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#Post#: 923--------------------------------------------------
Is light able to be seen
By: Giuliano Date: October 18, 2012, 1:55 pm
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James wrote:
3And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. 4And God
saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from
the darkness. 5And God called the light Day, and the darkness he
called Night.
Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide
the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for
seasons, and for days, and years: 15And let them be for lights
in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth:
God said let the light become, and then he made a division
between light and dark. He then named the different portions.
If they were already divided why the need of lights to mark the
division , was that just for us?
Why lights in heaven to 'give light on the earth'? Was the
light that God made not light that could be seen or that
radiated to light up the earth?
There is more in this than meets the eye, and no I do not have
the answer!
James
#Post#: 924--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is light able to be seen
By: Giuliano Date: October 18, 2012, 1:58 pm
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Amadeus wrote:
[font=comic sans ms]"Yea, the darkness hideth not from thee; but
the night shineth as the day: the darkness and the light are
both alike to thee." Psalm 139:12
They are alike to God, the darkness and the light, but to us?
"Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see
not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand."
Matt 13:13
"But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for
they hear." Matt 13:16[/font]
#Post#: 925--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is light able to be seen
By: Giuliano Date: October 18, 2012, 2:00 pm
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Kerry wrote:
[quote author=Giuliano link=topic=115.msg923#msg923
date=1350586509]
James wrote:
3And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. 4And God
saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from
the darkness. 5And God called the light Day, and the darkness he
called Night.
Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide
the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for
seasons, and for days, and years: 15And let them be for lights
in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth:
God said let the light become, and then he made a division
between light and dark. He then named the different portions.
If they were already divided why the need of lights to mark the
division , was that just for us?
Why lights in heaven to 'give light on the earth'? Was the
light that God made not light that could be seen or that
radiated to light up the earth?
There is more in this than meets the eye, and no I do not have
the answer!
James
[/quote]A very good question. The first verse that comes to
mind is:
Proverbs 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but
the honour of kings is to search out a matter.
It will take me some time to get together other passages; but
even that passage from Proverbs seems to conceal another thing
since I believe the glory of God, the Light of God, is often
concealed. You will remember that Jesus permitted only three
of the disciples to see his glory.
I will also attempt to explain Psalm 139:12 which Amadeus
quoted.
#Post#: 926--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is light able to be seen
By: Giuliano Date: October 18, 2012, 2:03 pm
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Kerry wrote:
People have been talking about light being "created" on Day One.
Genesis doesn't say that however. People have been told that
by men and think it's true; but the word "create" isn't used.
It already existed -- concealed in the darkness. The physical
light already existed, and the Divine Light also already
existed. First about the Divine Light.
How could God create part of Himself? Could we think God created
the Wisdom of God or the Power of God? Why then think God
created the Light of God. We cannot divide God up like that.
The Light of God is part of His Being which indivisbly part of
the Unity of God. Without the Light of God, we couldn't say He
was God. So I assert that the Light of God is eternal, has
always existed and always will.
That being said, we could believe that the Light can be
concealed. We see "as through a glass darkly." Back to
Solomon again:
2 Chronicles 6:1 Then said Solomon, The Lord hath said that he
would dwell in the thick darkness.
...
18 But will God in very deed dwell with men on the earth?
behold, heaven and the heaven of heavens cannot contain thee;
how much less this house which I have built!
Can God dwell among men? Or will God dwell only in darkness?
7:1 Now when Solomon had made an end of praying, the fire came
down from heaven, and consumed the burnt offering and the
sacrifices; and the glory of the Lord filled the house.
If you told me, as Rabbi Maimonides said, that God was in the
Temple, I couldn't believe it because even the heaven of heavens
cannot contain Him; but if you said the glory of God filled the
Temple, I could believe that.
Note that nothing is said to have been created. Rather
something was said to be filled. God dwells in darkness but the
Light of God or the glory of God can be revealed. It is not
"created."
Other instances of how darkness and light interplay:
Psalm 139:12 Yea, the darkness hideth not from thee; but the
night shineth as the day: the darkness and the light are both
alike to thee.
Isaiah 42:16 And I will bring the blind by a way that they knew
not; I will lead them in paths that they have not known: I will
make darkness light before them, and crooked things straight.
These things will I do unto them, and not forsake them.
Isaiah 58:10 And if thou draw out thy soul to the hungry, and
satisfy the afflicted soul; then shall thy light rise in
obscurity, and thy darkness be as the noon day:
Matthew 4:16 The people which sat in darkness saw great light;
and to them which sat in the region and shadow of death light is
sprung up.
Why is this important? All scripture should be profitable for
doctrine. I don't much care about how God did things in
Genesis. What is that to me? That is His business, not mine.
If He did it in six days of 24 hours, how does that help me to
know that? If He did it in six periods of a million years, how
does that help me? For me, the Bible should contain helpful
information, profitable to me now. It is not book of mere
facts. I could read an almanac if I thought having mere facts
could help me. What is the spiritual lesson? Why did Moses
write these things?
I say the spiritual lesson is that within the "dark nature" of
every man, woman and child lies "concealed" the Divine Light. I
think that is part of the everlasting Gospel from Genesis to
Revelation. In one way, everyone is like God and already
possessing the Light of God that "lights" every man who comes
into the world; but those in whom the Light is concealed do not
know and do not see the Light. They do not see the Divine
Light anywhere. If they could see it in anyone -- even the most
humble of God's servants, they would begin to see it in
themselves. If we misread Genesis, we may not see how God
changes people day by day. We can be waiting for God to do
something spectacularly by creating instead of seeing how things
are accomplished by changing what already is.
The "darkness" within us can be made into Light. Those who hear
the Word have the Light appear within them and begin to be
transfigured daily, although that transformation remains
concealed from the idle and unbelieving eyes of mortal men.
Even Jesus did not permit all twelve disciples to see the Divine
Light in him which was about to completely transform him into
Light and only Light.
How this inner light appears in the soul has been experienced by
people of various stripes. The early Quakers (definitely Fox)
knew of it. St. Symeon the famous Orthodox saintexperienced it
and wrote of it. The woman to whom I owe a great debt, St.
Teresa of Avila hinted at it. Gregory of Nyssa wrote of it, I
believe.
I am also thinking of the angel of the LORD appearing in the
thorn-bush. Why would the glory of God appear to Moses in the
lowliest of plants -- in the thorns and thistles? Do not
think that the Crown of Life on Jesus' head was created. It was
"made" by transforming the crown of thorns that men gave him.
He took the thorns and transformed them into Light.
Now for the record, when I speak of a particular type of
darkness, I do not mean physical darkness anymore than I mean
physical light when I say Light. There is a type of darkness,
feminine in nature, which shimmers and seems ready to burst into
Light. I say "feminine" because it that which "brings forth."
Yes, God is both male and female. The "female" side of God is
concealed. In humans, we can it is largely hidden in the soul.
I think that is probably why St. Catherine of [Sienna] said
the soul is "feminine."
One Day One, I would say the Divine Light appeared in the
heavens. Before it could shine on the earth, an intermediary
set of principles had to be put into place -- to "dim things
down" you might say.
At the time of the Flood, the seven lights were replaced by the
rainbow. Men had abused the Light of God by having too much
access to it and misusing it to create mischief. The Light of
God was dimmed down again, and that resulted in shorter
lifetimes too.
It is a matter of how you want to read it, but I think it didn't
go dark physically when Jesus was crucified. I think the sun,
moon and stars went out spiritually -- in order to replaced by a
new source of Light. Thus Jesus is said to have "seven stars" in
his hand. The "Sun of Righteousness" rose. People often read
that as "Son," but Malachi says "Sun." (Even Joseph Smith got
it wrong -- he wrote "son of righteousness," telling me he was
no prophet since he did not understand this. Only someone
reading and writing in English could mistake the two words.)
Those "seven lights" still exist "in the firmament" and Jesus
controls who has access to them. I know my words may sound
fantastic, but so I believe.
The important doctrine is what I would want to emphasize.
Though our souls may be dark, they can be changed into Light.
Changed. It's already there -- yes, like a seed in the ground.
At first it must see the "Light" out there, then it begins to
see it in inner being as the soul is changed and mind
"transformed" or "transfigured." It's the same word in Greek, it
just got translated differently. Metamorphoo -- from which we
get our word metamorphosis.
Matthew 17:2 And was transfigured before them: and his face did
shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.
Romans 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye
transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what
is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
2 Corinthians 3:18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a
glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image
from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.
Scientists are beginning to understand what the mystics have
always known. Science shouldn't frighten us. Some day it will
prove some of the things the prophets said in a way that people
can understand the prophets better. Physical light behaves in
ways that seem impossible to us. I wonder if we should
discuss some strange findings of physics?
[Edited to correct typo.]
#Post#: 927--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is light able to be seen
By: Giuliano Date: October 18, 2012, 2:04 pm
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James wrote:
Good and helpful thoughts Kerry, I have read through once.
I shall read again and see what the Lord distils to me, I
already have some little bubbles forming inside.
Very Blessed
James
#Post#: 928--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is light able to be seen
By: Giuliano Date: October 18, 2012, 2:07 pm
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Helen. wrote:
Ah. Light dawns! What a very interesting enlightening post
Kerry...( and yes I know you don't like anyone saying someone's
post is good..as it means the rest maybe are not. ...well this
is me...so get over it! :wink: I LIKED YOUR POST brother.
Honour to whom honour is due. )
I especially liked. "Note that nothing is said to have been
created. Rather something was said to be filled. God dwells in
darkness but the Light of God or the glory of God can be
revealed. It is not "created."
And...
Now for the record, when I speak of a particular type of
darkness, I do not mean physical darkness anymore than I mean
physical light when I say Light. There is a type of darkness,
feminine in nature, which shimmers and seems ready to burst into
Light. I say "feminine" because it that which "brings forth."
Yes, God is both male and female. The "female" side of God is
concealed. In humans, we can it is largely hidden in the soul.
I so like 'the light not being created', but He said " Light
BE". And it was revealed in our realm!!!
Yes indeed...excellent. One to copy and file away. I am "getting
it" can't say I have absorbed all of it yet...too much for one
mouthful.
#Post#: 929--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is light able to be seen
By: Giuliano Date: October 18, 2012, 2:08 pm
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It is joy that you "see" that. To recognize and to accept what
we really are and how wonderful God is! To see ourselves the
way God made us and wants us to see ourselves also tells us
something about God which makes us love Him more. To realize
that nothing is wrong. Never ever really was seriously wrong,
it only looks that way sometimes. Patsy got a glimpse of
how God sees us. It is a wonderful thing.
Luke 11:34 The light of the body is the eye: therefore when
thine eye is single, thy whole body also is full of light; but
when thine eye is evil, thy body also is full of darkness.
I think it may have something to do with the "lost sheep" too.
How could God not care about the concealed Light within His
children?
Did you ever notice that Jesus said the "second commandment" was
"like unto" the first? Very much like it. How can we say we
love the Light of God in its masculine revealed form but despise
it in its feminine concealed form?
#Post#: 930--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is light able to be seen
By: Giuliano Date: October 18, 2012, 2:15 pm
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Perma wrote:
[quote author=Kerry on September 22, 2012, 05:02:38 pm ]
The "female" side of God is concealed. In humans, we can it is
largely hidden in the soul. I think that is probably why St.
Catherine of [Sienna] said the soul is "feminine." [/quote]
While your whole post is wonderful, Kerry, I wanted to make
mention here that we can see that God is male in that He is
always 'giving' and that we souls are female, whether having a
male or female bodies, because we can only 'receive'. Yes, souls
are female. Often times, in some areas of the bible, it is
helpful to have this understanding.
[quote]Science shouldn't frighten us. Some day it will prove
some of the things the prophets said in a way that people can
understand the prophets better. [/quote]
Yes! It's coming to pass at present, I believe. I soooo look
forward to this coming about. What would it do to the concepts
of belief and faith though?
[quote]Physical light behaves in ways that seem impossible to
us. I wonder if we should discuss some strange findings of
physics? [/quote]
I would love to watch such a conversation. Don't think that I
could contribute much, but I do watch the shows that speak on
these subjects. It's fascinating to me.
#Post#: 931--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is light able to be seen
By: Giuliano Date: October 18, 2012, 2:18 pm
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Perma wrote:[quote author= Helen. on September 22, 2012,
08:21:06 pm]
Ah. Light dawns! What a very interesting enlightening post
Kerry...( and yes I know you don't like anyone saying someone's
post is good..as it means the rest maybe are not. ...well this
is me...so get over it! :wink: I LIKED YOUR POST brother.
Honour to whom honour is due. )
I especially liked. "Note that nothing is said to have been
created. Rather something was said to be filled. God dwells in
darkness but the Light of God or the glory of God can be
revealed. It is not "created."
And...
Now for the record, when I speak of a particular type of
darkness, I do not mean physical darkness anymore than I mean
physical light when I say Light. There is a type of darkness,
feminine in nature, which shimmers and seems ready to burst into
Light. I say "feminine" because it that which "brings forth."
Yes, God is both male and female. The "female" side of God is
concealed. In humans, we can it is largely hidden in the soul.
I so like 'the light not being created', but He said " Light
BE". And it was revealed in our realm!!!
Yes indeed...excellent. One to copy and file away. I am "getting
it" can't say I have absorbed all of it yet...too much for one
mouthful.
[/quote]LOL, but ... I think I am liking the way Helen is seeing
the feminine soul better!
#Post#: 932--------------------------------------------------
Re: Is light able to be seen
By: Giuliano Date: October 18, 2012, 2:23 pm
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Helen. wrote:
Talking of the male/female sides of God. I remember long ago
reading the such likes as...
"There are many different names used for God. One such is
'Shaddai', usually translated the 'Almighty', such as in Psalm
91:1 " He who dwells in the shelter of the Most High will rest
in the shadow of the Almighty /Shaddai.
This word is derived from 'shad', the Hebrew word for breast.
'Shaddai' God the many-breasted One or God the bountiful.
The OT ... 'Shaddai'. Gen 17:1, 28:3, 35:11, 48:3 and 49:25 -
they all use this name for God in association with blessings of
fruitfulness."
[quote]Quote Kerry and Leaf.
Quote
"Physical light behaves in ways that seem impossible to us. I
wonder if we should discuss some strange findings of physics? "
Quote Leaf. I would love to watch such a conversation. Don't
think that I could contribute much, but I do watch the shows
that speak on these subjects. It's fascinating to me.[/quote]
Me too....
And agree, I doubt I could say much in response.
So often " Great post" doesn't often cut it...except just
letting the poster know that they aren't just talking to
themselves!!
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