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#Post#: 2356--------------------------------------------------
PvP Discussion/Infinest Debate
DIR By: ToyBoat
Date: June 18, 2015, 1:25 am
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I'd like to know some really technical details about pvping in
terraria. I'm not a pvper myself so I am asking those who
feel/are experts in the are and pvped the whole time to share
anything about it.
The goal of this discussion is to help people have a better
understanding and determining if a player is using infinest to
subtly mod their weapons. Where it gives them a slight advantage
but goes un-noticed, and for player's who are honestly not
hacking and get accused of it.
Please keep the discussion on topic and avoid flaming each other
for their opinions. We are a free build server, I would like to
give some attention to the people who like to spend a majority
of their time on the server pvping.
I hope to make the pvp experience in the server better than it
is. That will depend on how this discussion goes.
List of topics I would like to hear about, you may talk about
other things as long as its related to PvP in general:
-Knowing when a player hacking (not the obvious hacking)
-PvP Server; I already have my own ideas for this. Would like to
know what you guys think, ideas.
-PvP Arena; There was a PvP Arena building contest started a
month ago, but due to low participation we dropped the event.
-PvP Sets
Make sure to quote the person you are talking to, to make it
easier to follow along.
Remember to avoid flaming each other. The PvP experience may
improve or stay the same depending on you guys.
#Post#: 2357--------------------------------------------------
Re: PvP Discussion/Infinest Debate
DIR By: BatterySounds
Date: June 18, 2015, 2:28 am
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Well ill start this off and ill start by talking about infinest
and just modded clients as a whole. Imo they should ONLY be used
for building and people using them should never step onto the
pvp arena. It is waaaaay to easy to change one little stat and
turn the tables. That being said i dont have trust for people
who say that they "turn them off in pvp" its impossible to tell
if they're using full bright or tracking etc and as iv said
before its easy to change and mod stats. It has also come to my
attention they people using Shitfinest are able to make use of
all ten of their accessories... combine that with multiples of
the same one and you have people wearing 5 or more of the same
emblem. meaning 75% dmg increase or more... along with other
accessories its just plain unfair. As for checking to see whos
using a modded client i find it easy only because iv been doing
this for a long time now. Things to check for are weapons that
shoot or cluster faster then they should, random teleportation
(not to be confused with lag) ofc modded stats, perma buffs OR
an excessive amount of buffs (like honey buff with rapid healing
and beetle endurance etc....) people moving faster then possible
even with reds wings. Im sure the're are more but these are the
main things. Something to focus on are modded stats and an
excessive amount of buffs. modded stats are usually easy to
catch when you know how the game works and handles dmg. this is
what you need def/2 = reduced damage. using this you can tell if
someone is not telling the truth and if you are really still
having trouble with it just get a friend and test out what you
claim to be hacks. SO someone hitting you with over 400 dmg with
vampire knives through 60 def? just break it down (one thing to
keep in mind is that there are no crits in pvp, only dmg
variations 85%-100%... dont quote me on that because im not
quite sure on the EXACT numbers). btw over 400 dmg with vampire
knives through 60 def... no. If you say other wise you need to
be in a school that hands out gold stars. To wrap this up before
this part gets too long. its easy to catch hackers once you know
how the game works. Ill be sure to say more once people start to
comment.
Terraria wasnt made with pvp in mind. It could be hard to find
servers that are fair in regards to this. Some things you might
want to look for (or keep in mind) when pvping fairly. Certain
weapon bans, accessories that are banned and most of all a good
pvp community that understands that being caught hacking in pvp
will result in a ban. Weapons that shouldnt be used in pvp (or
anytime is the case for a couple of these besides single player)
Coin gun, snowman cannon, staff of the frost hydra. There could
be a few more but the debate on them is really just the person
using it, the arena you're in, etc... Accessories that should
not be used, Master ninja gear, Black belt, reds wings. A good
community should also be considered. Many people are now using
prefixed armor which you are not able to get ingame without out
use of an inv editor or server commands. People maxing out dmg
with prefixed armor and ammo are saying that "Screw being good
at pvp. i just wanna kill things in one hit" which turns pvp
into an arms race. I willl go more into depth with any thing iv
said here upon request.
Last thing ill talk about is a pvp set. Many people think your
skill in pvp is based on your pvp set. This is not 100% true.
Although a good set Is required in some cases there are people
out there who could go toe to toe with the best using nothing
but wooden armor and a beam weapon. With everything iv said in
regards to pvp thus far ill share what i know. A standered pvp
set (so not ground and pound) first you're going to need wings.
fishron or hover board, up to what you like. Next you're not
going to want to be cheesed for having knock back so the Ankh
shield is a good thing to have. Now you need to keep that
movment going so a tabi is needed. this allows you do dash
without the unfair advantages of the black belt and MNG ( master
ninja gear) you can swap this with something else if you're
really good at hooking with the feather fall potion. The last
two things should be up to you. They may be dmg accessories or
def accessories, or both. after pvping for a while youll find
what suits you. Last but not least youll need to learn how to
hook. With this you will move faster then the roadrunner on a
caffiene drip. Hooking is when you grapple on an object like a
rail and right before you make contact you jump and release the
hook to be lunged forward very fast. its hard to get used to but
fun and very effective. like an art form. I will answer any
questions and clear up any mistakes iv made when prompted. i
will also get into weapon switching and armor a bit later.
#Post#: 2358--------------------------------------------------
Re: PvP Discussion/Infinest Debate
DIR By: welp2.0
Date: June 18, 2015, 3:26 am
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This is my experience from both the PC and console version, this
is what I can say about it (feel free to point out missed
details or errors).
For the topic of knowing whether the player is hacking or not,
here is my point of view:
*Advantage over gears:
A player can legitimately gain advantage from another player if
he/she uses a gear/items/accessories and prefixes accordingly
and with good combo. An example is what I call a "slasher" in
which the player uses any gear/buff/weapon and prefixes fixed on
the high attack speed which will attain a maximum attack speed
that you may or may not believe it at first but with a few
tinkering it is possible. This also goes for the
"Tankers","Defensive/Offensive mage", "Recon/Range attackers"
and the "Tank busters" in which each possible gears and prefix
can add to its potential (Example are the Tankers in which with
proper gears and items the players defence can reach up to 150+
with buff thus reducing damage to 70+ish)
* The "/kill" command:
The "/kill" command (for staff) will sometimes not work on PvP
due to either the player having lag issues (depends on the
players location/internet speed) or legitimate hacking that
bypasses the command. BUT there is one item that can actually
prevent the "/kill" command by chance and that is the "Black
belt" or the "Master Ninja Set" In which some servers ban the
item in PvP or the entire server. (Since the Ninja set can
"dodge" incoming damage in which it includes the "/kill"). Also
sometimes when the player enters the "invincible blink" (When
the player blinks momentarily after getting hit which causes any
damage taken to be evaded during that blink period).
Whether the item will be banned on this server or not its up to
the higher ups to make the decision.
* The weapons usability:
Some weapons are banned on the PvP for a reason, Take example of
the SMC(Snow Man Cannon) in which the player can spam the
rockets and any hits from it will deal 100-200 damage whether
its a direct hit or splash damage (Depending on the players
prefix and gear the damage might either scale up or down). These
weapons are banned for a reason and should take into account
what it does on the battle field.
*The Health Regen:
Currently the PvP area right now has a few heart statue lying
around the battle field in which it heals the player about 20 HP
per heart. Remember, players can also use regen potions and the
healing potion itself before or during the battle field. To give
some clues about the potion, the highest HP the healing potion
can restore is 150 HP per drink. Anything beyond that will be
considered "unusual regen" in which it will lead to a possible
suspicion of hacking (In my opinion). Players can see how much
HP their opponent received. One that in which a possible hacking
occurs is if a player hits another player and you see a "+500
HP" above their head that player has either "godmode" on (For
Rank players and staff which is forbidden to be used during PvP
if that player is participating) or hacking.
*Advantage over Skills:
This is debatable for everyone but it is certain that some
players are good at evading attacks and some are good at dishing
the damage and some are just not used to PvP battles. Each
player entering the Arena should know that each player posses a
unique way of attacking/evading/defending from other players,
keep in mind that unless you have battled the player before ,all
skills will shine during the battle field. Always take into
account that you do not know your opponents set-up in which you
need to rely on what do you think that player has equipped.
*Sportsmanship:
This depends on the players during/before or after the PvP. Some
might be noble and nice in which some cases they would even
compliment on your actions and ask what gear you used, what
class do you use and sometimes tips on how to fight players like
him. Some will be the sour patch folks in which they curse you,
say your gear sucks, call you names to make you lose composure
and even falsely blaming you for hacking (which we all have
encountered this at some point). Remember that when a fight ends
you should always think on how to improve, how to change sets
and how to engage your future opponents, always remember this is
a game so its suppose to be fun without the expense of others
joy and experience.
PvP Server
If you guys are ok with maintaining another server for PvP then
im all for it, Having a dedicated server just for PvP will now
give the players huge access of the entire map thus making it
more fun and exciting. This will encourage players to go
different approach on attacking, make a fun mini-game and much
more.
PvP Arena
The current one is good so far, but If possible i would suggest
a voting system for PvP creations rather than a time based one.
This will encourage players to think and build amazing and
cunning arena's. Who know's, some players might actually be
gifted on making a death arena than building houses.
Although that's just my opinion
PvP Sets
Each player has unique sets, and each player will clash with
different classes. I would recommend for all players to practice
all kinds of sets and classes for PvP so that they can switch to
another one if one fails. Maybe make a area nearby the spawn PVP
where players or staff can suggesting gears and sets (using
signs) that can help out expand a players experience.
I'm sorry if this is long to read but this is the shortest way I
can explain of what I had experienced in PvP's and I wish some
of these would help other people about determining whether a
player is cheating in PvP or not.
#Post#: 2361--------------------------------------------------
Re: PvP Discussion/Infinest Debate
DIR By: CommonCloud7
Date: June 18, 2015, 4:19 am
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Personally, I would prefer a SSC Survival Server over a PvP
server. But hey, that's just my opinion.
I have started PvPing a lot lately, and I have a lot of fun
doing so. I'm not exactly a master of the PvP world either.
With the whole 'improve the arena' thing, I started to build an
arena, but it was lost in the map transfer. My ideal arena
provides a lot of room to manoeuvre, heart and star statutes to
heal with, and a way to stop spawn camping. If we were to have a
PvP server, I would suggest
-A ban on Red's Wings
-Ranks depending on how many kills you have done (If that is
even possible)
-Allowing /i after registering, or making the server SSC and
making separate arenas for different levels and continuing the
SEconomy to buy certain items at certain levels.
I have been moderating the kills and PvP arena a lot as I have
been PvPing a lot. My way of handling hackers is
-Freeze them. If they are still moving they might be hacking
-Kill them. If it fails the first time, try it again.
-Ask them politely to turn off the hack, then ask them to hit
you, and hit them too.
If the player hits for a large amount of damage, and they only
take 1 DPS, they are hacking. I can not entirely prove this as a
moderator due to my inability to /read.
I hope this is OK, I wrote it at night on my phone >.<
#Post#: 2366--------------------------------------------------
Re: PvP Discussion/Infinest Debate
DIR By: BatterySounds
Date: June 18, 2015, 11:43 am
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Its good to see more people getting into pvp. In response to
Common though. An arena shouldn't really have anything in it
besides rails and maybe Honey (no traps or spikes). Adding heart
statues is only giving people reason to start abusing the arena.
Running around when low on hp collecting hearts until full again
can very annoying. Item bans should be in place but more then
just reds wings. Like the SMC, coin gun, etc... One thing I can
not stress enough though is MNG/black belt. You ask any pvper
who's decent or been doing this for a while and he or she will
express their hate for it. ""Master Ninja Set" In which some
servers ban the item in PvP or the entire server. (Since the
Ninja set can "dodge" incoming damage in which it includes the
"/kill"). Also sometimes when the player enters the "invincible
blink" (When the player blinks momentarily after getting hit
which causes any damage taken to be evaded during that blink
period)." MNG=one dodged attack and I think 3 seconds of
invincibility. Some people paying attention to those frames will
instantly lunge at you and wipe your face on their new weapons.
Overall though MNG is luck based combat and not skill, it can be
very frustrating when trying to kill someone and every other hit
is a miss or "dodge". It doesn't make that person good... just
lucky.
Giving people ranks based on the number of kills they have
wouldn't be the best idea. I could just stand there with a
friend and rake in the kills. Ranks should be (imo) based on
overall skill and knowledge. How well you understand how pvp
works, your ability to use every weapon you chose effectively,
how many weapons you can use effectively and your movement in
the arena. There is more but these are the ones I got off the
top of my head.
Im going to see if I can post some photos of very good arenas.
Sorry for anything iv missed.
Found a few photos of a dueling arena. These are from a while
ago so this is an older arena. The main thing you see though are
the rails its also not pitch black so you can easily see........
There are obstacles, they aren't jagged or easy to get trapped
on. This arena is played out where the top half has more then
the bottom half. There is room for strategy, carful aiming,
kiting etc...
[attachment deleted by admin]
#Post#: 2371--------------------------------------------------
Re: PvP Discussion/Infinest Debate
DIR By: SassyCassie
Date: June 18, 2015, 2:01 pm
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1: I'd be super happy to make a pvp arena. I would need some
assistance though.
2: I use hacks. But I don't use them for pvping I PROMISE!!!
3: What I don't appreciate is when players constantly use big
rockets ALL THE TIME!!! When pvping of course.
4: I see a lot of hackers. I see them using hacks the WRONG way.
They are meant for building. Not cheating in pvp. I too would
like to stop this NONSESNE! I, a hacker, want to stop cheaters.
I, a hacker never would use infinest for pvp.
5: I use infinest. But I use it rightly. The admins and staff
and I are totally cool with it.
We coo yo.
#Post#: 2372--------------------------------------------------
Re: PvP Discussion/Infinest Debate
DIR By: CommonCloud7
Date: June 18, 2015, 2:09 pm
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Ouch
I don't see what all the fuss is with the Snowman Cannon. It is
a good weapon and if a player has it they should be allowed to
use it.
I see the purpose of banning the Master Ninja gear and the Hand
Warmers as they allow the user to avoid commands, but if these
are not banned, only admins and sa can tell if a player is
hacking.
The Coin Gun should be banned, unless we can just put a ban on
the Platinum Coin projectile...
But hey, I know nothing about PvP
:c
Also, transfer request - my Arena c:
#Post#: 2381--------------------------------------------------
Re: PvP Discussion/Infinest Debate
DIR By: ToyBoat
Date: June 19, 2015, 9:47 am
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babump
#Post#: 2382--------------------------------------------------
Re: PvP Discussion/Infinest Debate
DIR By: [Nisovin]
Date: June 19, 2015, 11:59 am
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The smc (snowman cannon) should be allowed in my opinion because
some people that are really op *cough * Isaac *cough* are way
more stronger. The smc is op just like any other weapon like the
terrablade if you have the right items. So I really don't see
why to ban it when it's ubtianable. Hey why not use invisibility
potion against people with it then you can hide better.
#Post#: 2385--------------------------------------------------
Re: PvP Discussion/Infinest Debate
DIR By: Snow
Date: June 19, 2015, 3:40 pm
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I dont think it should be, im not as good as Isaac (obviously)
but i can usually do quite well, yet someone enters the arena
with a snowman cannon and everything i do is useless because of
the 200+ splash damage.
Personally i think it is a broken weapon and needs a massive
nerf. It is too strong as it stands, i've almost been 1 shotted
by it before.
With the terra blade, it isn't nearly as powerful, it requires
precision with the beams (unless you spam, then luck). And
people find good set ups with everything :P It's like saying
that the razor pine shouldnt be allowed since it has massive
spread with constant 60 damage if set up right, it shouldnt
because it makes magic set ups good, same with terra blade.
The ban made pvp more interesting.
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