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#Post#: 15924--------------------------------------------------
Arsene Wenger suggests VAR changes
DIR By: Readingfan
Date: February 19, 2020, 10:30 am
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In his new role, Arsene Wenger has suggested a number of
possible changes to VAR/laws. There seems to be disagreement
about if these coudl be implemented for next season but latest
suggestions seem that the first two in particular wouldn't
become active until June 2021, if at all.
1. Offside law to be changed (in line with ideas mentioned
previously by Rory Smith and Graeme Souness) so that any part of
your body that you are onside if any part of the attacker is
level with the second last defender - the reverse of the current
situation essentially.
2. Fan communication to improve - all stadiums in leagues using
VAR will be required to have a big screen and fans will be able
to hear conversation between officials and see VAR process.(This
is one I'm very much in favour of!)
3. Pool of VARs trained to be widened to incorporate former
referees and possibly even some players.
#Post#: 15929--------------------------------------------------
Re: Arsene Wenger suggests VAR changes
DIR By: bmb
Date: February 19, 2020, 10:48 am
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1. Just changes where the lines are drawn, imo. Saw a photo
earlier on twitter that showed Raheem Sterling would be onside
under the proposed changes and for me that particular example is
just as wrong as someone being judged by their nosehair being
offside by 0.1mm!!
HTML https://twitter.com/DaleJohnsonESPN/status/1230096471229423617
Changes do need to happen but not sure rushing something through
without proper testing/scrutiny is a good idea & that seems to
be what he is trying to do.
Agree with 2 & 3. We've had discussions on here before about ex
refs taking on the VAR role. I still don't understand why it
needs people who have currently passed the fitness test as it is
now. Makes zero sense to me. As for some ex players, well some
have turned into excellent match day delegates so I'm not
completely opposed to the idea!
#Post#: 15930--------------------------------------------------
Re: Arsene Wenger suggests VAR changes
DIR By: Ref Watcher
Date: February 19, 2020, 11:31 am
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The problem I see with Arsene Wenger's first proposal, other
than the objection already raised by BMB, is that this would be
devilishly difficult to adjudicate on for assistant referees in
non VAR games. Looking across a crowded penalty area at the
moment you just look for the closest body part to the goal line.
Under this proposal you would be attempting to look through
bodies to see what is overlapping. Surely we won't go down the
route of different Laws for VAR and non VAR games, something
IFAB has always been dead against.
The second proposal is a no-brainer and the third is worthy of
consideration, although I am not sure how involving ex-players
will work. They would have to be trained in the Laws at which
point they would probably become poachers turned gamekeepers,
realising referees were right all along!
#Post#: 15933--------------------------------------------------
Re: Arsene Wenger suggests VAR changes
DIR By: QuoCob
Date: February 19, 2020, 12:05 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Ref Watcher link ---
>
> The problem I see with Arsene Wenger's first proposal, other
than the objection already raised by BMB, is that this would be
devilishly difficult to adjudicate on for assistant referees in
non VAR games. Looking across a crowded penalty area at the
moment you just look for the closest body part to the goal line.
Under this proposal you would be attempting to look through
bodies to see what is overlapping. Surely we won't go down the
route of different Laws for VAR and non VAR games, something
IFAB has always been dead against.
>
>
--- End Quote ---
Players get confused enough as it is, imagine the chaos if
players were playing with and/or without VAR in the different
competitions and playing to different interpretations of the
Laws!
#Post#: 15936--------------------------------------------------
Re: Arsene Wenger suggests VAR changes
DIR By: bmb
Date: February 19, 2020, 1:50 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: QuoCob link ---
>
> [quote author=Ref Watcher link=topic=1390.msg15930#msg15930
date=1582133504]
> The problem I see with Arsene Wenger's first proposal, other
than the objection already raised by BMB, is that this would be
devilishly difficult to adjudicate on for assistant referees in
non VAR games. Looking across a crowded penalty area at the
moment you just look for the closest body part to the goal line.
Under this proposal you would be attempting to look through
bodies to see what is overlapping. Surely we won't go down the
route of different Laws for VAR and non VAR games, something
IFAB has always been dead against.
>
>
--- End Quote ---
Players get confused enough as it is, imagine the chaos if
players were playing with and/or without VAR in the different
competitions and playing to different interpretations of the
Laws!
[/quote]
Not just players though, can only imagine what an utter
nightmare it would be for AR's & refs. They'd spend most of the
game reminding themselves which rules they are officiating to
#Post#: 15937--------------------------------------------------
Re: Arsene Wenger suggests VAR changes
DIR By: QuoCob
Date: February 19, 2020, 2:13 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: bmb link ---
>
> [quote author=QuoCob link=topic=1390.msg15933#msg15933
date=1582135512]
> [quote author=Ref Watcher link=topic=1390.msg15930#msg15930
date=1582133504]
> The problem I see with Arsene Wenger's first proposal, other
than the objection already raised by BMB, is that this would be
devilishly difficult to adjudicate on for assistant referees in
non VAR games. Looking across a crowded penalty area at the
moment you just look for the closest body part to the goal line.
Under this proposal you would be attempting to look through
bodies to see what is overlapping. Surely we won't go down the
route of different Laws for VAR and non VAR games, something
IFAB has always been dead against.
>
>
--- End Quote ---
Players get confused enough as it is, imagine the chaos if
players were playing with and/or without VAR in the different
competitions and playing to different interpretations of the
Laws!
[/quote]
Not just players though, can only imagine what an utter
nightmare it would be for AR's & refs. They'd spend most of the
game reminding themselves which rules they are officiating to
[/quote]
I took the problems for the officials as a given but if swapping
between the two, currently it is instinctive and normally get it
right without thinking. Swapping and changing would remove the
instinctiveness of it all and elongate the reaction times. (I'm
sure that I've made up a couple of words there?)
#Post#: 15945--------------------------------------------------
Re: Arsene Wenger suggests VAR changes
DIR By: flipmode
Date: February 19, 2020, 5:56 pm
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It's quite ironic that Arsene Wenger, of all people, has become
the voice of reason and the appointed beacon of light for change
with VAR, when he spent his whole managerial career not seeing
certain incidents! ;D
#Post#: 15946--------------------------------------------------
Re: Arsene Wenger suggests VAR changes
DIR By: RCG
Date: February 20, 2020, 1:08 am
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Isn't number 1 the same as saying there should be daylight
between attacker and defender? (As we were doing "it" in the
early 2000s)
#Post#: 15948--------------------------------------------------
Re: Arsene Wenger suggests VAR changes
DIR By: JohnCoyle
Date: February 20, 2020, 3:40 am
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Why don't we just do away with the VAR lines and only use it to
overturn offside decisions that are manifestly wrong (eg
Aubameyang against Man United)? In other words, "Assistant's
Call."
#Post#: 15952--------------------------------------------------
Re: Arsene Wenger suggests VAR changes
DIR By: Readingfan
Date: February 20, 2020, 5:17 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: JohnCoyle link ---
>
> Why don't we just do away with the VAR lines and only use it
to overturn offside decisions that are manifestly wrong (eg
Aubameyang against Man United)? In other words, "Assistant's
Call."
>
--- End Quote ---
I think there's a certain credence to this and probably in line
with the spirit of VAR. Isn't this pretty much what happens in
rugby with, for instance, a forward pass?
They did initially use this in leagues such as Australia. The
problem was that officials invariably had different
interpretations of what a clear offside was and there was a
major final where VAR supported the assistant's decision to give
offside but the broadcasters added in their own lines post-match
to prove it was onside and there was a massive outcry, so the A
League has now moved to using the lines.
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