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#Post#: 17904--------------------------------------------------
BAME referees
DIR By: Readingfan
Date: June 11, 2020, 3:53 am
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A piece from the Daily Mail noting that no referee on the
National List (out of 79 in total) this season is from a BAME
background and speaking to the last black Premier League
referee, Uriah Rennie, who retired 12 years ago -
HTML https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-8407859/Uriah-Rennie-pleads-action-increase-diversity-football-officials.html
I have wondered about this before. What is with this lack of
diversity? Are the FA failing to reach people of certain
backgrounds/communities initially and so non-white males are
less likely to begin refereeing in the first place? Or do they
not get the opportunities for promotion? Does there need to be
more diversity in terms of those in authority so that there is
increased consideration as to how to attract wider demographics
to refereeing and harness their development when they get there?
#Post#: 17907--------------------------------------------------
Re: BAME referees
DIR By: ajb95
Date: June 11, 2020, 5:48 am
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Cannot talk about all BAME referees in the UK, but there a
couple in the manchester area who are on their way up!
I once knew a referee who was originally from Pakistan but grew
up here. He had been a referee for over 40 years. He said to me
once that he still got terrible racism at some games.
I also know a black guy. I hadn’t seen him for about 4 years and
he said he left the game due to the terrible racism he was
getting at matches - and only now had the confidence to make a
comeback!
#Post#: 17910--------------------------------------------------
Re: BAME referees
DIR By: TheThingFromLewes
Date: June 11, 2020, 6:33 am
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I’ve just read that article and I wasn’t aware of the furore
Lord Elleray created in 2014.
I do hope that Akil Howson is on the road to at least SG1 AR.
He’s always been a steady assistant and deserves a chance at the
top.
#Post#: 17913--------------------------------------------------
Re: BAME referees
DIR By: bmb
Date: June 11, 2020, 9:18 am
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From personal experience my son gave up refereeing due to
horrendous racial abuse. Not from anyone within the game itself,
he had tremendous support from Andre Marriner, Mark Clattenburg,
Lucy Oliver, Viktor Kassai, György Ring & Gábor Erős in
particular but also from Chris Wild at UEFA and dare I say it
Lord Elleray! The National list referees he met over the years
all spent time talking to him, advising him, discussing
decisions with him, answering all his questions and guiding him.
Many left games late due to sitting with him afterwards and
giving him all the time he wanted and needed. The abuse came
from the crowd at 2 different games, the coaches from the teams
in the games stepped in with parents of the children playing to
let those responsible know their behaviour was completely
unacceptable and I have a lot of respect for them for their
support as well but those few idiots in the crowd completely
shattered my little boy's confidence. Not just with refereeing
either, with life in general, it affected his schooling in a
very detrimental way. Troy Townsend did a lot of work with him
on a 1:1 basis and Andre, Mark & Viktor were very active in
their support, it took a year before that boy even smiled again.
He won't even go to a football match anymore, let alone referee
a game. The thing that always struck me with the situation with
my lad was when he sat there crying his eyes out and said "Mum
if they said I was a s**t referee I'd not mind that, I make
mistakes, I'm learning, it's ok to make mistakes and it's ok for
them to disagree with my decisions but why hate me for my skin
colour, I don't understand, I can't understand why it makes a
difference". Who knows whether he would have gone on & been a
FIFA referee or not, certainly several at high levels of the
game were tracking him because they saw a real talent in him
especially actually as an AR, he may well never have got above
Sunday league level but we will never know because some idiots
took it away from him over his skin colour.
His is not an isolated case. I suspect, but don't know for fact,
there are many youngsters from the BAME communities who simply
don't take up the whistle or remain with it for similar reasons.
I think you tend to hear more incidents within those communities
than if you are not living within them yourselves. I know it's
not the only form of abuse & there are other young refs out
there getting abuse for their bright ginger hair, for having a
bit of puppy fat on them, for being too skinny, knock kneed or
whatever else people can find to make fun of & bully them for.
Add in any disability, homophobia and sexism for the full sweep,
all just as appalling to me. There's a reason there are no
openly gay referees (and players) in the top flight - homophobic
abuse. I mean this no way disrespectfully & I know no-one would
take it as such but it is a lot easier to hide being gay than it
is to hide skin colour so a gay referee or player can 'bypass'
the abuse by remaining in the closet. That is so wrong. Not that
they can make it but that they have to hide it away. Ryan T
Atkin was incredibly brave to come out, but he shouldn't have
had to be brave to do so. It shouldn't even be an issue in 2020
yet here it is still an issue. How depressing is that?
Racism in football has come a long way but there is still a long
way to go. Ian Wright was subjected to some horrendous racist
abuse just a couple of weeks ago. Raheem Sterling is a very high
profile target of racial abuse on a regular basis, as are other
top non white players, he is not alone. All the time there are
people willing to abuse the top players, and those around who do
not stop them, you can imagine the levels of abuse that will
come the way of the least popular person on the pitch. I imagine
it could put many off wanting to reach those levels of the game!
I don't know if there is institutional racism within the FA
itself, I would hope not. I know of 1 referee who says he would
have made the FIFA list if only he was white, well I've seen him
referee, several times & him not making the FIFA list is nothing
to do with the colour of his skin but more to do with his lack
of ability as a referee! That sort of thing is also a problem,
those who will wrongly play the race card because they won't
accept it's a lack of talent or ability on their own part and
nothing to do with race. They set diversity back as much as the
racists do.
#Post#: 17921--------------------------------------------------
Re: BAME referees
DIR By: Ashington46
Date: June 11, 2020, 11:59 am
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bmb ----a very interesting and very sad read in relation to your
son, I sincerely hope that he is feeling confident again and
able to get on with his life.
Sadly, this problem is not going away and has been prevalent in
the game for a long, long time.
When I played in the Middlesex area in the late 70s and 80s
there were a number of teams of differing races and I used to
cringe at some of the things which were said to them and the
names that they were called. Regardless of this, they continued
in the league and I admired them for it because they really just
wnated to play competitive football.
The one referee I knew of BAME origin in those days was also
subjected to lots of abuse and it led to his giving up in the
end and he was very disappointed.
I am talking almost 50 years ago and, although it could be
argued that things have got better, it is very sad to read bad
reports from all over the country.
You question whether or not the FA is institutionally racist and
I don't know the answer, however, in the end, everything comes
down to the actions of every individual, sadly, we have no
control over their mind and consequently there is no easy answer
to a very complex problem, even in these more enlightened times
---or so they tell me! Very sad indeed.
#Post#: 17925--------------------------------------------------
Re: BAME referees
DIR By: bmb
Date: June 11, 2020, 4:06 pm
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--- Quote from: Ashington46 link ---
>
> bmb ----a very interesting and very sad read in relation to
your son, I sincerely hope that he is feeling confident again
and able to get on with his life.
>
--- End Quote ---
He is getting on with his life now yes, thank you for checking.
One day he had boys talk with both Mark & Andre, I don't know
what was said, I'm a girl so it was none of my business and the
3 of them completely excluded me from their talk but the
following week he went into school and came home all excited
telling me that he had been made an anti bullying coordinator.
Whatever they said to him finally hit home with him & he
realised he could make a difference to other kids lives as well
as his own. He really threw himself into it, making safe zones
for bullied kids within the school, being available as a mentor
to them, getting other kids involved in anti bullying programs,
with I hasten to add some fantastic support from his head
teacher & the other teachers at his school. He started to tutor
younger kids in both Spanish and French, his strongest subjects
and grew into a very strong, inspirational young man. He
officially leaves school this summer & is awaiting his allocated
A'Level results so that he knows which university he will be
attending from September (one he has a conditional offer of 2A's
& a B, the other unconditional). He wants to be a science
teacher and work with children, in particular, ones with special
needs and/or who are vulnerable. I think he will be rather ace
at it myself, he's taken that experience & turned into a
positive way for him to make a difference. Yep Im a proud Mum!
#Post#: 17928--------------------------------------------------
Re: BAME referees
DIR By: bmb
Date: June 11, 2020, 4:31 pm
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--- Quote from: Ashington46 link ---
>
> You question whether or not the FA is institutionally racist
and I don't know the answer, however, in the end, everything
comes down to the actions of every individual, sadly, we have no
control over their mind and consequently there is no easy answer
to a very complex problem, even in these more enlightened times
---or so they tell me! Very sad indeed.
>
--- End Quote ---
Without wanting to get into a political debate with anyone
regarding the rights/wrongs of the recent BLM protests & things
like the statues issues that have arisen, as a result of them...
the main thing that I noticed was how many white kids
(especially the 16-24 age group) also attended the protests in
support of an equality for all message. There were also several
key black role models saying that the knife crime has to stop
because it fuels an anti attitude. In that respect it felt
different to protests in the past from various eras and maybe
just maybe these youngsters will continue to unite in a positive
way and be the ones to finally start to rid our world of the
scourge that is discrimination. Seeing so many youngsters
standing together to fight inequality regardless of
race/religion/ability etc gave me some hope for the future.
#Post#: 17958--------------------------------------------------
Re: BAME referees
DIR By: guest42
Date: June 13, 2020, 1:08 pm
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I think this was the only other high profile case involving the
FA
HTML https://www.theguardian.com/football/2001/dec/06/newsstory.sport4
#Post#: 17960--------------------------------------------------
Re: BAME referees
DIR By: bmb
Date: June 13, 2020, 3:14 pm
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--- Quote from: BAFRA #217 link ---
>
> I think this was the only other high profile case involving
the FA
>
>
HTML https://www.theguardian.com/football/2001/dec/06/newsstory.sport4
>
--- End Quote ---
I remember that! I would hope things have moved on in the 15
years since but who knows!
#Post#: 17970--------------------------------------------------
Re: BAME referees
DIR By: dave26
Date: June 15, 2020, 1:48 am
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Apologies if this comes across as anything other than a genuine
question , but how come the PL are allowing Black Lives Matter
on their shirts instead of their names yet they wasn’t allowed
to have poppies on their shirts surely this is double standards
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