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#Post#: 11452--------------------------------------------------
Sharia Law
By: Brad Date: December 28, 2015, 3:22 pm
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Does anyone here think living under sharia law would be okay?
Its common in many countries where Islam has a large presence.
Often people migrating in from those countries liked sharia
laws, just not other aspects of the culture. Islam sadly does
not need violent overthrow to take over the world. The followers
of Islam are often poor people who are angry at the
establishment, have large families, and these children are
taught to follow Islam without question. Any group of people
that fell into these catagories gains much power in "this"
world, like catholicism promoting large families, many poor, and
unhappy with their lot in life, and it continued growing until
they stopped promoting large families. And the same holds true
with mormons, and they are still growing with large families
promotion where the children are taught not to question their
elders.
#Post#: 11457--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sharia Law
By: HOLLAND Date: December 30, 2015, 8:09 pm
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I would not want to live under Sharia Law, Brad. I would prefer
a secular state ruled by statutory laws given by a court system
within the context of a democratic society. I would always want
a voice in the laws that I would have to live under.
#Post#: 11458--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sharia Law
By: Brad Date: December 30, 2015, 11:36 pm
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I know that some orthodox christians down throughout history has
gotten along with muslims, despite Islam being the dominant
religion of the area. I think we "could" live with sharia law,
but I certainly wouldnt want to have the lack of freedom that it
would bring. We would probably have to be less open about our
faith or run the risk of being killed and perhaps even our
families killed. Just like slaves could still be christians,
but to seek to be free if possible, but to be content regardless
of our lot in life. The same was seen for the jews in the time
in babylon.
#Post#: 11459--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sharia Law
By: Kerry Date: December 31, 2015, 9:53 pm
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[quote author=Brad link=topic=1040.msg11458#msg11458
date=1451540215]
I know that some orthodox christians down throughout history has
gotten along with muslims, despite Islam being the dominant
religion of the area. I think we "could" live with sharia law,
but I certainly wouldnt want to have the lack of freedom that it
would bring. We would probably have to be less open about our
faith or run the risk of being killed and perhaps even our
families killed. Just like slaves could still be christians,
but to seek to be free if possible, but to be content regardless
of our lot in life. The same was seen for the jews in the time
in babylon.
[/quote]Remember when the Pope visited the Patriarch of
Constantinople in Turkey? There are still problems there about
church property. The famous Hagia Sophia was built as an
"patriarchal" church, got confiscated and turned into an
imperial mosque; and today it's a museum.
It is interesting too how the Patriarchs of Constantinople got
the title "Ecumenical Patriarch" -- claiming authority over
other Christians. The Sultan wanted to think of himself as the
previous Caesars -- like Constantine who presided over the
Council of Nicea and influenced things by using the church.
I also believe the Sultan hand-picked the person who would be
the next Patriarch. Isn't that odd? It's odd enough when
Christian Emperors did it; but it seems odder still when a
Muslim Sultan could do it.
All told though, the fall of the Ottoman Empire and subsequent
carving of it into other countries under Christian European
nations may have been one of recent history's greatest mistakes.
There were huge swaths of areas where almost everyone was
Christian. The Sultans didn't care what religion you were as
long as you weren't plotting rebellion. So they tolerated
other religions -- as the Quran says they should. Indeed, when
the Spanish kings were using the Catholic Church in Spain to
expell all Jews and Muslims there, many Jews went to Turkey.
Jews also helped defeat Christian forces in the Mideast once.
They did that because the Christian government did not give them
religious freedom. For years they weren't allowed on the Temple
Mount. So when Muslims invaded, the Jews were on their side.
They celebrated the fall of the Christians by cleaning up the
Temple Mount.
Spain too brings up how Muslim leaders there tolerated other
religions. When the Catholic Ferdinand drove the Muslims out,
all that changed. He was afraid Muslims and Jews would rebel
against him so he ordered them all either convert or leave.
Some were rich. Some had intermarried into noble families.
Some pretended to convert just so they could stay. Others may
have converted for real; but in that climate, who can tell which
is which? So an ugly type of racism entered Spanish society.
Anyone with Arabic or Jewish roots was suspected of being a
secret heretic. Even St. Teresa of Avila was watched
carefully since she had some Jewish blood. This fostered the
rise of the infamous Inquisition. It turned Spain upside down.
#Post#: 11460--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sharia Law
By: Kerry Date: December 31, 2015, 9:57 pm
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I found this in the news. It shows how some "sharia law" gets
invented on the spot by leaders who are sometimes the worst
people. From Reuters
HTML http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-islamic-state-sexslaves-exclusive-idUSKBN0UC0AO20151230:
Islamic State theologians have issued an extremely detailed
ruling on when "owners" of women enslaved by the extremist group
can have sex with them, in an apparent bid to curb what they
called violations in the treatment of captured females.
The ruling or fatwa has the force of law and appears to go
beyond the Islamic State's previous known utterances on slavery,
a leading Islamic State scholar said. It sheds new light on how
the group is trying to reinterpret centuries-old teachings to
justify the rape of women in the swaths of Syria and Iraq it
controls.
Other Muslims are outraged.
Professor Abdel Fattah Alawari, dean of Islamic Theology at
Al-Azhar University, a 1,000-year-old Egyptian center for
Islamic learning, said Islamic State "has nothing to do with
Islam" and was deliberately misreading centuries-old verses and
sayings that were originally designed to end, rather than
encourage, slavery.
"Islam preaches freedom to slaves, not slavery. Slavery was the
status quo when Islam came around," he said. "Judaism,
Christianity, Greek, Roman, and Persian civilizations all
practiced it and took the females of their enemies as sex
slaves. So Islam found this abhorrent practice and worked to
gradually remove it.”
In September 2014 more than 120 Islamic scholars from around the
world issued an open letter to IS leader Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi
refuting the group's religious arguments to justify many of its
actions. The scholars noted that the "reintroduction of slavery
is forbidden in Islam."
#Post#: 11461--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sharia Law
By: Kerry Date: January 1, 2016, 8:51 pm
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The Sultan of Brunei is continuing the phasing in of what he
calls sharia law in Brunei. The Western media, when they
covered it, tended to focus on the more dramatic aspects --
things that would outrage Westerners. But Al-Jazeera had a
slightly different take -- and one I thought was more
thoughtful.
HTML http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2014/05/brunei-sharia-law-at-what-cost-2014528134130788926.html
Although officials insist that Brunei's economic decline is only
short-term in nature, the population has felt its effect.
Concern for increased crime has prompted some to welcome the
implementation of the Sharia penal code. Of course, neither the
economic decline nor the crimes punishable by the newly
introduced penal code have an effect on the royals, who live an
extremely lavish lifestyle that includes the keeping of
mistresses.
Does the Sultan really believe cutting the hands off thieves is
going to solve the crime in his country? Perhaps he does; but
I doubt it. If the crime is increasing because of economic
problems, wouldn't it be better to address the economy?
In giving an overall evaluation of what the Sharia is about, the
14th century scholar Ibn Qayyim al-Jawziyya stated that: "The
essence and basis of Sharia is wisdom and benefits for people in
this world and the next. It is all justice, all mercy, all
benefits, and all wisdom. Every application that goes from
justice to oppression, from mercy to its opposite, from benefit
to harm, and from wisdom to frivolity then it is not from Sharia
- even if [someone] tries to interpret it as such."
If we consider the motives of the sultan for introducing Sharia
in Brunei, in light of what Ibn Qayyim says what Sharia is
about, we can safely conclude that the sultan is joining the
ranks of governments in the Muslim world who manipulate Islam to
suit their own political purposes.
I'd say so too. He's using religion as a way of trying to keep
control over his people. The clamping down on the celebration
of Christmas there, based on the excuse it might encourage
terrorism seems to tell me he's afraid of terrorists. His
people aren't happy and may want to topple his government and
join terrorist organizations who also would use religion as
their battle cry.
Any further talk of religion is superfluous at this point.
Focusing the discussion on Brunei's move to adopt Sharia penal
code, which more importantly relies on mischaracterisations of
Sharia, is dishonest framing. It encourages knee-jerk
reactionary protests that pick and choose their causes for
alarm. Both the sultan and US media are exploiting Sharia for
their own purposes. Meanwhile, the people of Brunei who are in
the middle and ignored, will face the real possibility of the
oncoming oppression.
Oncoming oppression seems likely to me. The Sultan himself is
hardly a figure of Muslim virtue. How can he say he's a good
Muslim when he behaves as he does? Anyone who wants to seize
power there can attack his character easily enough. He can
make all the rules he likes; but if he is breaking the basic
rules of decency himself, people will see him as a hypocrite.
HTML http://www.news.com.au/entertainment/tv/sex-lies-and-sharia-law-the-secret-life-of-the-sultan-of-brunei/news-story/6eac970ff7aa06716f95356a5470d3f4
#Post#: 11462--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sharia Law
By: Kerry Date: January 1, 2016, 9:21 pm
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I found an article about Christmas in Brunei. From
HTML http://www.ibtimes.com/brunei-officially-bans-future-christmas-celebrations-1777526
The nation of Brunei in Southeast Asia has officially banned all
future public celebrations of Christmas, in accordance with its
conservative Islamic law Shariah. The country’s Ministry of
Religious Affairs said on Thursday that the ban was instituted
for fear of Muslims being led "astray" by Christmas festivities.
Last month, when local children and adults were seen wearing
Santa outfits, officials reacted by asking businesses to take
down Christmas decorations, but now the ministry has taken it to
the level of an official ban on all such public festivities.
A spokesman referred to a Dec. 27 religious ministry statement
published in the Brunei Times that said that public Christmas
celebrations constituted “propagations of religions other than
Islam,” which is not permitted in a state governed by Shariah.
“Believers of other religions that live under the rule of an
Islamic country – according to Islam – may practice their
religion or celebrate their religious festivities among their
community, with the condition that the celebrations are not
disclosed or displayed publicly to Muslims,” said the statement.
The statement said that propagating non-Muslim religious symbols
violates the country’s Section 207(1) of the penal code, which
is punishable by a fine of up to BND$20,000 ($15,000), a
five-year imprisonment, or both.
This is just foolishness. Many Muslims celebrate Christmas and
remain Muslims. This is a made-up rule or law that's being
called shariah law.
#Post#: 11463--------------------------------------------------
Re: Sharia Law
By: Brad Date: January 2, 2016, 12:04 am
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Perhaps there is some who while supporting Islam are subtly
controlled by some evil spirit, who uses its subject to bring
about a twisted Islamic faith. But those in charge and those
who institute change in any faith always begin small, but Sharia
has grown and it doesnt seem to be very benevolent as it
progresses in its controlling influence.
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