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#Post#: 52--------------------------------------------------
IT's ALL IN YOUR ATTITUDE
By: lavaland Date: April 12, 2013, 2:26 am
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Hello all
I'm a new guy, lavaland. Mr. Lynx asked me to put down some
thoughts on off-grid living.
By no stretch of the definition am I an expert, I've just been
around long enough to have stumbled across some good ideas.
I'll try to keep it brief in an attempt to not lose your
interest.
Off-grid living can be a choice, or it could be a necessity or
a lifestyle, it might be survival. But whatever it is for you,
it's a learning experience. Learning new ways, and unless you
have ALOT of money, it's learning a new standard of living. For
me, it's downsizing and simplifying. That doesn't necessarily
mean you're slumming it. For me, downsizing and simplifying has
been liberating, shedding excess baggage and brought a clarity
of vision and outlook.
Even if I can afford one while living on the grid, living
off-grid, I'm not going to have a double door
refrigerator/freezer with an ice maker and cold water dispenser
on the door. But I can have a low consumption, dc
refrigerator/freezer that keeps my food and drinks at their
proper temperatures. The big luxury unit consumes too much
energy when you're producing your own supply. Of course, there
are exceptions. But most aren't so fortunate, most downsize and
simplify.
Since there is no piped water in lavaland, I have to watch
my water use. With a seemingly unlimited supply of piped water,
all of us use(or waste) water unnecessarily - standing waiting
for hot water in the shower, leaving the garden hose or the
kitchen tap running while doing something else. I don't have
that luxury. Downsize and simplify.
I have written in generalities, leaving specifics for future
postings. Maybe a reader or two will get the discussion rolling
with their off-grid experiences. What I have tried to get across
in this posting is the attitude change that both is necessary
for off-grid living and that results from living off-grid.
until next time,
Lavaland
#Post#: 54--------------------------------------------------
Re: IT's ALL IN YOUR ATTITUDE
By: windthot Date: April 14, 2013, 9:54 am
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Hello Lavaland!
Im Windthot aka Jim. I too live off grid. Good post. I am amazed
at how our use of water/power has changed out of need. Our
friends (on grid) are amazed how little water we use. I dont
have but a minute to post right now but wanted to say hello. Ill
post more later. Would love to hear more of your experiences.
Maybe we can teach each other a trick or two.
Ciao,
Jim
PS. What is you anual rain fall? We get 11.5. Water catchments
are critical.
#Post#: 55--------------------------------------------------
Re: IT's ALL IN YOUR ATTITUDE
By: lynx wind Date: April 14, 2013, 10:00 am
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So, off grid living requires an adjustment in our attitude
towards power usage. I agree. But once we adjust we can start
thinking about ways to accomplish what we want through clever
design utilizing nature instead of amps. I think we can design
a home that looks just like a grid hog but has no utility bill
at all. here's how:
- Enough solar PV panels and wind turbine to supply aprox. 200
watts on average 24/7
That's about four 130 watt panels and a 200 watt wind
turbine, eight 12 volt batteries for storage
- A rocket stove/heater for cooking, baking, water heating and
base board heat
- A water catchment at a height that will provide gravity feed
pressure to all plumbing.
- A passive cooling system utilizing ground trenches from
northside, evaporative cooling and filtering, and a natural
draft induced air movement by design
- An LJL lighting circuit for low power consumption
- A couple inverters to supply all 110 outlets
- A converted freezer to supply refrigeration of 12-24 volt DC
- Base board heat
My guess is no one would know this house was off grid.
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#Post#: 56--------------------------------------------------
Re: IT's ALL IN YOUR ATTITUDE
By: lavaland Date: April 15, 2013, 2:35 pm
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hi Jim Windthot,
thanks
i had more to say, but it exceeded the word limit.
I'm sure there is much to be learned from each other and others
in general. especially from others from different areas, as the
first solution tends to be copied and become the norm in one's
area to the exclusion of exploring other solutions.
yes it is amazing how much we can do with less, it just takes
some planning, thinking ahead and being aware of what you're
doing.
looking forward to reading your thoughts,
lavaland
ps, rainfall, we're in the same ballpark as you
#Post#: 57--------------------------------------------------
Re: IT's ALL IN YOUR ATTITUDE
By: lavaland Date: April 15, 2013, 3:25 pm
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Mr Lynx
couldn't agree more, and even before resorting to technology, we
can accomplish much with planning the location and orientation
of your dwelling. making use of cooling wind or shade trees,
warming sunshine, locating and orienting PV panels for most
efficient collecting, finding and enhancing the windiest
location for your wind turbine, and as you mentioned, water
catchment and storage that will work with gravity. and more
looking forward to everyone's ideas, this thread/forum can be a
course in off-grid living, leading to an advanced degree
lavaland
#Post#: 59--------------------------------------------------
Re: IT's ALL IN YOUR ATTITUDE
By: windthot Date: April 28, 2013, 10:46 am
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Hey guys,
I didnt have m notification button toggled and did not know
there was activity...
First off, Lynx I had forgoten you have dont work with rocket
mass heaters. Have you looked into the designs Ernie and Erica
Winer have been doing? Fun stuff. She knows here math and he is
a hands on type. I fully intend to purchase their videos and
plans when time comes for our house. On another note, some time
ago you turned me onto passive cooling. Ive done a considerable
amount of reading and now believe Ill incorporate a green house
attached to the front of the house (South) and use it in summer
to heat air and vent it out the top of its self. That will draw
cool air from tue North. You get the idea. I have aeen others,
bit thos one appeals to me because of our short growing season
here. Its not uncommon to get a killing frost in the early part
of June! Makes things tough without a green house. Our temporary
gren house is working out better than hoped. Concerning your
ideal house. I like the ideas you mentioned. I, lately have been
thinking seriously about running a completely sepperate circuit
in the house to run 12Vdc, maybe 24. This (I think) would have
some advantages in running 12-24v LED's. Prices are coming way
down. Im even thinking i might experiment with making up a few
for fun. M4 has some good information as well as backwoods home.
A three part serries. Any thoughts on this vs. Your micro
systems? Im not educated enough to know for sure which might be
best.
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#Post#: 60--------------------------------------------------
Re: IT's ALL IN YOUR ATTITUDE
By: windthot Date: April 28, 2013, 10:48 am
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This is a continuation of my last post... Lavaland fun to hear
you are simalar in rainfall. This year we captured several
months of water from our chicken coop to water the chickens,
turkeys, rabbits at the source. Nothing special but having water
at the point of need saved "shleping" it to them. On a simalar
note. We get snow and wind. This season I noted where drifts
develope naturally. These areas will sustain different more
water needy plants. I was driving and saw a huge drift and it
hit me why not look for micro drifts on the property. They were
there. I posted at Permies with pictures. Others have suggested
using temp fencing to trap in specific locations. I think that
might work well. Why not let nature pile it up and water for us?
Just a thought. I have not head of others using this method.
Every little bit helps as you well know. Maximixing shortages is
the name of the game. The attached photo is in Tehachapi CA. It
currenty has a green belt where the snow was. All the rest of
the hill is already brown... fun!
#Post#: 61--------------------------------------------------
Re: IT's ALL IN YOUR ATTITUDE
By: windthot Date: April 28, 2013, 10:58 am
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Lavaland, im considering using a "drainback" solar water design
for hydronic heating. Using a heat battery (water tank) in a
basement for storage. Then pumping the water to subfloor for
space/zone heating. We freeze hence the drain back design. Have
you used such a system? Any thoughts? Ill likley go with a high
effeciency 12Vdc pump sys. Save on inverter losses. Just
wondering...
#Post#: 62--------------------------------------------------
Re: IT's ALL IN YOUR ATTITUDE
By: lavaland Date: April 28, 2013, 2:19 pm
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good day windthot
all good ideas, using nature and your physical orientation for
heating/cooling and water collection.
i'm on the big island of hawaii, at about 1200' elevation, at
about 19deg N latitude, sitting in the lee of 12,000' volcano.
sparse rainfall, especially the recent few years.
i don't have any first hand experience with using hot water to
heat the house. but believe it or not, at 1200' @19degN, we do
have occasional need for heat. on still nites, drainage winds
from the 12,000' mt. cause the temp to drop from upper 60s to
lower 50s. and it happens suddenly in the wee hours. if you're
not expecting it and prepared with a blanket, its a rude awaking
at 3am.
i have seen and am incorporating into my own dwelling(being
built in next month or so) a system very similar to your plan.
solar heated water stored in insulated tank that runs thru PEX
tubing running under the floor as radiant heating. the
difference being that here the solar panels and holding tank are
usually on the roof, so the system works on gravity, no need for
a pump. but short bursts of 12v pumps consume very little
battery. some use a timer to open the valve to initiate the
system and others have a temp sensitive valve. you might look
into a pressure tank to propel your system. it only take a
little pump run time to fill and then it pushes the water thru
the system when needed without using additional power, just the
pressure.
#Post#: 64--------------------------------------------------
Re: IT's ALL IN YOUR ATTITUDE
By: lavaland Date: April 28, 2013, 3:29 pm
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windthot
to follow up on your water collecting and conservation. i was
going to start a new thread with some thoughts on water, but i'l
post them here to keep this thread going.
in my area, the more industrious, ambitious collect whatever
rainfall they can, using every bit of roof. for example, here
the main house has close to 1000sq' of roof. its collected into
the main catchment tank that feeds the house - toilet, sinks,
shower. there is a carport with about 350sq' of roof. its
collected into 3 barrels and used for landscape/garden
irrigation. often the storage barrels over flow, but that
overflow is directed toward the garden area thru shallow culvert
dug into the ground. two other smaller roofs also collect into
barrels for landscape irrigation. the less industrious just buy
their water, having water-haul tanker deliveries when needed.
last year, i was stumbling around my lava, pulling invasive,
fire hazzard weed grasses and watched my neighbor take two big
tanker deliveries, probably 8-10,000 gal of water. she has a big
rambling house with MANY sq' of roof area. she could collect
alot with all her sq. footage, but she doesn't bother and just
calls up for delivery when she needs it. well this day i was
pulling weeds, within less than half an hour of the second
tanker driving away after delivering his load, the sky darkened
and a big convection shower moved over the area, delivering
70min of heavy sustained rain, you could almost call it a
downpour. from experience, i'd guess she could have filled or
mostly so, her 10,000gal storage tank.
continued ......
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