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#Post#: 30582--------------------------------------------------
Darren England
DIR By: Whistleblower
Date: April 29, 2021, 2:24 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I was talking recently with a friend who is a senior former
League referee, who is not easily persuaded of raw talent, and
he was speaking enormously highly of Darren England, whom he has
Observed. In giving his very favourable opinion he gave this
extraordinary high praise saying there is something about
England which puts him in mind of George Courtney and he
believes that England has the potential to be a referee of
Courtney's standing. Goodness me, that is very high praise
indeed and I particularly take note of it as my friend is not
known for being over effusive.
I have seen England run the line a few times but as yet not seen
him referee except on TV. Something to look forward to. On a
more bathetic note, he starts well in my good books by being a
three forename initials referee !
#Post#: 30583--------------------------------------------------
Re: Darren England
DIR By: DublinRef
Date: April 29, 2021, 2:36 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Whistleblower link ---
>
> I was talking recently with a friend who is a senior former
League referee, who is not easily persuaded of raw talent, and
he was speaking enormously highly of Darren England, whom he has
Observed. In giving his very favourable opinion he gave this
extraordinary high praise saying there is something about
England which puts him in mind of George Courtney and he
believes that England has the potential to be a referee of
Courtney's standing. Goodness me, that is very high praise
indeed and I particularly take note of it as my friend is not
known for being over effusive.
>
> I have seen England run the line a few times but as yet not
seen him referee except on TV. Something to look forward to. On
a more bathetic note, he starts well in my good books by being a
three forename initials referee !
>
--- End Quote ---
A very interesting insight as ever Whistleblower, thank you. The
one thing that will hold England back, internationally at least,
is age. At 36 and not yet of the FIFA list, considering Kavanagh
and Bankes ahead of him and the fact they likely won't promote
to elite once over 40 I can't see him making the top level in
Europe, hopefully he proves me wrong. I agree he is an excellent
referee though and will hopefully excel in years to come.
#Post#: 30589--------------------------------------------------
Re: Darren England
DIR By: JCFC
Date: April 29, 2021, 3:43 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I am delighted to read the high opinion Whistleblower's Mr
Observer holds of Mr England. From my very distant third-hand
viewpoint, I had indeed gained the impression that he had
settled well into the Premier League, helped no doubt by the
experience of the atmosphere that he had gained as a PL (and
briefly FIFA) assistant before making the brave, but fully
justified, decision to make refereeing his choice.
Equally, I share DublinRef's misgivings about his age. At the
risk of sounding like a broken record, this is a further
indication of the over-cautious promotion pathway. He was
already clearly highly talented as a Level 3 ten or eleven
seasons ago. One experienced Observer at that level confessed
that he was struggling to find anything to offer as a
development point. Ten years to get from there to the Premier
League is a condemnation of the system and the additional
hurdles to be surmounted.
In fairness, there does seem to have been a move towards fast
tracking referees in the last two or three years - one or two
slightly surprisingly to my untutored eyes - so things may
change. There does remain, though, the problem of "bed-blocking"
at the top level, with no apparent prospect of a solution in
sight.
#Post#: 30598--------------------------------------------------
Re: Darren England
DIR By: rustyref
Date: April 29, 2021, 5:02 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
England (no pun intended) also have their maximum allowance of
FIFA referees, so unless any are removed very soon Darren
England will be too old to be nominated.
#Post#: 30600--------------------------------------------------
Re: Darren England
DIR By: Whistleblower
Date: April 30, 2021, 2:32 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: JCFC link ---
>
> I am delighted to read the high opinion Whistleblower's Mr
Observer holds of Mr England. From my very distant third-hand
viewpoint, I had indeed gained the impression that he had
settled well into the Premier League, helped no doubt by the
experience of the atmosphere that he had gained as a PL (and
briefly FIFA) assistant before making the brave, but fully
justified, decision to make refereeing his choice.
>
> Equally, I share DublinRef's misgivings about his age. At the
risk of sounding like a broken record, this is a further
indication of the over-cautious promotion pathway. He was
already clearly highly talented as a Level 3 ten or eleven
seasons ago. One experienced Observer at that level confessed
that he was struggling to find anything to offer as a
development point. Ten years to get from there to the Premier
League is a condemnation of the system and the additional
hurdles to be surmounted.
>
> In fairness, there does seem to have been a move towards fast
tracking referees in the last two or three years - one or two
slightly surprisingly to my untutored eyes - so things may
change. There does remain, though, the problem of "bed-blocking"
at the top level, with no apparent prospect of a solution in
sight.
>
--- End Quote ---
Ten years is a long time, particularly when one considers the
rapid rise of Michael Oliver. For a while though, England was a
Premier League AR and also I believe a FIFA AR. Perhaps he
initially decided to go down that route before making the
decision to pursue refereeing. As rustyref has pointed out in
his reply, it may well be that England doesn't ever get
appointed to the FIFA Referee List ( ironic when you think for
how long English refereeing did not fulfil its allocated number
of FIFA places ) and so we may be denied the eponymous
description of England ( England ) in an international match
report. So, it may be that Darren England joins that small group
of excellent domestic referees over the years who do not wear a
FIFA Badge. Most notably in my mind is Alan Wiley. However, it
seems to be the case that in some European competitions, a 4th
Official is sometimes appointed who does not wear a FIFA badge
and so that route may be open to England.
#Post#: 30607--------------------------------------------------
Re: Darren England
DIR By: Ref Watcher
Date: April 30, 2021, 4:34 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: JCFC link ---
>
> I am delighted to read the high opinion Whistleblower's Mr
Observer holds of Mr England. From my very distant third-hand
viewpoint, I had indeed gained the impression that he had
settled well into the Premier League, helped no doubt by the
experience of the atmosphere that he had gained as a PL (and
briefly FIFA) assistant before making the brave, but fully
justified, decision to make refereeing his choice.
>
> Equally, I share DublinRef's misgivings about his age. At the
risk of sounding like a broken record, this is a further
indication of the over-cautious promotion pathway. He was
already clearly highly talented as a Level 3 ten or eleven
seasons ago. One experienced Observer at that level confessed
that he was struggling to find anything to offer as a
development point. Ten years to get from there to the Premier
League is a condemnation of the system and the additional
hurdles to be surmounted.
>
> In fairness, there does seem to have been a move towards fast
tracking referees in the last two or three years - one or two
slightly surprisingly to my untutored eyes - so things may
change. There does remain, though, the problem of "bed-blocking"
at the top level, with no apparent prospect of a solution in
sight.
>
--- End Quote ---
Given the need to specialise earlier now, I rather suspect that
Darren England will be amongst the last to gain valuable
experience on the Premier League (and higher) as an AR before
going on to reach that level in the middle. A pity in my view.
I have certainly learnt more from being an assistant at a level
higher than I referee than I have ever learnt in a classroom,
from an Observer or from my own experience. That said the need
to promote quicker in this country (and therefore demote quicker
too) is, again in my view, undeniable. It is a paradox that
will be difficult to resolve.
#Post#: 30608--------------------------------------------------
Re: Darren England
DIR By: JCFC
Date: April 30, 2021, 4:37 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Have I missed something? I was under the impression that there
were currently only nine out of a possible ten FIFA Referees
from England, leaving Messrs England and Jones to compete for
the one remaining spot.
#Post#: 30609--------------------------------------------------
Re: Darren England
DIR By: JCFC
Date: April 30, 2021, 4:53 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Ref Watcher link ---
>
>
> Given the need to specialise earlier now, I rather suspect
that Darren England will be amongst the last to gain valuable
experience on the Premier League (and higher) as an AR before
going on to reach that level in the middle.
>
--- End Quote ---
Whistleblower will doubtless be pleased that the very last to
benefit in this way looks certain to be another three initial
man, Mr J E C Brooks!
#Post#: 30611--------------------------------------------------
Re: Darren England
DIR By: Ref Fan
Date: April 30, 2021, 5:08 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: JCFC link ---
>
> Have I missed something? I was under the impression that there
were currently only nine out of a possible ten FIFA Referees
from England, leaving Messrs England and Jones to compete for
the one remaining spot.
>
--- End Quote ---
That was my initial thought. I assumed I'd counted incorrectly,
but I could still only get to 9. Of the older guys, was
Atkinson the last to come off - or Clatts?
#Post#: 30614--------------------------------------------------
Re: Darren England
DIR By: Whistleblower
Date: April 30, 2021, 7:46 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: JCFC link ---
>
> [quote author=Ref Watcher link=topic=2410.msg30607#msg30607
date=1619775260]
>
> Given the need to specialise earlier now, I rather suspect
that Darren England will be amongst the last to gain valuable
experience on the Premier League (and higher) as an AR before
going on to reach that level in the middle.
>
--- End Quote ---
Whistleblower will doubtless be pleased that the very last to
benefit in this way looks certain to be another three initial
man, Mr J E C Brooks!
[/quote]
Thank you JCFC; I hadn't realised John Brooks was also part of
the exclusive three forename initial club. He also goes up in my
estimation though perhaps my high opinion should be reserved for
Brooks pere and mere.
Of course having three forename initials does not automatically
confer greatness. One thinks of A C F in particular. However,
this is more than counter-balanced by A W S, D R G, T H C, L
F G, M J D and to bring us back to another thread N C H
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