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       #Post#: 4823--------------------------------------------------
       Will the real Jed McKenna please stand up!
   DIR By: Plato
       Date: July 10, 2021, 10:43 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       From IGF email today...
       THERE IS NO JED MCKENNA
       Once upon a time, there was an age of gurus.
       If you were a serious seeker after the Truth, you needed a
       teacher, but not just any teacher. You needed a special kind of
       teacher called a "guru". Tradition dictated that this someone
       should be viewed as a representative of God, a person who was
       indistinguishable from the path itself, someone you could pour
       your devotion upon, someone who could make decisions for you
       better than you would make them for yourself. In losing yourself
       to the teacher you would, ideally, dissolve into Godhood.
       Fortunately or unfortunately, no matter what level of spiritual
       realization any guru could attain, they never actually achieved
       Godhood, at least no more so than you or your Aunt Matilda have.
       As long as they stuck around in a human body, they remained
       flawed and corruptible humans with limited personalities and a
       tendency to reproduce their own cultural conditioning for their
       constituencies. Giving over your authority to any other human is
       fraught with challenges. As I am sure you know by now, I don't
       recommend it.
       In some contexts and languages, "guru" simply means teacher, in
       the basic sense of the word. To be a so-called "spiritual"
       teacher, you don't need to represent yourself as a superhuman.
       You can just be a person. We can all be teachers to each other.
       You can have as many as you want.
       The age of gurus has given way to the age of auto-didacts. All
       the gurus (true, false, and in between) have written down their
       teachings, or had them transcribed or reproduced. Seekers can
       read the books and make their own paths, drawing from all the
       wisdom sources in the world, mixing and matching retreats,
       satsangs, and workshops along the way. That also means seekers
       can get spun around, follow false leads, devote themselves to
       unhelpful practices and people, and get caught for decades in
       counterproductive intellectualizations and distractions.
       While Maya is the creator of this maze, many gurus bear
       responsibility for compounding and confounding the matter. To
       find your way out of the maze, it may be time for an anti-guru.
       An anti-guru doesn’t ask you to submit your authority to
       them. They do the opposite. They remind you over and over to
       find out for yourself what's true, for you. An anti-guru would
       never suggest devotion to anything other than yourself. They
       take the attention off themselves and put it back on you. An
       anti-guru may point, gesture, reflect, nod, or perhaps go so far
       as to gently push. However, their actions are like a mirror and
       all you ever see in one is . . . you.
       The ideal anti-guru would be someone who doesn’t even
       exist. You could learn from them without having to join their
       religion or adopt some temporary belief. You could take
       advantage of their guidance without getting caught up in their
       human presentation. In the postmodern era, in the age of the
       auto-didact, an imaginary anti-guru can do things that real
       gurus never could.
       Jed McKenna is an imaginary anti-guru. He doesn’t exist and
       never did. Having said that, here’s a little on how I, Jed
       McKenna, came to "appear" to exist.
       Some years back, I met a man we'll call the Editor. He wanted to
       write a series of books about enlightenment. He had a good idea
       and good marketing but lacked one essential component. He was
       not himself enlightened, or Truth Realized, as I refer to it -
       at least not at the time. A rather serious deficiency if one is
       to write on the subject.
       I was the only Truth Realized person he knew, so he asked me if
       I would act as a consultant. I created the name Jed McKenna for
       the character in his books, a variation on Ken McMordie, the
       name given me by my adoptive parents some 70+ years ago.
       Ken McMordie
       Ken Mc -------
       ---- Mc Ken --
       Jed McKenna
       Over a series of interviews, the Editor asked me questions about
       myself and modeled the Jed character on my ideas, my personality
       (such as it was), and my responses to various hypothetical
       situations. He would place me in Jed role and inquire, for
       instance, what I might say if asked a particular question, and
       then use my answers in the imaginary conversations that took
       place in the stories.
       While I don't know with certainty what the writing process was,
       my impression is that those first books were written by what
       might be called a "committee" involving at least two other
       contributors, and that he later worked with a series of ghost
       writers. I don’t have any knowledge about whether any of
       the later writers were Truth Realized, or simply skilled writers
       on the topic.
       In any case, I only consulted on the first trilogy, which I,
       perhaps not surprisingly, consider superior to the subsequent
       books. By the time my role in the project was complete, the Jed
       character was his own person, in some ways remarkably similar to
       me and in other ways quite divergent. Sure, he was and is just a
       fictional character, but so are we all. My life, at least, is
       based on a true story. The Jed McKenna books are works of true
       fiction: entirely fictional, but no less true - as paradoxical
       as that sounds.
       Some time after the first trilogy was published, I decided I
       might like to interact with Jed McKenna readers. There was no
       real or solid Jed, but there was a sizable group of readers
       evolving who had been exposed to my ideas through the Jed
       character. I envisioned the possibility of developing those
       ideas further and assisting interested people in an online
       community. I wanted to provide a forum for students, and some
       support and guidance in their efforts toward Truth Realization.
       I used the name Jed McKenna in these forums as a way of
       continuing the teaching happening through the books. There was
       no one out there who was more Jed than myself, and indeed no
       "real" Jed who might object.
       I should interject here that when I used the phrase "my ideas"
       in the previous two paragraphs, I didn’t really mean to
       suggest that the ideas were mine. I have been a collector of
       eclectic ideas for decades. More often than not, I can't tell
       whether I originated an idea or whether I’m just passing it
       on from someone else. For that matter, the other people whose
       ideas I’ve collected probably themselves couldn't tell
       where their ideas came from. We're all just circulating and
       combining and extending the ideas that were in the field before
       we got here. There is only one consciousness, and it doesn't
       come with a copyright.
       The first online forum turned out to be a bit of a shitshow. I
       didn't fully appreciate how much even spiritually-oriented
       people are inclined to fight and insult and try to one-up each
       other when given a free rein platform. After letting that play
       itself out for far too long, I started an improved forum with
       more moderation. At the same time, I developed an online course
       (The Navigator Series) for more serious students, ones who
       wanted to dig in and do some work and have a more one-on-one
       relationship with me
       When I say "me", of course I mean Jed McKenna, even though there
       is no Jed McKenna.  There is only a role being played. That's
       just as true about you as it is about me.
       A funny twist on events began with a participant from the
       forums. We'll call her the Stalker. In an email dialogue, I
       suggested she might visit Cambodia, where I was living. I was
       simply suggesting that she'd like the country, as she had
       nothing good to say about where she was. To be clear, I was not
       suggesting that she come visit me personally. Unfortunately, she
       took it the other way and wound up quite disappointed when she
       arrived. She apparently decided that trying to find me and
       follow me would serve to reduce her feelings of disappointment.
       If you’ve ever had a stalker of your own, you know that
       they're perfectly happy to devote all their time and energy to
       their "hobby", and so she managed to spy on me, photograph me,
       and even confront me, and my friends, in person. Unfortunately,
       stalkers and journalists have a lot in common, so it was pretty
       easy for her, as the former, to pass herself off as the latter!
       She threw up a website that’s easy enough to find,
       chronicling her stalking activities and internet research. The
       result is a work of hybrid fact and fiction including some
       amusing, if irrelevant, tidbits from my pre-Truth-Realized life.
       At some point, as controversy arose online about who the "real"
       Jed McKenna was, the Editor felt the need to distance the Jed
       McKenna books from the Jed McKenna forums. He added this
       disclaimer a few years back to his Wisefool Press website:
       "Jed McKenna is not an active teacher, online or off. He does
       not engage in social media or forums. He does not give classes
       or workshops or accept money from students. He has no teachings
       or products other than those offered by Wisefool Press and our
       international publishing partners. Anyone claiming to be Jed or
       to speak for him is misrepresenting themselves."
       It’s a fascinating paragraph to study. The first three
       sentences are absolutely true. Jed McKenna is a fictional
       character and so can not be an active teacher or give classes!
       The fourth sentence is a little more in the
       pulling-wool-over-eyes category. How can a fictional character
       have teachings or products? The final sentence, however, is
       where we see the true power of the postmodern anti-guru! On the
       very webpage for Jed's books, it clearly states that, "Anyone
       claiming to be Jed or to speak for him is misrepresenting
       themselves." All the books supposedly written by Jed McKenna are
       misrepresenting themselves. Any online forum or class supposedly
       administered by Jed McKenna is misrepresenting itself. There is
       no Jed McKenna. Truth (with a capital-T) is certainly stranger
       than fiction. What passes for "truth" most of the time is just a
       form of fiction anyway.
       If the whole thing isn't strange enough for you yet, then think
       of Jed McKenna as a sort of collective. Unlike most collectives,
       which operate as unified fronts, this one consists of multiple
       divergent cells with no communication between them and no agreed
       upon guidelines. The Jed McKenna project is apparently too big
       for any one person to be in charge of it.
       This explains why the Jed McKenna books are written in such
       diverse styles, why my style is so untamed in comparison, and
       why even "my" style varies between my introductory level course,
       and the advanced level course I have been developing over the
       last two years. The former was written entirely by me, while the
       latter is a collaboration with my more organized colleague, Zara
       Songull. All of us, in our varied ways, speaking with the voice
       of the non-existent Jed McKenna.
       If you want to know who Jed Mckenna "really" is, he is the sum
       total of you and a growing group of serious seekers who are
       prepared to let everything go and in return gain the universe.
       As with "you", a "personal" Jed does not exist and never did.
       It used to be that if you met the Buddha on the road, you were
       supposed to kill him. Now the Buddha comes pre-killed. Look as
       hard as you want for Jed. All you'll ultimately find is the
       mystery of your self.
       Let any controversy be put to rest once and for all. There is no
       Jed McKenna, and there never was. There is no guru, so it’s
       a good thing you don’t need one.
       Love ya,
       Jed McKenna
       #Post#: 4824--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Will the real Jed McKenna please stand up!
   DIR By: Plato
       Date: July 10, 2021, 10:59 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Hmmm,
       I find this email somewhat satisfying (if anything false ever
       satisfies) as the missing installment in our own little
       enlightenment-ashram soap opera. I can honestly say that the 6
       month stint I (the former me) had at IGF was supremely
       transformative and that realizations made while living 24/7 in
       that headspace, hold sway over this body/mind even to this day.
       I live on the razors edge at all times, everything is dream
       state and the only thing of interest is total acceptance of this
       body/mind to what is. This Understanding will not be usurped by
       any other concept or ideology because it is the bottom rung of
       the ladder and I know this from "knowing" not from assumption or
       reasoning.
       That being said I imagine I was just as gullible as the next guy
       and that a guru type could have ensnared "me" into a seeker mode
       for the rest of my days here on the planet. But along came Jed,
       anti-guru. I tried to join him and he patiently said "no" I had
       to learn that it wasn't "out there" or in someone else, I got
       from IGF exactly what I brought to it and what I left there was
       my need for answers, the seeker was gone.
       #Post#: 4825--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Will the real Jed McKenna please stand up!
   DIR By: rgardner
       Date: July 10, 2021, 3:07 pm
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Yep, the letter was a good resolution the the Jed McKenna issue.
       What was Nessa's website?  I lost it with a computer change.
       #Post#: 4826--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Will the real Jed McKenna please stand up!
   DIR By: Frits Snips
       Date: July 10, 2021, 4:08 pm
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       I don't think I really care about who, what, where or if Jed
       McKenna is. I never was into the whole guru thing, never
       followed anyone posing as a guru, so to me all McKenna was, were
       the words in the books. So this mail from whoever wrote it, does
       absolutely nothing for me. It's the same with A Course in
       Miracles of which they claim it was Jesus talking to the
       scribe... I don't give and never have given a shite about
       that... it contained the words I needed, so who cares who said
       them or wrote them down?
       #Post#: 4827--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Will the real Jed McKenna please stand up!
   DIR By: biisuto
       Date: July 10, 2021, 5:58 pm
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Love it...just love it! Thanks, Steve. :)
       #Post#: 4829--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Will the real Jed McKenna please stand up!
   DIR By: Plato
       Date: July 11, 2021, 9:14 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Yesterday’s message was not sent by Jed, and this one
       isn’t either.
       Jed asked me to post these messages on his behalf. He is no
       longer here to do it himself.
       As you probably know from Jed’s recent messages, he
       believed he had COVID-19 a couple weeks ago. Then he believed it
       was just a cold. Then whatever it actually was morphed into
       pneumonia.
       Breathing became increasingly difficult. He spent several days
       in a hospital, where his condition seemed to be stabilizing.
       They confirmed that he did not, in fact, have COVID. The
       pneumonia was not related to the medications he took when he
       thought he did have COVID. The cause was unclear.
       After some days, his breathing became more compromised until he
       lost the ability to breathe altogether. Interventions did not
       help. Eventually, he lost the ability, or the will, or both, to
       animate the body he had apparently been occupying.
       Jed was 74 and in great health. He almost never got sick. He
       practiced qi gong every day, yoga frequently, and rode his
       bicycle everywhere. He certainly did not seem to be seeking
       death.
       Jed was not, however, averse to dying. On the contrary, he spoke
       of it often, with great enthusiasm, over the last few years. At
       times he seemed almost eager to try it out, so to speak. In a
       recent piece, he wrote:
       “Death is a beautiful secret hidden by a lie.
       The best place to hide that secret is under the fear and
       illusion that it is painful.
       Such is not the case.”
       He knew that he was not the body, nor the mind or personality
       that accompanied it.
       “It is impossible for ‘You’ to die because
       ‘You’ were never born.
       Granted a body, that we tend to call ‘me, my and
       mine’, has arisen.
       But what appears as ‘your’ body is not you,
       and you can manage quite well without the thought that it is
       ‘you’.”
       That body, as he wished it to be, was transmuted into smoke and
       ash, dispersed into the air of the country he loved, and
       scattered into the Mekong River to feed the fish and merge back
       into the ecology of things.
       For those of you who felt a kinship with Jed from a distance -
       for those of you who took his classes and were in one-on-one
       dialogue with him, perhaps for years - for those of you who he
       helped awaken from the dream, and those of you he helped to take
       a step along the path - for those of you who didn’t care
       about him as an individual, but who were moved or freed or
       supported by his teaching - for all of us who he touched - it is
       sad that he is gone. It may be shocking or disorienting.
       Whatever emotions come to you - deeply, or merely as a ripple on
       the surface - I hope you’ll allow those feelings to come
       over you full strength, and to move through you, and to change
       you, as grief always does. Jed never encouraged anyone to
       “spiritually bypass” their feelings.
       Once you feel whatever there is to feel, however, I hope you can
       return to the bigger truth. What appeared to be Jed cannot die,
       because it was never born. Behind the apparent phenomena and
       ephemera that captivate our attention, is the unchanging
       infinite. Personal history rises to meet timeless awareness. To
       Jed, that background, beyond the drama, was the only thing that
       was real.
       Jed was reluctant to speak about the moment in which he realized
       the Truth. When he did talk about it, however, he described a
       choice point. He said he had the option to leave the dream
       behind, to sublimate into the background in some way he
       didn’t really have words to describe. Or he could choose to
       “come back”, as it were, to continue to play the
       character of Jed, with an ego and a personality and a role to
       play in the human dream. He chose to come back for a while,
       walking with one foot in the infinite, one foot in the dream.
       Of the handful of dead gurus Jed had real respect for, I’d
       place Nisargadatta at the top of the list. Jed’s
       understanding of death was very much in alignment with Nis, so
       here’s what Nis has to say on the matter:
       “To the Self, the world is but a colorful show,
       which it enjoys as long as it lasts and forgets when it is
       over.”
       “The real you is timeless and beyond birth and death.
       The body will survive as long as it is needed.
       It is not important that it should live long.”
       Jed will no longer be here to answer your emails or post on the
       forum or to share day-to-day existence with those of us who
       spent time with him in person. He is leaving a body of work
       behind, however, for those of us still here. You can get to know
       him through that work far more meaningfully than you would have
       through a conversation with his personality. That hasn’t
       changed.
       I haven’t introduced myself, and I won’t really,
       except to say to call me Zara. I’ve been collaborating with
       Jed for the last two years, working with him on a new class that
       is not yet complete. He requested that I tend to his existing
       students in his absence. Tomorrow, I’ll post some
       logistical information for those of you currently in the middle
       of one of his classes, and with some thoughts about future
       classes, and the future of this forum.
       In the meanwhile, we can be sad together that the person we knew
       as Jed is gone.
       And we can remember together that he is not.
       Love,
       Zara
       #Post#: 4831--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Will the real Jed McKenna please stand up!
   DIR By: Plato
       Date: July 11, 2021, 9:45 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Posted by: whois
       « on: Today at 05:40:24 am » Insert Quote
       Hi,
       First of all, it is Nessa. Steve, your site registers me as a
       spammer. It is my third attempt trying to get the registration
       here.
       Secondly, you guys are so well insulated in your little
       self-assured ignorance that asking questions is not part of your
       reality anymore, right? Kenneth McMordie died a week ago in
       Phnom Penh. I spoke to his family too. It is all very sad,
       because he hastened his own demise by consuming quantities of
       non-tested and non-verified drug.. which he hoped will cure his
       covid. What is wrong with Americans/Canadians these days? Common
       sense has left the nation entirely.
       Anyway.. the details on my site if interested. I revived it just
       for this, and people asked too. www.enlightenmentmyth.com
       Cheers.
       P.S. I am heart broken, so that you know. I cared for this guy,
       just did not approve of his conning ways.
       #Post#: 4832--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Will the real Jed McKenna please stand up!
   DIR By: Plato
       Date: July 11, 2021, 9:47 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Nessa! (I've taken the liberty to re-post your earlier post
       since I liked it and I already wrote a response to it.)
       So fantastic to hear your 'holier than thou" voice! We've really
       missed having someone here to stir the sh!te so to speak and
       have all gone back to sleep as you can see by the empty forum.
       :D
       As for Jed's demise I'll just quote one of the stoics when told
       his son was killed in battle, "I knew he was not immortal."
       Unlike you I do not feel sadness at all as I am really not
       connected to people and things like I once was. The further I
       get down this path, the more vaporous even the seemingly "real"
       things appear and there is nothing but thankfulness in the
       knowledge that all of this is no-thing.
       As for spam, there is no moderator here, it works on it's own
       and if it doesn't works chalk it up to God's will....
       Cheers, ;D
       sklato
       #Post#: 4834--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Will the real Jed McKenna please stand up!
   DIR By: Plato
       Date: July 11, 2021, 11:21 am
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       --- Quote from: whois link ---
       >
       > [quote author=Plato link=topic=178.msg4832#msg4832
       date=1626014874]
       >
       >
       > Unlike you I do not feel sadness at all as I am really not
       connected to people and things like I once was. The further I
       get down this path, the more vaporous even the seemingly "real"
       things appear and there is nothing but thankfulness in the
       knowledge that all of this is no-thing.
       >
       --- End Quote ---
       "I am really not connected to people and things".. neither are
       robots. We are moving towards the fine art of not giving a ****.
       What a beautiful world it will become one day, right?
       [/quote]
       Your quote of my quote conveniently left out the most important
       part "like I once was" doesn't mean I'm not connected, doesn't
       mean feelings don't arise, just means that there is a sense of
       joy in the wondrous nature of all that isn't. With that comes
       total acceptance of what is. I haven't interacted with Ked in
       years and never really met him like you did so... Also I'd take
       a closer look at constantly calling people "paranoid" has an
       eery "projectionist" kind of ring to it.
       #Post#: 4836--------------------------------------------------
       Re: Will the real Jed McKenna please stand up!
   DIR By: Plato
       Date: July 11, 2021, 12:27 pm
       ---------------------------------------------------------
       Oh Nessa, how this forum has missed you.  :D
       If I could just express what it's like over here then it would
       be easy right? If Jesus couldn't do it then who can? If
       Nisargadatta et al. couldn't get it across to the sleeping, how
       the hell am I supposed to? I know what I know, feel what I feel,
       sadness hasn't been a part of that equation for 5 years, not
       that it won't, just that it hasn't, that could change but recent
       history is what it is and Jed's supposed demise hasn't altered
       those feelings at all, just given an opportunity to reflect on
       what the man meant to me while in desperate seeker mode, which
       was everything I must say.
       If you hadn't erased all your posts in this forum I believe you
       could have done a search and found the word "paranoid" peppered
       throughout, I could be wrong, maybe some others in here remember
       better than I.
       Anyhow, hope you are well, all shots taken are just for fun
       observations and not real anyway, we did have fun grinding our
       gears in here for quite some time!
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