teams is familiarity, they might have refereed that team 5 or 6
times in the past couple of seasons. I suspect the established
Premier League teams would cry foul over that. I don't think
they should throw the newbies straight in the deep end with 30+
games in their first season, but equally they need more than the
handful they have been getting. The likes of Brooks and
Harrington are going to have to be used more often this season
through necessity, perhaps they would be better prepared if they
had been given 10 to 15 EPL middles last season rather than the
3 or 4 that they actually got.
#Post#: 51021--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sat 13th – Mon 15th AUG 2022
By: exile Date: August 11, 2022, 2:42 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=tomp link=topic=3871.msg51016#msg51016
date=1660244198]
[quote author=exile link=topic=3871.msg51015#msg51015
date=1660240509]
Just been told this is the first time Harrington has refereed
Southampton in the league, apparently he's taken charge of a cup
game with them v Coventry. Does anyone know if this is true?
[/quote]
Yes that’s correct. He’s never refereed Southampton in the
league but was in the middle for their 2-1 win over Coventry in
the 4th round of the FA Cup last season.
[/quote]
Cheers, I thought it must be right because this person is really
knowledgeable, but just thought it was a bit odd and wanted to
check. Much appreciated.
#Post#: 51062--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sat 13th – Mon 15th AUG 2022
By: TheThingFromLewes Date: August 12, 2022, 3:40 pm
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Sunderland v QPR has Marriner fourth official to Simpson
😳
#Post#: 51063--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sat 13th – Mon 15th AUG 2022
By: TVOS Date: August 12, 2022, 5:13 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=TheThingFromLewes
link=topic=3871.msg51062#msg51062 date=1660336858]
Sunderland v QPR has Marriner fourth official to Simpson
😳
[/quote]
He'll be in the North East for Middlesbrough v Sheffield United
on Sunday.
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