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#Post#: 39040--------------------------------------------------
Re: A TAYLOR - Man U v Liverpool
DIR By: RCG
Date: October 25, 2021, 3:22 am
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The Pogba tackle was exactly why VAR was introduced. Player
jumping towards referee who could not be certain of contact
point. As soon as he saw the side in angle correct decision
achieved.
If the only thing that saves Ronaldo is that he kicked the ball
then I am astounded. What if the ball was next to the players
head? Or between his legs? To me violent and deliberate.
#Post#: 39046--------------------------------------------------
Re: A TAYLOR - Man U v Liverpool
DIR By: PhiltheRef
Date: October 25, 2021, 5:35 am
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Absolute tripe.
Do you really think so little of the integrity of officials?
#Post#: 39049--------------------------------------------------
Re: A TAYLOR - Man U v Liverpool
DIR By: ajb95
Date: October 25, 2021, 7:29 am
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I thought it was the usual hit and miss performance from Taylor.
Fully in control but when it comes to the key decisions he again
falls short.
For an elite official to not sanction that Pogba tackle as a red
card straight away is indefensible; thank god for VAR Attwell.
Ronaldo too for me should have been sent off for VC, petulant
but violent conduct. Also think Maguire was DOGSO but with
United down to 10 men and 5-0 down then maybe some leeway shown.
#Post#: 39071--------------------------------------------------
Re: A TAYLOR - Man U v Liverpool
DIR By: Whistleblower
Date: October 25, 2021, 11:15 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: PhiltheRef link ---
>
> This may seem off topic but please indulge me.
> Today I went to watch an FA Women's Cup tie.
> Toward the end there was a challenge, resulting in potentially
serious injury to a home player and less so to the other player.
>
> From our different positions 4 of us, Referee AR, Level 3
spectator and myself, came up with different outcomes.
>
> I said RC for away player, no sanction against home.
> Other suggestion were 2 YC, YC to away player and two RCs
>
> Oh for VAR
>
--- End Quote ---
It is salutary how different people seeing the same incident can
come to different conclusions as to what has happened and the
correct sanction to be applied.
However, in any walk of life, one would hope that a most senior
practitioner, like Taylor, would get such an obvious judgement
call right immediately. Pogba's challenge was a crystal clear
example of that which should receive the sanction of the
perpetrator being sent off. I can see no case to be made for
anything other than a straight red card and it is surprising and
disappointing that one of our most senior and experienced
referees didn't, on this occasion, recognise the incident for
what it was. The initial sanction of a caution was entirely
wrong.
#Post#: 39078--------------------------------------------------
Re: A TAYLOR - Man U v Liverpool
DIR By: Claretman
Date: October 25, 2021, 12:48 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Whistleblower link ---
>
> [quote author=PhiltheRef link=topic=2987.msg39032#msg39032
date=1635115883]
> This may seem off topic but please indulge me.
> Today I went to watch an FA Women's Cup tie.
> Toward the end there was a challenge, resulting in potentially
serious injury to a home player and less so to the other player.
>
> From our different positions 4 of us, Referee AR, Level 3
spectator and myself, came up with different outcomes.
>
> I said RC for away player, no sanction against home.
> Other suggestion were 2 YC, YC to away player and two RCs
>
> Oh for VAR
>
--- End Quote ---
It is salutary how different people seeing the same incident can
come to different conclusions as to what has happened and the
correct sanction to be applied.
However, in any walk of life, one would hope that a most senior
practitioner, like Taylor, would get such an obvious judgement
call right immediately. Pogba's challenge was a crystal clear
example of that which should receive the sanction of the
perpetrator being sent off. I can see no case to be made for
anything other than a straight red card and it is surprising and
disappointing that one of our most senior and experienced
referees didn't, on this occasion, recognise the incident for
what it was. The initial sanction of a caution was entirely
wrong.
[/quote]
Entirely agree with you whistleblower, however Taylor has not
been alone in failing to sanction correctly, Other referees i
believe have been very lenient in issuing yellow and having var
intervene to upgrade to red, hope this is not a trend from our
top officials.
#Post#: 39080--------------------------------------------------
Re: A TAYLOR - Man U v Liverpool
DIR By: PhiltheRef
Date: October 25, 2021, 1:02 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I wasn't suggesting that it should be anything other than Red.
My point, as supported by Dermot Gallagher, Stephen Warnock and
Sue Smith on SKY this morning, is that the angle one sees an
incident from has an influence on the sanction.
They had footage suggesting it looked much less serious from the
Referee's position than that of the camera.
VAR did what it was designed for in recommending AT review.
Having done so, with the different angle, he very swiftly
upgraded to RC
#Post#: 39083--------------------------------------------------
Re: A TAYLOR - Man U v Liverpool
DIR By: rustyref
Date: October 25, 2021, 1:28 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Claretman link ---
>
> [quote author=Whistleblower link=topic=2987.msg39071#msg39071
date=1635178542]
> [quote author=PhiltheRef link=topic=2987.msg39032#msg39032
date=1635115883]
> This may seem off topic but please indulge me.
> Today I went to watch an FA Women's Cup tie.
> Toward the end there was a challenge, resulting in potentially
serious injury to a home player and less so to the other player.
>
> From our different positions 4 of us, Referee AR, Level 3
spectator and myself, came up with different outcomes.
>
> I said RC for away player, no sanction against home.
> Other suggestion were 2 YC, YC to away player and two RCs
>
> Oh for VAR
>
--- End Quote ---
It is salutary how different people seeing the same incident can
come to different conclusions as to what has happened and the
correct sanction to be applied.
However, in any walk of life, one would hope that a most senior
practitioner, like Taylor, would get such an obvious judgement
call right immediately. Pogba's challenge was a crystal clear
example of that which should receive the sanction of the
perpetrator being sent off. I can see no case to be made for
anything other than a straight red card and it is surprising and
disappointing that one of our most senior and experienced
referees didn't, on this occasion, recognise the incident for
what it was. The initial sanction of a caution was entirely
wrong.
[/quote]
Entirely agree with you whistleblower, however Taylor has not
been alone in failing to sanction correctly, Other referees i
believe have been very lenient in issuing yellow and having var
intervene to upgrade to red, hope this is not a trend from our
top officials.
[/quote]
Remember that Taylor will get an incorrect KMI as a result, even
though VAR bailed him out, so there is no way they are
intentionally going yellow when it should be red. If you look
at this one yes it looks obvious from a side on view, but Taylor
didn't have that and rather had a front on view and it is always
a lot harder to judge where the contact was in that case.
#Post#: 39095--------------------------------------------------
Re: A TAYLOR - Man U v Liverpool
DIR By: nemesis
Date: October 26, 2021, 4:22 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: PhiltheRef link ---
>
> This may seem off topic but please indulge me.
> Today I went to watch an FA Women's Cup tie.
> Toward the end there was a challenge, resulting in potentially
serious injury to a home player and less so to the other player.
>
> From our different positions 4 of us, Referee AR, Level 3
spectator and myself, came up with different outcomes.
>
> I said RC for away player, no sanction against home.
> Other suggestion were 2 YC, YC to away player and two RCs
>
> Oh for VAR
>
--- End Quote ---
I welcome this new classification for spectators. Sadly most
would not even make Level 7. ;)
#Post#: 39100--------------------------------------------------
Re: A TAYLOR - Man U v Liverpool
DIR By: Carter
Date: October 26, 2021, 7:37 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Remember that Taylor will get an incorrect KMI as a result, even
though VAR bailed him out, so there is no way they are
intentionally going yellow when it should be red. If you look
at this one yes it looks obvious from a side on view, but Taylor
didn't have that and rather had a front on view and it is always
a lot harder to judge where the contact was in that case.
[/quote]
What do KMI matter to officials who cant be removed on
performance?
I do belive some are hoping for VAR to bail them out so hence
onlybcaution then wait.
This is not a dig at Taylor, it apllies to everyone.
#Post#: 39118--------------------------------------------------
Re: A TAYLOR - Man U v Liverpool
DIR By: Affy_Moose
Date: October 26, 2021, 2:07 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Carter link ---
>
>
>
> Remember that Taylor will get an incorrect KMI as a result,
even though VAR bailed him out, so there is no way they are
intentionally going yellow when it should be red. If you look
at this one yes it looks obvious from a side on view, but Taylor
didn't have that and rather had a front on view and it is always
a lot harder to judge where the contact was in that case.
>
--- End Quote ---
What do KMI matter to officials who cant be removed on
performance?
I do belive some are hoping for VAR to bail them out so hence
onlybcaution then wait.
This is not a dig at Taylor, it apllies to everyone.
[/quote]
Because it’s all relative. Just because someone gets a 7.9
(score that means a KMI has been missed) doesn’t mean they’re
going to be relegated to the Championship next week.
Referee observer scores will be averaged over at least one, and
most likely two or more seasons. Match officials are no more
subject to performance review in their day-to-day work than you
or I are.
A raft of poor scores will, however, likely mean fewer games
overall, and less prestigious appointments. Ultimately, it will
determine when an official’s time at their respective levels has
come to an end, and they either retire or go back down the
pyramid.
So yes, no official will give a different decision just because
VAR is available to ‘bail’ them out. All VAR does is correct the
game, it doesn’t massage performance marks.
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