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#Post#: 24837--------------------------------------------------
VAR vs TMO
DIR By: ECity77
Date: December 28, 2020, 5:29 am
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Hi,
I hope everyone had a good Christmas!
I have read a lot of the posts on Darren England and Rob Jones
from there games. I find it very interesting to see what other
people think.
I also watch a lot of rugby union. I watched Harlequins vs
Bristol Bears on Saturday. The TMO was Wayne Barnes a man with
so much refereeing experience. He was the TMO on paper but the
way he coaches the match referee at the same time was amazing to
watch. Using his experience to help others progress. Even with
little comments like `good call` or `watch the late tackles`.
Little things to help a referee out.
My point... Why can this not happen in football? I know at the
moment only the VAR referee can talk to the on filed referee.
But, the experience of Martin Atkinson and Mike Dean could help
younger and new premiership referees so much. With the
experience referees knowing the teams so well and not disrespect
to Burnley they a very physical team. Not an easy team to
referee and that is clear to see on the TV.
I just think football (VAR) could learn a lot from rugby union
(TMO) and I think it would be a very good way to help football
and referees out. I just wonder what other people think about
it.
Happy New year!
#Post#: 24841--------------------------------------------------
Re: VAR vs TMO
DIR By: Ashington46
Date: December 28, 2020, 6:57 am
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I don't see what harm it would do, however, many of the referees
used on VAR are relatively inexperienced and this could cause
problems if they are doing VAR with an experienced official is
on the field.
It could be something which they could discuss in their meetings
and see what the concensus of opinion is.
I accept that you are not trying to disrespect Burnley on being
physical and difficult to referee. They are 11th in the table
for fouls committed and are way behind teams like Villa, Wolves,
Spurs, Man United,Southampton, Brighton etc. who are media
darlings. In addition they are joint 10th in the table of most
fouled teams. Villa are top of the most fouled teams, however,
they are joint 4th in the table of those dishing it out as well.
In other words, they are pretty much bang average so I don't see
why they should be more difficult to referee because they are a
fairly honest team who play the game to their strengths using
the players that they can afford. They do not conform to the
model that the PL is seemingly trying to achieve, however, like
the officials, they have got to where they are on merit.
#Post#: 24842--------------------------------------------------
Re: VAR vs TMO
DIR By: ECity77
Date: December 28, 2020, 7:22 am
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I see what you mean with the VAR officials and that the
experience varies. I meant more for the newer SG1 referees like
Darren England and Rob Jones could have a more experienced
referee on VAR duty.
I did not really mean for every referee but to help settle the
newer SG1 referees in. As there is such a vast amount of
experience that Mike Dean and Martin Atkinson could offer these
up and coming referees.
I had not looked at the foul count in the premier league I just
meant it more by Burnley are physical as in the ball is in the
air a lot. It is just the style of football they play and works
for them I suppose.
In my opinion football could learn a lot from how rugby use
there TMO and I think it could help the referees out a lot more.
But that is just my opinion.
#Post#: 24845--------------------------------------------------
Re: VAR vs TMO
DIR By: Ashington46
Date: December 28, 2020, 7:25 am
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--- Quote from: ECity77 link ---
>
> I see what you mean with the VAR officials and that the
experience varies. I meant more for the newer SG1 referees like
Darren England and Rob Jones could have a more experienced
referee on VAR duty.
> I did not really mean for every referee but to help settle the
newer SG1 referees in. As there is such a vast amount of
experience that Mike Dean and Martin Atkinson could offer these
up and coming referees.
>
> I had not looked at the foul count in the premier league I
just meant it more by Burnley are physical as in the ball is in
the air a lot. It is just the style of football they play and
works for them I suppose.
>
> In my opinion football could learn a lot from how rugby use
there TMO and I think it could help the referees out a lot more.
>
> But that is just my opinion.
>
--- End Quote ---
Nothing wrong with that opinion at all, however, the VAR in the
game which caused most controversy yesterday was Michael Oliver
so nothing to add really.
#Post#: 24846--------------------------------------------------
Re: VAR vs TMO
DIR By: ajb95
Date: December 28, 2020, 7:38 am
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One of the main issues with a TMO style VAR in football is there
is not really any natural stoppages - not only do you have tries
but also scrums etc. Which means you can stop and look at what’s
going on. In football you can’t really stop and spend 2 minutes
looking at something which might have occurred because it slows
the spectacle and intensity of the game
#Post#: 24847--------------------------------------------------
Re: VAR vs TMO
DIR By: Ashington46
Date: December 28, 2020, 7:45 am
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--- Quote from: ajb95 link ---
>
> One of the main issues with a TMO style VAR in football is
there is not really any natural stoppages - not only do you have
tries but also scrums etc. Which means you can stop and look at
what’s going on. In football you can’t really stop and spend 2
minutes looking at something which might have occurred because
it slows the spectacle and intensity of the game
>
--- End Quote ---
I thought that that was the main purpose of VAR! :D
#Post#: 24848--------------------------------------------------
Re: VAR vs TMO
DIR By: RCG
Date: December 28, 2020, 7:48 am
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Having watched the UEFA programmes it would appear more
communication does take place, which includes the odd element of
praise and encouragement.
I am sure Rob had plenty of support from his on field colleagues
as well, none more experienced than Darren Cann.
The reason TMO appears to work better is that we can hear the
conversation. Wayne Barnes is one of the worlds best at
communication and everything he did was to support the on field
referee.
As has been mentioned before if there was a weekly summary
programme, akin to the MLS, we would all have a better
understanding
#Post#: 24849--------------------------------------------------
Re: VAR vs TMO
DIR By: AFAref
Date: December 28, 2020, 8:40 am
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I would hope that once VAR becomes more ingrained into the game,
the need to pass a "fitness test" will be taken out of the
criteria. This would then allow for a VAR panel of ex-referees
to operate it (pretty much like rugby did to start with).
If aging officials knew that they would have an option of
staying involved in the game with the camaraderie of their
peers, and recompensed, then maybe they would step back earlier
and allow younger referees to come through.
At the moment they go from what, 70k a year(?), to out of work
when they retire from the game. Possibly a coaching role, but
there won't be that many needed.
This way, aging officials would be guaranteed an income, and
still be involved in the game as they would need to go to all
the meetings etc
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