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#Post#: 25706--------------------------------------------------
Re: Jon Moss/Darren Cann/VAR
DIR By: AFAref
Date: January 20, 2021, 2:11 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Tim Wills link ---
>
> What chance do us mere mortals have when a former Premier
League Referee and professional pundit says that is offside yet
@rustyref (who I believe is still a current referee and around
level 3) gives an opposing opinion?
>
--- End Quote ---
Possibly because, now retired, Rustyref was a high level
assistant referee and knows the interpretations better. The last
time the former premier league referee probably had a flag in
his hand was over 20 years ago.
The interpretation of the offside law is awful, and leaves
players with the option of leaving the ball in the hope the
attacker is given offside (easier with VAR) or play it and get
caught like in this instance.
The fact that one of the best assistants in the country, if not
the world, has given the non offside suggests that it’s the law
that’s an ass, not the officials implementing what they have
been told to
#Post#: 25707--------------------------------------------------
Re: Jon Moss/Darren Cann/VAR
DIR By: AFAref
Date: January 20, 2021, 2:16 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: rustyref link ---
>
> No because he only challenged the opponent for the ball after
Mings had controlled it.
>
> I don't like the law, especially as someone who used to play
central defence, but that just isn't offside anymore.
>
--- End Quote ---
The issue, I guess, is when was Mings “in control” of the ball.
It could be argued that chesting it (badly) down was not really
in control, as the attacker had got to the ball before Mings had
it at his feet.
#Post#: 25708--------------------------------------------------
Re: Jon Moss/Darren Cann/VAR
DIR By: pogoref
Date: January 20, 2021, 2:23 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I don't think control comes into it as Law 11 states that the
opponent only has to deliberately play it.
A player in an offside position receiving the ball from an
opponent who deliberately plays the ball, including by
deliberate handball, is not considered to have gained an
advantage, unless it was a deliberate save by any opponent.
#Post#: 25709--------------------------------------------------
Re: Jon Moss/Darren Cann/VAR
DIR By: ARF
Date: January 20, 2021, 2:29 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
At the point Mings deliberately plays the ball, the offside
player is committing no offence (hasn't played the ball, isn't
challenging the opponent for the ball and hasn't prevented the
opponent from playing the ball).
Once Mings has deliberately played the ball then it cannot be an
offside offence.
#Post#: 25710--------------------------------------------------
Re: Jon Moss/Darren Cann/VAR
DIR By: Tim Wills
Date: January 20, 2021, 2:32 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: pogoref link ---
>
> A player in an offside position receiving the ball from an
opponent who deliberately plays the ball, including by
deliberate handball, is not considered to have gained an
advantage, unless it was a deliberate save by any opponent.
>
--- End Quote ---
That explains it perfectly so Mr Moss, Mr Cann and Mr Rusty are
top of the class this evening. :D
#Post#: 25711--------------------------------------------------
Re: Jon Moss/Darren Cann/VAR
DIR By: DublinRef
Date: January 20, 2021, 2:53 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
As someone who does not support any English team I think its
interesting that, from my perspective anyway, I see more
comments along the lines of "I can only imagine the reaction if
this was club X/Y/Z" than I do actual comments reacting to poor
calls against clubs X/Y/Z!! (Maybe they just get all the calls
so have nothing to moan about ;))
I think its pretty clear that Mings deliberately played the ball
with his chest before any interference by his opponent, thereby
mitigating any possible offside offence.
As to how a certain former PL referee can get the interpretation
wrong? Well I trust the current officials both on field and VAR
to know the interpretations at lot better (not forgetting
rustyref too!) than a former PL referee who I have heard give at
best 'dumbed down' and at worst incorrect interpretations on
different occasions in the past.
#Post#: 25713--------------------------------------------------
Re: Jon Moss/Darren Cann/VAR
DIR By: rustyref
Date: January 20, 2021, 3:09 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: AFAref link ---
>
> [quote author=Tim Wills link=topic=2097.msg25701#msg25701
date=1611172876]
> What chance do us mere mortals have when a former Premier
League Referee and professional pundit says that is offside yet
@rustyref (who I believe is still a current referee and around
level 3) gives an opposing opinion?
>
--- End Quote ---
Possibly because, now retired, Rustyref was a high level
assistant referee and knows the interpretations better. The last
time the former premier league referee probably had a flag in
his hand was over 20 years ago.
The interpretation of the offside law is awful, and leaves
players with the option of leaving the ball in the hope the
attacker is given offside (easier with VAR) or play it and get
caught like in this instance.
The fact that one of the best assistants in the country, if not
the world, has given the non offside suggests that it’s the law
that’s an ass, not the officials implementing what they have
been told to
[/quote]
Not quite fully retired, but my knees gave up on L3 a few years
ago :)
I'm now a senior observer and we get shown videos on things just
like this. Once Mings deliberately touches the ball, and there
is no requirement for him to control it, the offside is reset so
it can't be offside.
#Post#: 25714--------------------------------------------------
Re: Jon Moss/Darren Cann/VAR
DIR By: ARF
Date: January 20, 2021, 3:13 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: rustyref link ---
>
> [quote author=AFAref link=topic=2097.msg25706#msg25706
date=1611173479]
> [quote author=Tim Wills link=topic=2097.msg25701#msg25701
date=1611172876]
> What chance do us mere mortals have when a former Premier
League Referee and professional pundit says that is offside yet
@rustyref (who I believe is still a current referee and around
level 3) gives an opposing opinion?
>
--- End Quote ---
Possibly because, now retired, Rustyref was a high level
assistant referee and knows the interpretations better. The last
time the former premier league referee probably had a flag in
his hand was over 20 years ago.
The interpretation of the offside law is awful, and leaves
players with the option of leaving the ball in the hope the
attacker is given offside (easier with VAR) or play it and get
caught like in this instance.
The fact that one of the best assistants in the country, if not
the world, has given the non offside suggests that it’s the law
that’s an ass, not the officials implementing what they have
been told to
[/quote]
Not quite fully retired, but my knees gave up on L3 a few years
ago :)
I'm now a senior observer and we get shown videos on things just
like this. Once Mings deliberately touches the ball, and there
is no requirement for him to control it, the offside is reset so
it can't be offside.
[/quote]
Senior being the operative word ;) ;D
#Post#: 25715--------------------------------------------------
Re: Jon Moss/Darren Cann/VAR
DIR By: Beryl
Date: January 20, 2021, 3:19 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Its onside. Its not even worthy of debate
Anyone unsure can contact their local RDO or equal for a
reminder of the law
Shocked to come onto a referee forum and see such ignorance of
law
No wonder public park players loose it, when match officials
themselves are so ill informed
#Post#: 25718--------------------------------------------------
Re: Jon Moss/Darren Cann/VAR
DIR By: rustyref
Date: January 20, 2021, 4:13 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: ARF link ---
>
> [quote author=rustyref link=topic=2097.msg25713#msg25713
date=1611176955]
> [quote author=AFAref link=topic=2097.msg25706#msg25706
date=1611173479]
> [quote author=Tim Wills link=topic=2097.msg25701#msg25701
date=1611172876]
> What chance do us mere mortals have when a former Premier
League Referee and professional pundit says that is offside yet
@rustyref (who I believe is still a current referee and around
level 3) gives an opposing opinion?
>
--- End Quote ---
Possibly because, now retired, Rustyref was a high level
assistant referee and knows the interpretations better. The last
time the former premier league referee probably had a flag in
his hand was over 20 years ago.
The interpretation of the offside law is awful, and leaves
players with the option of leaving the ball in the hope the
attacker is given offside (easier with VAR) or play it and get
caught like in this instance.
The fact that one of the best assistants in the country, if not
the world, has given the non offside suggests that it’s the law
that’s an ass, not the officials implementing what they have
been told to
[/quote]
Not quite fully retired, but my knees gave up on L3 a few years
ago :)
I'm now a senior observer and we get shown videos on things just
like this. Once Mings deliberately touches the ball, and there
is no requirement for him to control it, the offside is reset so
it can't be offside.
[/quote]
Senior being the operative word ;) ;D
[/quote]
I'll give you that :)
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