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#Post#: 24612--------------------------------------------------
Re: Art Plagiarism
By: Chiprocks1 Date: December 19, 2013, 3:17 pm
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[quote author=boyinblack80 link=topic=90.msg24611#msg24611
date=1387487528]
I don't even know who he is
[/quote]
Of course you know who he is. Trayvon Martin ring a bell?
#Post#: 24613--------------------------------------------------
Re: Art Plagiarism
By: boyinblack80 Date: December 19, 2013, 3:23 pm
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never mind...I thought he was a director or something
he shot that kid...was thinking a totally different train of
thought when I was looking at it....didn't even occur to me he
could be outside the Hollywood actor director scene
#Post#: 24614--------------------------------------------------
Re: Art Plagiarism
By: boyinblack80 Date: December 19, 2013, 3:24 pm
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I figured it out.
thanks I see you already posted who he was...but I hadn't seen
it until my post went up
#Post#: 24622--------------------------------------------------
Re: Art Plagiarism
By: Neumatic Date: December 19, 2013, 3:45 pm
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In Zimmerman's case, it's a dude who don't know d-ck about art
or licensing images.
In Shia's case, from what I can tell, it seems to be crassness
mixed in with pure idiocy. I presume he was out of school
before term papers and essays ever really entered the equation
(he was a kid actor, you'll recall), so plagarism and citing
sources isn't something he ever picked up on. You have to
figure with Shia's clout, he could have easily gotten in touch
with Clowes and gotten to use the script. I'm honestly not sure
if that had ever occurred to him.
This is all reminding me of... what was his name, Greg Land?
The dude who traced a bunch of po r no images for his comics? I
remember when Sojourn came out and how I reacted to it, because
nothing takes you out of a work of art like instantly
recognizing its' reference material (this also happens in "The
Ultimates 1" when we see Shannon Elizabeth in space), but
tracing just made everything look flat and non-dynamic.
#Post#: 24624--------------------------------------------------
Re: Art Plagiarism
By: Chiprocks1 Date: December 19, 2013, 3:48 pm
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I know of a few artist that have been ripped by fans for
tracing, but I wasn't aware Greg was in that same class with
regards to tracing p o r n . But then again, I really haven't
followed anything he has done in years.
#Post#: 24625--------------------------------------------------
Re: Art Plagiarism
By: Chiprocks1 Date: December 19, 2013, 3:55 pm
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[center]GREG LAND: TRACING, SWIPING & RECYCLING
HTML http://jimsmashextended.blogspot.com/2008/07/greg-land-tracing-swiping-recycling.html
I had to Google for myself and see what he has been up to.
Pretty extensive thread detailing a lot of swipes and traces.
Man, he makes Roger Cruz seem quaint by comparison.
#Post#: 24627--------------------------------------------------
Re: Art Plagiarism
By: Neumatic Date: December 19, 2013, 4:17 pm
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I noticed that the first time I saw a Greg Land book.. and that
was ten years and change ago. It also introduced me to a
problem that I"ve been having since: almost-recognition of
likenesses. I dig caricatures and so on, but it totally throws
me when I can ALMOST recognize someone but not quite. Like, I'm
pretty sure the main character in Sojourn is Rebecca Romijn but
I can't tell for the life of me who her sidekick is. I hate
that. Ultimates has a little of that going on as well. And
while stylized, I could identify almost everyone in J Scott
Campbell's Wildsiderz except for Michelle Trachtenberg's
character (although the likenesses in that series were part of
the point: the whole thing was a sort-of take-off of big budget
movies, you're SUPPOSED to identify the characters as actors,
it's part of the fun).
Oh, and more on Shia and his other rip-offs
HTML http://filmdrunk.uproxx.com/2013/12/shia-labeouf-legal-action-plagiarism-stole-apologies-from-kanye-west#ixzz2nwzIi3kh.
#Post#: 24628--------------------------------------------------
Re: Art Plagiarism
By: Chiprocks1 Date: December 19, 2013, 4:23 pm
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I've never had a problem with Campbell using specific actors and
actresses for Wildsiderz. It was obvious from the get go who
each character was based on. But because he did a very stylize
version of them in his classic style, he was and is able to get
away with it. I have issues with artist that transfer a
realistic photo into a realist drawing that is nothing more than
a placeholder for the real thing. There is no style coming
across on the page and that's where I lose interest in their
"art".
#Post#: 24629--------------------------------------------------
Re: Art Plagiarism
By: Neumatic Date: December 19, 2013, 4:48 pm
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Totally agreed. I dig when Campbell does likenesses, and those
are definitely a great tool for comic book artists because
without them, a lot of the faces end up looking the same (I know
I'm guilty of that!) . So no issue with that. But the Greg
Land stuff seems so scattershot and inconsistent, famous people
are minor characters for ONE frame. In Wildsiderz, the teacher
actually LOOKS LIKE the character actor who would play a teacher
in that movie!
What I like about that, and what I picked up well before even
hearing about the book, is the idea boiling the likeness down so
that it can be recreated on the fly without a specific reference
image. That's how I was trying to work before, basically turn
the real thing into an "animation" model. This is why my ink
drawings in the last couple of years have gotten thicker and
blacker, I start with the thinnest Micron pen size I can get and
then go over and over with thicker ones until I get something
stark and simple.
And I was thinking the same about locations as well. One of my
big influences was Masakazu Katsura, who did these great mangas
with ridiculously detailed photoreferenced backgrounds, they
looked like big screen movies on the page-- which means that
given the time that he made them, he must have been ripping off
a BUNCH of photos. But damn, the result. It really gives you
that you are there feel. Nowadays with digital cameras, you can
take your own reference all over the place (I still do even
though I don't draw locations much anymore)... and what I like
to do (or try to do) is combine locations together, I have
crummy collages in Photoshop of similar but different locales
smushed up next to each other so I can get a place that's LIKE a
real location, but different and that I can't directly copy.
Basically, trying to design my workflow to make that sort of
thing impossible.
I mean, this is all academic at this point since I couldn't even
tell you the last proper comic book page I drew, but this
impulse is still pretty strong inside me.
#Post#: 24630--------------------------------------------------
Re: Art Plagiarism
By: Chiprocks1 Date: December 19, 2013, 5:00 pm
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I think photo reference is fine by me and would encourage people
to use it as a point of reference to translate the essence of
what they are seeing onto the page. With digital cameras so
cheap these days, it's easy to build up a nice folder of
reference material that you can call your own (granted that you
don't upload them online that is). I know a lot of artist will
do mock ups in Photoshop and Google sketch to map out their
background and building scenes and since they are creating a new
environment themselves it's definitely artistic in my eyes. Now
if someone were to take a very well known photograph of a
building (or whatever you can think of) and drop it into the
background, then there is no artist value for me.
Getting back to using reference material, the reason why I think
it's okay with me is that not everyone can get out in the real
world or has the luxury to "Draw from real life". The next best
solution is to bring "real life" to your PC or Tablet or
whatever and work from that to hone ones craft.
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