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#Post#: 440--------------------------------------------------
Mike Guice
By: Jack Date: September 26, 2017, 4:41 pm
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I first met Mike about 10 years ago. I first mentioned him in
The Role Playing Guys, where I said:
[quote]Mike Guice* - Mike is the only one of the RPGroup that
I’ve not spanked, and I won’t ever spank him. When I first met
him, he had a great dad; but it turned out that his dad had a
major mental illness and Mike was probably being abused by
today’s standards. I’d say his dad was whipping him about like
some kids got when I was a boy - which really was pretty harsh.
Mike just turned 15 last month. He’s a pretty good-looking boy,
but he has some trouble with zits. He’s big for his age, but has
dark brown hair and eyes. He’s really smart, too and takes all
the advanced classes in school. Besides role-playing games, Mike
is really good at chess, Pente, and other strategy games.
Mike’s Dad got some probation and a stay in a mental hospital.
Mike’s parents are still married, but are separated and he lives
with his mom. While his dad was in the hospital, Mike and I
spent a lot of time together, and, if anything happens to his
mom, I get custody of him.
Mike has a little sister, but she wasn’t treated as
harshly.[/quote]
One corrections: it wasn't a little sister, but a cousin who
lived with them for a while.
I didn't talk about this when it happened, for a lot of reasons.
As a matter of fact, I thought about leaving it here. Nothing
was ever proven, but Mike's Mom and I both strongly suspect that
his dad committed suicide. The thing is, it was a car wreck in
really bad weather, so there's just no way to know.
I actually really liked Mike's Dad. Mike got into comics, that
time he came into my store. His dad had been into comics when
he was younger. When he saw Mike reading them, he looked at
some, and the two of them started coming into the store
together. I considered them both my friends.
Another clarification is that Mike wasn't being beaten on a
regular basis. As far as I've ever heard, his dad had something
they call a dual diagnosis, which means he was both an addict
(alcoholic) and he had serious depression issues. I think he'd
been doing really good when I met them, but there was a lapse at
some point. That final whipping was one where I would have
blistered Mike myself (looking back, I want to say that he
hadn't done chores but had lied about it). The problem was that
his dad was feeling really guilty and stressed out, and I think
the separation was as much his doing as Mike's mom.
[hr]
I'm really kind of down now, so let's skip ahead.
Mike graduated high school towards the top of the class. While
he was at college, she moved to a smaller/cheaper apartment. It
wasn't bad over Christmas or Spring Break, but he really didn't
like it over the summer (by 'smaller', I mean one bedroom, and
he had to sleep on the couch, even if it was a fold out, there
wasn't much privacy).
That fall, I called him to talk about some gaming. He informed
me he wasn't coming home. His mom had a boyfriend and they'd
moved in together. Mike didn't care for the boyfriend much, and
he just didn't want to subject himself to the situation. I
offered to let hm stay with us, but he turned me down. I
explained to him that he was going to come home for
Thanksgiving, he was going to do roleplaying, an he was going to
stay with us. The same for Christmas, Spring Break, Summer, and
any other occasion I was missing. I further explained that, if
he wasn't hear on time, I'd drive down there to get him, and
he'd have to ride home with a sore butt.
He's been with us every since.
We worked out a few final problems over the last year or two. I
never tried to act like Mike's dad, because I know how much he
loved his dad. He never asked me to be his dad, because he
didn't want to be intrusive.
I posted this almost exactly two years ago (4 Oct '15)
[quote]"I almost opened a new thread for this, but I think it
works best here, not least because it allows you to read back
about Mike and my relationship with him. Before I get to the
originally intended post, allow me to sum up a few important
items.
1) Mike (and his buddies) were friends of mine before they were
friends with my kids.
2) Mike had some real hard breaks, and some trouble with his
dad, but he never quit loving his dad, and the two of them had a
strong, loving relationship that wasn't destroyed by his dad's
problems. That's why I don't have a father/son relationship with
Mike.
3) I have never spanked Mike, and never seriously thought about
it - though it would have been fun (and deserved a time or two).
4) Father/son or not, Mike is one of my closest friends, and
he's definitely part of our family.
Oh, and 5) I am paying a lot of Mike's college expenses. Which
brings us to...
It's been a very hard day, and I've been up since about 5am.
Mike got arrested last night. Now, I honestly think it's kind of
stupid, but I can also kind of understand it. He was arrested
for public intoxication.
Mike was at a party last night. He drove. He was supposed to be
the designated driver, but something happened, and he decided to
have a few drinks.
NOW, before he did that, he found someone he knows and who lives
in the same dorm to drive them back. Okay so far.
I think the real problem is that Mike knows how much he can
drink. He never has more than one beer if he's going to be
driving. When he's not going to be driving, he'll have a beer
and two boilermakers. Last night, they were at a Mexican-themed
party, and he was drinking cerveza and shooting tequila. I think
it wasn't equivalent. He got to feeling sick, so he went out to
lay down in the car, until everyone else got ready to go.
The next thing he really knows, a cop was waking him up, and the
other three guys in the car were under arrest - 2 for public
intoxication, 1 for DUI.
From what I was able to learn, the other three guys were
probably arrested because none of them were capable of driving,
and it was already after 2am, and they weren't especially close
to campus.
It turns out that PI is only a Class C misdemeanor. I didn't
have to bond him out. He had to go before a judge, he pled
innocent, then he was released on his own recognizance.
What we've had to do so far was get him transported to pick up
his car, get that released, and now he's going to have to see a
lawyer.
Mike and I weren't able to talk much, and now he doesn't want to
talk. He was scheduled to come home next weekend, and now he
doesn't want to. I might it very clear that this weekend doesn't
change next weekend.
Let me make it very clear - I not only don't think I'd ever
spank Mike, especially not now that he's an adult. More than
that, while I think he made a couple of bad decisions, I don't
think he did anything especially wrong, and certainly not
illegal.
I guess now we'll have to see how it goes."[/quote]
A couple of days after that:
[quote]"I meant to post an update on this yesterday, but I got
distracted. I posted several other updates, trying to remember
the one I'd meant to do, but I didn't remember this one until
just as I was leaving chat to prepare dinner.
Anyway, after our discussions Sunday, I didn't hear from Mike
all day Monday, despite messages and texts.
He finally contacted me Tuesday night.
At risk of repeating myself, Mike is out of class next Monday
and Tuesday for a 'mid-term break'. That's why he was planning
to come home this weekend. His teachers are also aware of that
break, so he has a fairly busy week. Besides studying for
several tests, he had a project due. Last week, the professor
announced that, if the students had their projects turned in and
'approved' by Wednesday (yesterday), they didn't have to come to
class Friday (participation and attendance does have an effect
in this class). Since that's his last class of the day, and
missing it would allow Mike a good shot at missing Dallas
traffic, he jumped at it, but it meant spending a lot of time in
the library (apparently the wifi connection is more reliable
there, than in the dorm), so he could finish polishing it.
He claims that, because of the time he missed Sunday, and
including the time he had to spend studying for the tests, he
didn't even see my messages until late Monday, so he waited
until he had time Tuesday to call me, so as not to risk waking
me.
He did sound pretty uncomfortable when we talked, so I'm not
sure that's the only thing, but it does sound like he will be
coming home still.
Funniest thing - one test is Thursday, and he has two on Friday.
He says he's worried about one Friday, but the other will be a
blow off. One of them is an elective - Science Fiction
literature. I can't remember the name of the other class, but
it's literally rocket science (the test is over orbital
mechanics). The thing is, the one he thinks will be hard is
sci-fi, because he has to 'memorize names and dates and be able
to define terms,and (he) even has to write a couple of short
essays. The other one's just basic physics, so it's no
sweat.'"[/quote]
10 Oct 15
[quote]"Mike did come home yesterday.
He arrived while I was at the grill. Hooked up with some of his
friends and departed while I was still at the grill.
He was at the game, met up with a few more friends, and they
went out afterwards.
This morning, I popped the hood of his car and stole the
distributor. Okay, not really, but I did leave him a note that
he and I really needed to talk, and I'd appreciate it if he
waited for me to get home before he took off (early soccer game
for me - Mike was sleeping in).
We finally did have a chance to talk.
""Jack, I'm sorry. I know I screwed up. I understand if you
gotta whup me, but please don't chew me out.""
""I have no intention of whupping you, Mike. I really don't
even think you screwed up, not badly. I just want to see how
you plan on handling something like this in the future, talk
about the court case, and make sure we're both getting the same
lessons from it.""
""You're not? You don't? I mean....""
Momentary pause, because he'd obviously worked himself up to
make this a huge drama (though I'd already told him I didn't
think it was), and I think his brain had to reboot.
Yes, he now understands that last minute plan changes are
usually not a good idea, and that the designated driver has to
be one hundred percent trustworthy.
We set up an Uber account for him in his college area. It would
have been much cheaper to just pay someone to drive him home,
than to get him and his car out of jail. It will be billed to
an emergency credit card, and he understands that he will have
to pay me back for anything that's non-emergency (i.e.- ride to
the urgent care clinic - okay, ride home because you're drunk -
payback).
Richard (old friend and general lawyer) made a couple of phone
calls to me. This should all be cleared up before Thanksgiving,
and we retained the lawyer with whom Richard spoke. Considering
the circumstances, it will probably just be dismissed.
I also made it clear to Mike that I know he and his dad had a
special relationship, and that he still loves his dad very much.
However, that doesn't stop Mike from being a very good friend
of mine and part of our family. Not coming home because you're
going to the beach is perfectly acceptable. Not coming home
because you're embarrassed about something isn't. We love him,
and we want him here, and he just has to accept that.
He promised he'd try, but then he had to go wash his face,
because he got some dust or something in his eyes."[/quote]
23 Oct 2015
[quote]"Final update:
Yesterday was Mike's court first date. The officer didn't show
up, so the case was dismissed.
Let me say a couple of things here. Mike and the boys he was
with were unquestionably drunk. The only one who was really
doing something wrong was the driver. Mike thought he was
drinking within his limits, and he just wasn't ready for the
worm to bite back. The officer had a carful of drunk college
students, none of them able to drive, the car not in a good
spot, and Mike probably wasn't in shape to get himself home,
even without car keys. The officer made a decision to take them
in. I don't know why he made that decision, but I can see him
thinking it was the best way to protect them and everyone else.
Unfortunately, that also meant having the car towed.
In this case, I'm not really blaming anyone (except the idiot
who was supposed to be the designated driver). Mike knows he
screwed up, and he'll never make that mistake (with the DD)
again.
That leaves us with an embarrassed and uncomfortable young man.
Mike wants to pay me back. I'm not sure why he feels the need
here, when I'm already helping him with his college expenses.
Where I feel that he's learned a lesson, and it's best if we
just move on, maybe he still feels like he screwed up and needs
to... not to be punished, but to make amends in some way.
The thing is, even though I'll be rebated the bond money (I put
up a cash bond, instead of going through a company), it still
ran to several hundred dollars, and that's well over a week's
work, even full-time. He normally does some work for me at
Thanksgiving (helping do the Christmas decorations in the
store), and the week before Christmas (when we always seem
short-handed for the mail orders). I want him to have that money
for Christmas. He wants to pay me back ASAP. He has nearly a
month for Christmas (he hasn't seen his exam schedule yet, but
he should be home either 16 or 17 December, and he doesn't have
to be back at school until 12 January, so probably leave 9 or
10), so I want him to take care of Christmas, get a bit of rest,
then worry about paying me back.
When we were talking last night, we couldn't reach an agreement,
and I didn't want to turn it into a fight (I don't think he did
either, but I think I have a lot more experience than him
telling when things are getting out of control), so we just
tabled it for the moment.
Remember, I have never spanked Mike. His dad spanked him (and
only spanked him, as far as I've ever heard or suspected) when
he was younger, but when that lapse occurred (I want to say Mike
was 13 when it happened), his dad did beat him. I would have
enjoyed spanking him when he was 12 or 13, but not after that
happened. Since his dad passed, I have tried to be here for him,
while trying not to even faintly suggest I might replace his
dad.
I bring them up, because I'm now wondering if I should offer
Mike the same deal I'd probably offer any of my other college
age kids in this situation - he can work to pay me back after
Christmas, only the exact amount he owes, and, in the meantime,
I'll take the interest out of his hide.
I don't want to push that, but I wonder if I should at least
suggest it as an option."[/quote]
10 Nov 2015
[quote]"Mike and I had another long talk last night. He'd talked
to his mother and found out that she's going to her fiancee's
parents' home for Thanksgiving. Mike told me he was thinking of
just staying at school.
I told him that was completely unacceptable.
We ended up hanging up long enough for him to get some privacy,
so we could Skype.
I told him that he was coming home for Thanksgiving, period. No
excuses accepted. If he dies before then, I expect him to haunt
us for the holiday.
He will be working with the decorating crew that night, like he
always does, and he will be keeping the money. He also has to
present me with an acceptable list of people for whom he wants
to give Christmas gifts. He's also going to be included in the
Cousins drawing for Christmas this year.
After he's finished his Christmas list, he can work on paying me
back. If he has to wait until next summer, he can do so. I have
tracked the amount of money he owes me, we both agree on the
figure, and he's not going to pay me a penny less, but not a
penny more either.
""What about interest?""
""If you feel the need to pay interest, I'll take it out of your
hide, just like I would any of the other boys. Just let me know
if that's what we need to do.""
He didn't say anything to that. I'm not sure if he was in shock,
or if he's just undecided.
Either way, the important thing (to my point of view) is that it
was made clear that he is part of this family now, and I'm not
going to keep pussyfooting around with him. I have never tried
to be Mike's dad, because I know his situation, I know he loves
his dad, and I really liked his dad. However, call it what you
will, Mike and I do have a strong relationship, and I care for
him, and I know he loves us, and I think we just needed to
really admit that."[/quote]
26 Nov 2015
[quote]"I think Mike and I have settled things.
Last night, he and I talked about him paying me back and paying
'interest'.
I gave him one swat, with the medium Lexan, on his boxers. Then
I suggested that one swat, bare, for each $25 dollars was
probably fair, if he was going to insist.
However, before I let him make his decision, I told him (again),
that I did not blame him for this. This is a case where he made
a bad decision (changing plans at the last minute), and a less
than optimum choice (asking someone whom he didn't know well to
be the designated driver), but that they weren't wrong
decisions, and that he's learned from them.
We ended up going over some of the things we've discussed
before. We talked for a long time, and I think I finally see
where I had been making a mistake. I tried hard to keep from
seeming like I wanted to replace Mike's dad after he died. I
know that there is a difference between trying to replace
someone, and just trying to fill in for them when they're not
there, but that's kind of a... subtle (?) difference. In trying
to reassure Mike that I didn't want to replace his dad, I think
I gave him the wrong idea. Mike's dad was a friend of mine, and
Mike has been my friend for a long time. I tried to be there for
Mike whenever I could. Something about what I was saying was
sounding wrong to Mike. He finally admitted last night that he
was pretty confused about our relation, and he pointed out that,
a guy can have a dad he loves, and still have a step-dad (or
even two dads).
We were both crying by the time the discussion finished, but at
least it wasn't because of the paddle this time - not for either
of us."[/quote]
Let's all pause and thank Leti for her work in preserving
everything that was presented in the previous quotes.
Unfortunately, there is some information missing from the last
several months, and not all of it was recoverable. So, I'm
going to sum up what I remember of that.
Really, that just boils down to, Mike graduated with a bachelors
in science last spring, and he's now at the same university with
Barry and Noah, the twins, Blake, and Bryce, where he's working
on a Masters in Physics. This year, he's doing some student
teaching, but he's really hoping to get into some actual
research next year. I talk to him on a regular basis, and he
loves being the resident 'big brother'.
#Post#: 445--------------------------------------------------
Re: Mike Guice
By: David M. Katz Date: September 26, 2017, 4:51 pm
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Jack,
I think you should be willing to take a lt of credit for Mike's
success.
#Post#: 446--------------------------------------------------
Re: Mike Guice
By: db105 Date: September 26, 2017, 5:30 pm
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[quote]Then I suggested that one swat, bare, for each $25
dollars was probably fair, if he was going to insist.[/quote]
Did he take that offer?
#Post#: 449--------------------------------------------------
Re: Mike Guice
By: Jack Date: September 26, 2017, 5:59 pm
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[quote author=db105 link=topic=50.msg446#msg446 date=1506465039]
[quote]Then I suggested that one swat, bare, for each $25
dollars was probably fair, if he was going to insist.[/quote]
Did he take that offer?
[/quote]
Re-read the last quote.
No, he didn't take it. After the first swat, we got to laughing
and crying and hugging and I guess he decided paying me back was
good enough.
#Post#: 501--------------------------------------------------
Re: Mike Guice
By: Leti Date: September 28, 2017, 7:43 pm
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Jack in May 19 2015
Since Mike has never been one of my potential spankees, I've
never talked about him a lot.
It's great having him here, though. He is a huge reader, and the
two of us share a lot of interests. It's kind of fun, because we
do differ some in specifics - like favorite series or which
authors we prefer most. That means we can have a lot of nitpicky
arguments that just confuse most of the guys.
One cute thing I noticed is that Mike seems to have
(unwillingly?) adopted a stray. KC seems to have decided that,
since he and Mike are both only children, that Mike should be
his big brother. They're only a year apart, and Mike isn't a lot
bigger than KC, but you can easily see that relationship between
the two of them. I don't know what Mike thinks of it, but I
think it's pretty darned cute.
(This was in Mike's Bio, I am not sure why it was not in the
file, but I have added it now.)
How is KC doing?
Thanks for sharing
Hugs
Leti
#Post#: 506--------------------------------------------------
Re: Mike Guice
By: Jack Date: September 29, 2017, 4:19 am
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It might have been listed, Leti, and I just didn't mention it
for some reason. I was still figuring out how I wanted to
approach these, so some entries may have been passed over for
what seemed like a good reason at the time.
I'll answer about KC elsewhere.
#Post#: 14082--------------------------------------------------
Re: Mike Guice
By: Jack Date: July 27, 2019, 1:33 pm
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Mike is still attending college and working on his master's
degree.
I don't have a masters, but Marcus does, and Mike is working on
his, so I know some thing about it, but it's second hand. I say
that because I'm not 100% positive what I'm about to say is
correct.
I mentioned before that Mike is studying a field in physics.
While there are classes he has to take, in order to get a
Master's of Science, there is also a lot of laboratory study and
research that has to be done. Because of that, and because he
missed taking a class he wanted (really needed) last year, he
did not get his master last spring. He's hoping he'll be ready
to graduate in December. He has also been offered a chance to do
some student teaching this fall, which he enjoys and would like
to do, but he has a dissertation to write. He has sent an
e-mail to his advisor, and they're going to discuss what would
be best. I've made it clear that he does have the option to aim
at a spring graduation, if that would be best for everyone.
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