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#Post#: 33632--------------------------------------------------
Easter
DIR By: Kerry
Date: April 14, 2023, 8:16 am
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Can we discuss Easter? People say Jesus died on Friday
afternoon and was buried before sunset. They also say he was
resurrected Sunday morning. How can that add up to three days
and three nights?
Matthew 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in
the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and
three nights in the heart of the earth.
By my calculation, from Friday sunset to Sunday sunrise would be
two nights and one day. That can't be right, can it?
#Post#: 33633--------------------------------------------------
Re: Easter
DIR By: meshak
Date: April 14, 2023, 11:49 am
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--- Quote from: Kerry link ---
>
> Can we discuss Easter? People say Jesus died on Friday
afternoon and was buried before sunset. They also say he was
resurrected Sunday morning. How can that add up to three days
and three nights?
>
> Matthew 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in
the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and
three nights in the heart of the earth.
>
> By my calculation, from Friday sunset to Sunday sunrise would
be two nights and one day. That can't be right, can it?
>
--- End Quote ---
My question is how easter bunny and eggs connected with easter?
#Post#: 33640--------------------------------------------------
Re: Easter
DIR By: Kerry
Date: April 14, 2023, 11:07 pm
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--- Quote from: meshak link ---
>
> My question is how easter bunny and eggs connected with
easter?
>
--- End Quote ---
Rabbits have lots of offspring, so a rabbit could be used as a
fertility symbol. The eggs also represent fertility. I see
both as somewhat pagan.
Saying Jesus was resurrected on a Sunday also seems related to
the worship of the sun gods. The time many people celebrate
Jesus' resurrection got altered to sunrise on Sunday the first
day of the week. They hold sunrise ceremonies the way pagans
did even though the Bible tells us he wasn't resurrected at
sunrise. The tomb was empty when Mary Magdalene went on Sunday
morning before the sun rose.
John 20:1 The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early,
when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone
taken away from the sepulchre.
2 Then she runneth, and cometh to Simon Peter, and to the other
disciple, whom Jesus loved, and saith unto them, They have taken
away the Lord out of the sepulchre, and we know not where they
have laid him.
It doesn't give a time for the resurrection; but we know it had
to be before sunrise on Sunday.
Now when was Jesus crucified? What many people do not know is
that the word "sabbath" can refer to Saturdays or to any other
of the holy days which were called "high sabbaths" to
distinguish them from the weekly ones. We know it was
Passover season. and again it's John who tells us which kind of
sabbath it was.
John 19:31 The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation,
that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath
day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate
that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken
away.
In other words, Jesus was crucified the day before Passover --
just as Passover lambs were slaughtered the day before Passover
and cooked on the "day of preparation." That way they wouldn't
need to work on Passover. Most Christians have assumed that
Jesus was crucified on a Friday and the Jews didn't want bodies
on the crosses on Saturday -- and they ignore the part where
John says it was a "high day" meaning one of the annual holy
days. That could fall on any day of the week.
I maintain that Jesus was in the earth 72 hours, three days and
three nights. Here's how it works.
Wednesday day -- the day of preparation for Passover. Jesus was
killed and buried before sunset. Say it was six PM. That would
mean he would have been resurrected right before sun set on
Saturday. Since everyone else was asleep, no one would have
noticed until early Sunday morning.
#Post#: 33650--------------------------------------------------
Re: Easter
DIR By: paralambano
Date: April 16, 2023, 6:38 am
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Kerry - ^
It's just the way ancient Jews counted days.
Rabbi Eleazar ben Azariah:
A day and a night are an Onah ['a portion of time'] and the
portion of an Onah is as the whole of it" (JerusalemTalmud,
Shabbath 9.3 and Bab.Talmud, Pesahim 4a]
If from Friday before sunset, then that counts for the Thursday
day cycle = Day 1
Sunset Friday to Sunset Sairdy = Day 2
Sunset Sairdy to Jesus' resurrection sometime before early
morning Sunday = Day 3
There's also a NT example:
Sir," they said, "we remember that while he was still alive that
deceiver said, `After three days I will rise again.' 64 So give
the order for the tomb to be made secure until the third day.
(Matthew 27:63)
After three days is the same as the third day. Idiomatic
language is all. Things weren't as tight as we think they were
or would like them to be in other cultures. No big deal.
Hey listen, if you wanna believe Wednesday, be my guest but you
don't need my permission for that. And I don't need yours I
suppose for slammin' down a chocolate Easter bunny.
para . . . .
#Post#: 33653--------------------------------------------------
Re: Easter
DIR By: Kerry
Date: April 16, 2023, 7:23 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: paralambano link ---
>
> Kerry - ^
>
> It's just the way ancient Jews counted days.
>
> Rabbi Eleazar ben Azariah:
>
> A day and a night are an Onah ['a portion of time'] and
the portion of an Onah is as the whole of it" (JerusalemTalmud,
Shabbath 9.3 and Bab.Talmud, Pesahim 4a]
>
> If from Friday before sunset, then that counts for the
Thursday day cycle = Day 1
>
> Sunset Friday to Sunset Sairdy = Day 2
>
> Sunset Sairdy to Jesus' resurrection sometime before early
morning Sunday = Day 3
>
> There's also a NT example:
>
> Sir," they said, "we remember that while he was still alive
that deceiver said, `After three days I will rise again.' 64 So
give the order for the tomb to be made secure until the third
day. (Matthew 27:63)
>
> After three days is the same as the third day. Idiomatic
language is all. Things weren't as tight as we think they were
or would like them to be in other cultures. No big deal.
>
> Hey listen, if you wanna believe Wednesday, be my guest but
you don't need my permission for that. And I don't need yours I
suppose for slammin' down a chocolate Easter bunny.
>
>
> para . . . .
>
--- End Quote ---
You write as if everyone did it this way; but what you cite was
about ritual cleanness, and different rabbis had different
opinions.
HTML https://www.sefaria.org/Jerusalem_Talmud_Shabbat.9.3.2?lang=bi
There, we have stated: “One who loses semen on the third day is
pure, the words of Rebbi Eleazar ben Azariah. Rebbi Ismael says,
sometimes they are four terms, sometimes they are five,
sometimes they are six. Rebbi Aqiba says, always they are five.
If part of the first term had elapsed, one completes it by the
sixth term.” Therefore Rebbi Ismael makes the day one term and
the night one term; Rebbi Aqiba makes the day one term and the
night one term. In what do they differ? They differ in complete
terms. Rebbi Ismael treats part of a term like the whole, but
Rebbi Aqiba does not treat part of a term like the whole. It was
stated so about Rebbi Aqiba: “Therefore if part of the first
term had elapsed, one completes it by the sixth term”. It was
stated: Rebbi Eleazar ben Azariah says, day and night each are a
term, and part of a term is like the whole. It was stated so
about Rebbi Eleazar ben Azariah: Sometimes after slightly more
than a day she is pure; sometimes after slightly less than two
days she is impure. How does it happen that after slightly more
than a day she is pure? She had intercourse Friday afternoon
before sundown and lost Saturday night after nightfall; there is
slightly more than a day she is pure. How does it happen that
after slightly less than two days she is impure? She had
intercourse Friday night after sundown and lost Sunday night
before nightfall; there is slightly less than two days she is
impure. Rebbi Joḥanan said, from the words of all of them,
Israel received the Torah as immersed on the same day. That is,
the women; but the men already were purified. What is the
reason? Sanctify them today and tomorrow and let them wash their
garments. Rebbi Joḥanan said, these are the words of Rebbi
Eleazar ben Azariah, and Rebbi Ismael, and Rebbi Aqiba. But the
word of the Sages is, up to three days; after that it decayed.
This parallels what Rebbi Zeˋira said in the name of Rebbi
Joḥanan: This are the instructions for the sufferer from
gonorrhea and from whom semen is ejaculated. Since the
instructions of the sufferer from gonorrhea are based on three
days, also the instructions for semen are up to three days.
I think some Jewish theologians were worse than Christian ones
for complicating things and defying common sense.
Mark 7:13 Making the word of God of none effect through your
tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do
ye.
Three days and three nights does not mean two nights and one
day. I also hope no one is still taking advice from these
rabbis about how gonorrhea goes away after so many days and
nights.
#Post#: 33654--------------------------------------------------
Re: Easter
DIR By: paralambano
Date: April 16, 2023, 7:27 am
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Kerry - ^
I gave what Matthew wrote. Surely, I can listen to him.
para . . . .
#Post#: 33656--------------------------------------------------
Re: Easter
DIR By: Kerry
Date: April 16, 2023, 7:42 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: paralambano link ---
>
> Kerry - ^
>
> I gave what Matthew wrote. Surely, I can listen to him.
>
>
> para . . . .
>
>
--- End Quote ---
Matthew does not say when the three days stop and start, and he
certainly does not say a few minutes on Friday afternoon before
sunset would count as a whole day.
#Post#: 33658--------------------------------------------------
Re: Easter
DIR By: paralambano
Date: April 16, 2023, 7:59 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Kerry - ^
Matthew reports the idiom of the day. After three days was
understood to be the third day. Why? Because it was accepted
idiomatic speech.
Look;
Go, gather together all the Jews who are in Susa, and fast for
me. Do not eat or drink for three days, night or day. I and my
maids will fast as you do. When this is done, I will go to the
king, even though it is against the law. And if I perish, I
perish.' (Esther 4:16)
On the third day Esther put on her royal robes and stood in the
inner court of the palace, in front of the king's hall.
(Esther 5:1)
On the third day = for three days.
para . . . .
#Post#: 33660--------------------------------------------------
Re: Easter
DIR By: Kerry
Date: April 16, 2023, 8:06 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: paralambano link ---
>
> Kerry - ^
>
> Matthew reports the idiom of the day. After three days was
understood to be the third day. Why? Because it was accepted
idiomatic speech.
--- End Quote ---
You are assuming you understand the idiom after being shown
rabbis held different views. After three days could not mean a
few minutes on Friday afternoon before sunset to a few minutes
before sunrise Sunday morning.
--- Quote ---
> Look;
>
> Go, gather together all the Jews who are in Susa, and fast for
me. Do not eat or drink for three days, night or day. I and my
maids will fast as you do. When this is done, I will go to the
king, even though it is against the law. And if I perish, I
perish.' (Esther 4:16)
>
> On the third day Esther put on her royal robes and stood in
the inner court of the palace, in front of the king's hall.
> (Esther 5:1)
>
> On the third day = for three days.
>
>
> para . . . .
>
--- End Quote ---
That does not say they fasted a few minutes for one day and
counted it as a full day.
I assume Esther showed up about 72 hours after the fasting
started.
#Post#: 33662--------------------------------------------------
Re: Easter
DIR By: paralambano
Date: April 16, 2023, 8:29 am
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Kerry - ^
Both show that a portion can be counted as a whole. I don't
think that people are as persnickety as to go back to their
hourglasses to say, gotta check on that time.
We do it as well. I can say I did something for 3 days and on
the third I finished it. Had I really finished all 3 days? Not
really. You likely wouldn't grab a calendar and question me
about it because you understand that when I finished it, that
was my 3 days done.
para . . . .
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