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#Post#: 21009--------------------------------------------------
Re: Martin Atkinson Man Utd vs Crystal Palace
DIR By: Leggy
Date: September 20, 2020, 4:49 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: ajb95 link ---
>
> [quote author=Matt link=topic=1773.msg20979#msg20979
date=1600542084]
> [quote author=ajb95 link=topic=1773.msg20977#msg20977
date=1600541725]
> Not sure about the penalty -Lindelof is very close to Zaha, 1
yard away, and natural movement of his arm when running back.
> The handball rule is an absolute con; we are going to see so
many ridiculous handballs this season
>
--- End Quote ---
I'm sorry - in what godly earth, is an arm bent at head height
"natural" ?
[/quote]
If you look at it again his hand isn’t at head height. When you
run your arms are going to come up naturally, you can’t run with
your arms by your side
[/quote]
Agree. Before the law-makers start quoting "natural /
un-natural positions" and "enlarging the body silhoulette" they
should engage bio-mechanic experts to determine - in all playing
situations (running / stretching / jumping / falling) - what is
/ is not natural.
We are rapidly approaching the stage where a forward with not
reasonable attacking option will just aim the ball at the
defender's body in the hope of securing a penalty kick. It has
been a legitimate tactic in hockey with penalty corners for some
years now ...... watch this space!
#Post#: 21027--------------------------------------------------
Re: Martin Atkinson Man Utd vs Crystal Palace
DIR By: ajb95
Date: September 20, 2020, 12:29 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
A very good match by David Coote this lunchtime - until a
shocking decision for the handball against Spurs. How that can
be handball is beyond me.
Who was the VAR clown advising him to take a look!?
#Post#: 21031--------------------------------------------------
Re: Martin Atkinson Man Utd vs Crystal Palace
DIR By: rustyref
Date: September 20, 2020, 12:55 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
His arm was out from the body. The ball hit it, that will
always be given as a penalty under the new law.
Don't agree with it personally, but the officials can only
follow the current law and we are now seeing handball penalties
given that wouldn't have been given last season. Everyone just
needs to get used to it as it won't be changing.
#Post#: 21036--------------------------------------------------
Re: Martin Atkinson Man Utd vs Crystal Palace
DIR By: Readingfan
Date: September 20, 2020, 1:53 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: ajb95 link ---
>
> A very good match by David Coote this lunchtime - until a
shocking decision for the handball against Spurs. How that can
be handball is beyond me.
> Who was the VAR clown advising him to take a look!?
>
--- End Quote ---
Chris Kavanagh was the VAR but I don't think it matters - I'm
sure other VARs/referees will give penalties for that sort of
things next week or the week after.
I agree Coote did well.
#Post#: 21042--------------------------------------------------
Re: Martin Atkinson Man Utd vs Crystal Palace
DIR By: ajb95
Date: September 20, 2020, 3:48 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: rustyref link ---
>
> His arm was out from the body. The ball hit it, that will
always be given as a penalty under the new law.
>
> Don't agree with it personally, but the officials can only
follow the current law and we are now seeing handball penalties
given that wouldn't have been given last season. Everyone just
needs to get used to it as it won't be changing.
>
--- End Quote ---
Who is making these laws?? I know it’s IFAB on advice from FIFA
but is it lead by ex referees etc.??
Surely someone with a brain cell has got to be looking at this
and can’t be happy.
I know most football fans aren’t and football is slowly losing a
lot of interest!
#Post#: 21044--------------------------------------------------
Re: Martin Atkinson Man Utd vs Crystal Palace
DIR By: rustyref
Date: September 20, 2020, 4:41 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: ajb95 link ---
>
> [quote author=rustyref link=topic=1773.msg21031#msg21031
date=1600624529]
> His arm was out from the body. The ball hit it, that will
always be given as a penalty under the new law.
>
> Don't agree with it personally, but the officials can only
follow the current law and we are now seeing handball penalties
given that wouldn't have been given last season. Everyone just
needs to get used to it as it won't be changing.
>
--- End Quote ---
Who is making these laws?? I know it’s IFAB on advice from FIFA
but is it lead by ex referees etc.??
Surely someone with a brain cell has got to be looking at this
and can’t be happy.
I know most football fans aren’t and football is slowly losing a
lot of interest!
[/quote]
Something I've said before, laws are made by people that haven't
played football to any kind of level. They probably think that
you can run with your arms pinned by your side.
But once the laws are made all referees can do is apply them.
#Post#: 21045--------------------------------------------------
Re: Martin Atkinson Man Utd vs Crystal Palace
DIR By: Readingfan
Date: September 20, 2020, 4:53 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
At least it has made handball more consistent. There used to be
lots of discussion about whether an incident such as Trent
Alexander-Arnold's handling last season agI do find it easier to
judge a handball offence now, even if I don't personally agree.
It's basically gone in the PL from a player getting a lot of the
benefit of the doubt if the ball hit their hand to them being
given very little. A lot was required for handball in England
previously, but now if the ball hits your hand it's likely to be
penalised if VAR is in use unless your hand is very close to
your body.
#Post#: 21060--------------------------------------------------
Re: Martin Atkinson Man Utd vs Crystal Palace
DIR By: Ashington46
Date: September 21, 2020, 3:30 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Readingfan link ---
>
> At least it has made handball more consistent. There used to
be lots of discussion about whether an incident such as Trent
Alexander-Arnold's handling last season agI do find it easier to
judge a handball offence now, even if I don't personally agree.
>
> It's basically gone in the PL from a player getting a lot of
the benefit of the doubt if the ball hit their hand to them
being given very little. A lot was required for handball in
England previously, but now if the ball hits your hand it's
likely to be penalised if VAR is in use unless your hand is very
close to your body.
>
--- End Quote ---
Perhaps it makes it more consistent if the offence happens in
the penalty area, however, there were several instances of
handball, similar to those leading to penalties in the games
discussed, which were committed in general play and these were
not penalised.
The question which then arises is are we playing to different
laws in the penalty area to those used on the rest of the field
because some are covered by VAR but others are not?
#Post#: 21062--------------------------------------------------
Re: Martin Atkinson Man Utd vs Crystal Palace
DIR By: ajb95
Date: September 21, 2020, 3:44 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Ashington46 link ---
>
> [quote author=Readingfan link=topic=1773.msg21045#msg21045
date=1600638802]
> At least it has made handball more consistent. There used to
be lots of discussion about whether an incident such as Trent
Alexander-Arnold's handling last season agI do find it easier to
judge a handball offence now, even if I don't personally agree.
>
> It's basically gone in the PL from a player getting a lot of
the benefit of the doubt if the ball hit their hand to them
being given very little. A lot was required for handball in
England previously, but now if the ball hits your hand it's
likely to be penalised if VAR is in use unless your hand is very
close to your body.
>
--- End Quote ---
Perhaps it makes it more consistent if the offence happens in
the penalty area, however, there were several instances of
handball, similar to those leading to penalties in the games
discussed, which were committed in general play and these were
not penalised.
The question which then arises is are we playing to different
laws in the penalty area to those used on the rest of the field
because some are covered by VAR but others are not?
[/quote]
That’s right Ashington
As as I’m aware the LOTG still states that handball must be
deliberate - as it has been for an age
#Post#: 21064--------------------------------------------------
Re: Martin Atkinson Man Utd vs Crystal Palace
DIR By: Readingfan
Date: September 21, 2020, 5:02 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: ajb95 link ---
>
> [quote author=Ashington46 link=topic=1773.msg21060#msg21060
date=1600677017]
> [quote author=Readingfan link=topic=1773.msg21045#msg21045
date=1600638802]
> At least it has made handball more consistent. There used to
be lots of discussion about whether an incident such as Trent
Alexander-Arnold's handling last season agI do find it easier to
judge a handball offence now, even if I don't personally agree.
>
> It's basically gone in the PL from a player getting a lot of
the benefit of the doubt if the ball hit their hand to them
being given very little. A lot was required for handball in
England previously, but now if the ball hits your hand it's
likely to be penalised if VAR is in use unless your hand is very
close to your body.
>
--- End Quote ---
Perhaps it makes it more consistent if the offence happens in
the penalty area, however, there were several instances of
handball, similar to those leading to penalties in the games
discussed, which were committed in general play and these were
not penalised.
The question which then arises is are we playing to different
laws in the penalty area to those used on the rest of the field
because some are covered by VAR but others are not?
[/quote]
That’s right Ashington
As as I’m aware the LOTG still states that handball must be
deliberate - as it has been for an age
[/quote]
Deliberate handball is still an offence - but there are many
other handball offences where 'deliberate' is not used (as Mark
Clattenburg said in a recent Daily Mail article)
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