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#Post#: 10278--------------------------------------------------
Notes on Holland's Story
By: Kerry Date: February 1, 2015, 3:28 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I suppose you know your meeting is quite close to the FBI
building. One detail may be off a little, not that it really
matters. (I am such a complainer.) The Roosevelt Memorial is
open 24 hours a day if you want to go there; but there are park
rangers there quite late. If it was just getting dark, there'd
be the danger of running into some park rangers. If you have
park personnel as part of the plot, that could be interesting
considering how many people vanish -- simply vanish -- in US
parks. Conspiracy theorists come up with all sorts of theories;
but who really knows? Some show up dead missing shoes or items
of clothing; some show up and can't remember what happened; and
some just disappear.
I think lots of secret meetings happen in Chinese restaurants,
as improbable as that may sound. I don't know how secure they
are though. If you're the agency doing the spying, it wouldn't
be a problem.
I was in one Chinese restaurant one afternoon when there were
only a few people in it -- and this was before the invention of
cameras that can take pictures in low light -- and there were
some flashes of light, very much like a camera flash. It had
to be a camera flash; but it wasn't coming from anyone sitting
at the tables. The only thing I could figure was that a camera
and a flash was in one of the air ducts that were close to the
top of the wall. What I couldn't understand though is why they
use a flash since that would give it away to people they were
being spied on. I'm still not sure what those flashes were. I
never saw them at night.
Another experience was even stranger. I wasn't in the Chinese
restaurant itself but next door. My friend could not find the
particular phonograph needle she needed in several stores. Not
in any of the stores you would go to first. It was an oddball
needle, I guess outdated so much that stores didn't carry it.
We finally wound up at this little store next to a Chinese
restaurant. The scene was incredible when we walked in. There
was no merchadise to be seen anywhere in the store. There were
two rooms, and there was a ladder in the first room under a big
light and a group of about five men around the ladder talking.
As soon as they spotted us, they all stopped talking. Very
strange. One man came up and asked us if he could help us;
and my friend asked if this was a store and told him what she
was looking for. He said it was a store, and let him check to
see if they had that particular needle.
So we went with him to the back room and still no merchandise
visible; but he went over to a wall and pulled a drawer out of
the wall. The wall had several drawers like that. They had
the needle. He found it, she paid for it and we left. My
theory is they were really in that store to spy on people at the
Chinese restaurant. When I checked, it was very convenient too
if someone wanted to take a bus from the CiA building in
Virginia -- right on the same bus line.
Another strange location right outside of DC is the neighborhood
at the end of Mass Ave -- between Mass Ave and MacArthur Blvd.
It's a lovely neighborhood. When they designed it, they cut as
few trees as possible, so the whole neighborhood has tons of
trees. Not much grass but lots of trees. The land rises
sharply there with MacArthur Blvd snaking around below this
neighborhood. CIA headquarters is across the river. I only
was up there maybe two times since it's not a neighborhood you'd
use to get anywhere. So I never checked this out; but I was
told to check it out. My friend told me to check for the
antennas up there, all pointed at Langley.
#Post#: 10279--------------------------------------------------
Re: Notes on Holland's Story
By: HOLLAND Date: February 1, 2015, 7:35 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Kerry, you started this thread before I got to it. I should
comment now on Post #2.
The Star People are psionics, they have the Primus Quartus
abilities of telepathy, telekinesis, teleportation and
paracognition. The human governments of Earth employ mentalists
who are called cowls, who have telepathic and sometimes some
telekinetic abilites. Cowls are called such because for many
centuries men and women have worn garments with hoods, many
times called cowls. Aprators are those humans who have anti-psi
damper abilities, they can shut down psionic activity to various
distances around them. Norms are humans who lack any psionic,
mentalist or aprator ability or who have apratorial ability but
are not consciously aware of their ability.
[quote author=Kerry link=topic=979.msg10278#msg10278
date=1422826092]
I suppose you know your meeting is quite close to the FBI
building. One detail may be off a little, not that it really
matters. (I am such a complainer.) The Roosevelt Memorial is
open 24 hours a day if you want to go there; but there are park
rangers there quite late. If it was just getting dark, there'd
be the danger of running into some park rangers. If you have
park personnel as part of the plot, that could be interesting
considering how many people vanish -- simply vanish -- in US
parks. Conspiracy theorists come up with all sorts of theories;
but who really knows? Some show up dead missing shoes or items
of clothing; some show up and can't remember what happened; and
some just disappear. [/quote]
The clandestine meeting was held outside of the Franklin
Roosevelt Memorial quite deliberately for certain reasons. To
meet in a totally vacant area sometimes does invite interest the
interest of other security agencies if government employees are
involved. That degree of security was not intended and this
meeting was coordinated with the FBI. The meeting was intended
to be brief and so the passing of the attache, quickly done, in
an area where there was poor visibility, would not be observed
by any continous observers who could possibly be parked on Ohio
Drive SW. The Park Rangers would also provide security for the
meeting, in the normal course of their duties, and because of
it, a distraction to any possible observers.
[quote]I think lots of secret meetings happen in Chinese
restaurants, as improbable as that may sound. I don't know how
secure they are though. If you're the agency doing the spying,
it wouldn't be a problem.
I was in one Chinese restaurant one afternoon when there were
only a few people in it -- and this was before the invention of
cameras that can take pictures in low light -- and there were
some flashes of light, very much like a camera flash. It had
to be a camera flash; but it wasn't coming from anyone sitting
at the tables. The only thing I could figure was that a camera
and a flash was in one of the air ducts that were close to the
top of the wall. What I couldn't understand though is why they
use a flash since that would give it away to people they were
being spied on. I'm still not sure what those flashes were. I
never saw them at night.
Another experience was even stranger. I wasn't in the Chinese
restaurant itself but next door. My friend could not find the
particular phonograph needle she needed in several stores. Not
in any of the stores you would go to first. It was an oddball
needle, I guess outdated so much that stores didn't carry it.
We finally wound up at this little store next to a Chinese
restaurant. The scene was incredible when we walked in. There
was no merchadise to be seen anywhere in the store. There were
two rooms, and there was a ladder in the first room under a big
light and a group of about five men around the ladder talking.
As soon as they spotted us, they all stopped talking. Very
strange. One man came up and asked us if he could help us;
and my friend asked if this was a store and told him what she
was looking for. He said it was a store, and let him check to
see if they had that particular needle.
So we went with him to the back room and still no merchandise
visible; but he went over to a wall and pulled a drawer out of
the wall. The wall had several drawers like that. They had
the needle. He found it, she paid for it and we left. My
theory is they were really in that store to spy on people at the
Chinese restaurant. When I checked, it was very convenient too
if someone wanted to take a bus from the CiA building in
Virginia -- right on the same bus line.
Another strange location right outside of DC is the neighborhood
at the end of Mass Ave -- between Mass Ave and MacArthur Blvd.
It's a lovely neighborhood. When they designed it, they cut as
few trees as possible, so the whole neighborhood has tons of
trees. Not much grass but lots of trees. The land rises
sharply there with MacArthur Blvd snaking around below this
neighborhood. CIA headquarters is across the river. I only
was up there maybe two times since it's not a neighborhood you'd
use to get anywhere. So I never checked this out; but I was
told to check it out. My friend told me to check for the
antennas up there, all pointed at Langley. [/quote]
I suppose it is possible in these things, Kerry. One can
speculate as to anti-espionage operations done by the FBI in
respect to foreign agents operating within the United States.
It is always possible that one can see something that could be
useful to the FBI. In which case it should be reported. Some
cases, however odd to an observer might have intelligence
usefulness.
For the purposes of the story, The River of No Return, the
anti-psi agencies workings against the Star People would not
follow along the work of human agencies. They seek to detect
psi activity and respond accordingly. That won't be the subject
of this story. Human governments and the Star People have
reached a number of International accords which have limited
both psionic and anti-psionic activity to a peacetime level.
The story takes place in that context.
#Post#: 10361--------------------------------------------------
Re: Notes on Holland's Story
By: HOLLAND Date: February 20, 2015, 7:03 am
---------------------------------------------------------
There is a moment in the story, The River of No Return, Place of
Bones, where Detective Gant is either observing or thinking at
the place that the young murder victim, Lindy Greene had been
buried:
[quote]There was a stench of decay in the place. The dead
leaves and the fetid smell of the rotted bark or timber seemed
to bring out sadness of the place, the gloom. Gant abruptly
decided to quit this. Too much gloom. He went up the bank and
headed back to his car.
The rain picked up again going from a faint, light sprinkling to
a steadier, harder rain. It seemed to symbolize a kind of
divine sadness or weeping over the death and burial of the
young girl. Was it an omen or sign from God? Gant wondered.
Or was it a delusion, a venturing towards hope in a situation
that wasn’t much open to hope? But, again there is always hope
apart from any sign of it . . .[/quote]
I have attended a number of funerals of people whom others have
said that any accompanying rain had been, somehow, a divine
indication of God's sadness for the death of the person. This
subject about omens and/or signs from God in nature. Is there
any credence for such views in the modern age or could it be
simply considered delusion? What are your thoughts?
#Post#: 10368--------------------------------------------------
Re: Notes on Holland's Story
By: Kerry Date: February 20, 2015, 7:08 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I can't remember a funeral when it rained, but then I haven't
been to many funerals. I've seen it in movies though.
Hard to say though what I'd think if it rained. I probably
wouldn't take it as a sign. We humans are apt to project a lot
so I might. I might interpret it as a blessing. While rain
can be seen as melancholic, it is still a blessing that brings
new life in the future.
Even decay can be seen as a good thing. What would we do if
leaves fell and did not decay? What would we do if the bodies
of animals didn't decay? The soil would be depleted if there
was no way for the elements that sustain life to return to the
soil. Until the whole earth is perfected, death seems
necessary. What is imperfect decays and get new life.
#Post#: 10389--------------------------------------------------
Re: Notes on Holland's Story
By: HOLLAND Date: February 22, 2015, 9:11 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
We certainly, Kerry, do project meaning into things. I
wonder,though, how much might be not based upon a projection of
meaning, or wish-fulfillment, but rather a symbolical
presentation of divine sentiment. Life and death are certainly
intertwined. God, the Creater, in the Book of Job, speaks out
of the Whirlwind, a symbol of destruction. It all seems that
projection and wish, as well as the reality behind it all seems
to point to a totality that encompasses all that we know . . .
Peace be with you!
#Post#: 10537--------------------------------------------------
Re: Notes on Holland's Story
By: HOLLAND Date: March 14, 2015, 9:51 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I thought I would note that at this time in the story, with the
entering of Clive Edgar Fox, I am introducing the first
fictional character that I created back when I was thirteen
years old, in 1965. It has brought up some odd feelings, ghosts
of the past, when LBJ was in the White House and the Vietnam War
was raging. I had read, at the time, my first Nero Wolfe
novels, Gambit and And To Be A Villain, and was inspired by Rex
Stout's fictional creation. This character only existed in
story drafts and outlines.
Clive Edgar Fox is a hybrid creation, a personage inspired by
Rex Stout's character, Nero Wolfe, a witty, a genial uncle in my
family, and my Junior High School guidance counselor. He is
heavyset, though not as fat as Wolfe, a gourmand whereas Wolfe
is a gourmet, leaves his house on business whereas Wolfe rarely
leaves his New York City brownstone; Fox can have an
expectation of violence and will carry a weapon though Wolfe
almost never does. They share similar characteristics, both are
highly educated and speak multiple languages. They have
enormous powers of deduction and observation. They are both
highly principled. I think that many will be struck how much
Ed Fox sounds like Nero Wolfe in speech and mannerism as the
story progresses.
I hesitated to writing a story involving this character given
that he does have the resemblance to Nero Wolfe. They would
necessarily do so because Fox has a classical, humanistic
education from the University of Montana, in Missoula, that
would correspond with Wolfe's undisclosed European educational
attainments. The story should bring out though how Fox is
different. Nero Wolfe, with his European education started as
an idealist, and then, ended in pessimism that led to a
pragmatism in philosophy. Fox also began in philosophical
idealism but instead of going into pessimism, ended up into
existentialism.
Fox, in the story, will give the psychological profile of the
killer. It will serve as a kind of summary of what this
character can do.
I hope that everyone is enjoying the story. It has some rough
edges to it. I will return from time to time to further polish
the prose.
The psychology of evil will become a main issue of this story
before its ending. I will have no answer to many of the issues
raised. I will only be able to present them. I hope that they
will provide much for people to think about . . .
#Post#: 10579--------------------------------------------------
Re: Notes on Holland's Story
By: HOLLAND Date: March 20, 2015, 6:43 am
---------------------------------------------------------
As I've been thinking on the story, I find it troubling that
there could exist a success killer that is always out of the
reach of prosecution and imprisonment, and that the killer can
only be brought down by a weakness found in the killer and
successfully exploited. It is that detachment and intelligence
of a serial murderer may allow for the efficient and
undetectable serial killing but that it can all be brought to
nought by human passions.
It causes an idea to be raised about crime and human nature: to
be a successful serial murderer, must one be passionless,
without emotion of any sort, except for the desire and
satisfaction for power over the victim? Is such a focus and
fixation in human nature possible? I wonder given the strength
of the will of certain persons in history who've seemingly been
inflexible to change of any sort . . .
#Post#: 10582--------------------------------------------------
Re: Notes on Holland's Story
By: Kerry Date: March 20, 2015, 9:42 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=HOLLAND link=topic=979.msg10537#msg10537
date=1426387898]
Clive Edgar Fox is a hybrid creation, a personage inspired by
Rex Stout's character, Nero Wolfe, a witty, a genial uncle in my
family, and my Junior High School guidance counselor. He is
heavyset, though not as fat as Wolfe, a gourmand whereas Wolfe
is a gourmet, leaves his house on business whereas Wolfe rarely
leaves his New York City brownstone; [/quote]Fresh air is
deadly!
[quote]Fox can have an expectation of violence and will carry a
weapon though Wolfe almost never does.[/quote]
I heard one radio episode where Wolfe bluffed someone into
surrendering. The man had a gun and said he would kill him.
Wolfe said he had a revolver pointed at him under his desk and
that Archie his assistant also had a gun. Wolfe also said he was
so fat, a bullet might not do much damage to him. So if the
man fired, he and Archie would both fire at him and kill him.
The man surrendered. Then Wolfe laughed and said he didn't have
a revolver.
[quote] They share similar characteristics, both are highly
educated and speak multiple languages. They have enormous
powers of deduction and observation. They are both highly
principled. I think that many will be struck how much Ed Fox
sounds like Nero Wolfe in speech and mannerism as the story
progresses.
I hesitated to writing a story involving this character given
that he does have the resemblance to Nero Wolfe. They would
necessarily do so because Fox has a classical, humanistic
education from the University of Montana, in Missoula, that
would correspond with Wolfe's undisclosed European educational
attainments. The story should bring out though how Fox is
different. Nero Wolfe, with his European education started as
an idealist, and then, ended in pessimism that led to a
pragmatism in philosophy. Fox also began in philosophical
idealism but instead of going into pessimism, ended up into
existentialism.[/quote]
If it was a longer story, you could have someone teasing Fox
about the similarities and mocking him gently for the ways he's
inferior to Wolfe.
I heard another episode once with foul language. I heard it on
the internet; but it came from an aired broadcast. I believe
it had been on a New City station -- either WABC or WOR. It
must have been before the FCC made rules about language on the
radio. I don't know when the FCC made rules.
#Post#: 10585--------------------------------------------------
Re: Notes on Holland's Story
By: HOLLAND Date: March 21, 2015, 8:51 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Nero Wolfe is a fascinating character. His monstrous pride is
his great fault, though Rex Stout generally makes him look
ridiculous when he is in that mode.
[quote author=Kerry link=topic=979.msg10582#msg10582
date=1426905728]
Fresh air is deadly!
I heard one radio episode where Wolfe bluffed someone into
surrendering. The man had a gun and said he would kill him.
Wolfe said he had a revolver pointed at him under his desk and
that Archie his assistant also had a gun. Wolfe also said he was
so fat, a bullet might not do much damage to him. So if the
man fired, he and Archie would both fire at him and kill him.
The man surrendered. Then Wolfe laughed and said he didn't have
a revolver.
If it was a longer story, you could have someone teasing Fox
about the similarities and mocking him gently for the ways he's
inferior to Wolfe.
I heard another episode once with foul language. I heard it on
the internet; but it came from an aired broadcast. I believe
it had been on a New City station -- either WABC or WOR. It
must have been before the FCC made rules about language on the
radio. I don't know when the FCC made rules.
[/quote]
I wonder how much Rex Stout sanctioned the story telling on the
old-time radio broadcasts. He was very particular, or should I
say protective, about his creations. He even turned down Ian
Fleming's offer to have a joint story of James Bond with Nero
Wolfe. I understand that Stout was heard to say, "Bond would
get all the girls . . ."
I envision Fox and Wolfe and Archie being within the same
fictional world; but I would consider Wolfe and Archie to be
deceased at this time. I don't think that people would make the
comparison between Fox and Wolfe, but the story will make that
clear. Fox is married and when he was younger was a hippie kind
of chap . . .
#Post#: 10588--------------------------------------------------
Re: Notes on Holland's Story
By: Kerry Date: March 22, 2015, 6:58 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=HOLLAND link=topic=979.msg10585#msg10585
date=1426989098]
Nero Wolfe is a fascinating character. His monstrous pride is
his great fault, though Rex Stout generally makes him look
ridiculous when he is in that mode.[/quote]I am at a
disadvantage since haven't read any of the stories. My
impression of him, from the radio series, is that he's very
clever and gifted but also plagued by an inferiority complex
which he hides behind all the bravado.
[quote]I wonder how much Rex Stout sanctioned the story telling
on the old-time radio broadcasts. He was very particular, or
should I say protective, about his creations. He even turned
down Ian Fleming's offer to have a joint story of James Bond
with Nero Wolfe. I understand that Stout was heard to say,
"Bond would get all the girls . . ."[/quote]Would that matter?
Wolfe shows no interest in women in the radio series and scoffs
and teases at Archie's excessive displays of heterosexuality.
Over all, they strike me as a couple in love in denial of the
sexual attraction.
I just found Stout's birthday and did his horoscope. My guess,
looking at it, is that he was either bisexual or a closeted gay
with his Mars being opposed by Saturn and squared by Uranus.
[quote]I envision Fox and Wolfe and Archie being within the same
fictional world; but I would consider Wolfe and Archie to be
deceased at this time. I don't think that people would make the
comparison between Fox and Wolfe, but the story will make that
clear. Fox is married and when he was younger was a hippie kind
of chap . . .[/quote]
There are some similarities between Wolfe and that other
fictional character, Mycroft Holmes. Both are sedentary and
seclusive. A radical difference is that Mycroft worked for the
government while Wolfe seems indifferent to government, even
willing to trick the police if it serves his purpose.
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