DIR Return Create A Forum - Home
---------------------------------------------------------
Jack's House
HTML https://jackshouse.createaforum.com
---------------------------------------------------------
*****************************************************
DIR Return to: Biographies
*****************************************************
#Post#: 4516--------------------------------------------------
Re: Liam Marsh Wells
By: kalico Date: March 20, 2018, 8:03 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I’m glad y’all had a heart to heart and it went well..... sounds
all fair
Hugs kal
#Post#: 4522--------------------------------------------------
Re: Liam Marsh Wells
By: Zyngaru Date: March 20, 2018, 9:42 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Peer pressure is such a heavy thing for teens. Its heavy on
others as well, but for teens, wanting to fit in and feel
grownup and independent, at least in front of friends, is even
heavier.
Sometimes we forget that peer pressure is more than peers
getting you to do things you are not supposed to do, but also
things you know you should do but are worried about how peers
will view it. (Calling you that he would be late, or answering
your call to him.)
I agree with the taking the car keys away. I didn't think about
it until now, but since I just thought of it, I will throw it
out there and let you consider if it has merit or not. Since
the problem was over the weekend when his friends were available
to hang out with him and let him drive them around, I was
thinking instead of his car grounding being through the week, it
would be over the weekend.
I do see he is grounded from the car through Sunday, so it
amounts to the same thing. He won't be able to drive his
friends around this coming weekend.
#Post#: 4528--------------------------------------------------
Re: Liam Marsh Wells
By: Jack Date: March 21, 2018, 4:35 am
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=db105 link=topic=10.msg4511#msg4511
date=1521583939]
Well, I'm sure getting his phone back made him happy. He
probably missed that more than the car, don't you think?
[quote]he didn't answer because he didn't want to 'look like a
'b... ca... wuss' in front of the other guys.[/quote]
;D Teenagers!
[/quote]
DB, I think he probably did miss his phone a lot, though I try
to keep my kids from becoming too dependent on it. They're not
allowed at the dinner call (I normally don't even answer mine,
unless I'm expecting an important call, and I will occasionally
make that exception for one of the boys, though they have to
explain why the call they're expecting is so important). We've
reached the point now where none of the boys are allowed to have
their phones towards bedtime. Most of the boys (besides Connor
and Curtis) need about 8 or 8 1/2, with us starting the day
about 6:30, so I expect them to put their phones down (and turn
off the computers and games) by about 9pm. After a couple of
times when I've stepped in with a specific time most of the boys
are pretty good about sticking to that (believe me, you don't
want Dad checking to see if you have put it down, and taking it
from you if not, much less making you bring it to you, taking it
at supper, or adding a swat or two with the paddle).
Yeah - the worst part about the whole thing is, I pointed out he
could have just stepped out of the car so he didn't have to talk
to me with the boys right there. I also pointed out that he
could have called and asked for permission, or even just texted
me to let me know what was going on, and he would have avoided
most of the trouble. He had a V-8 moment at that point.
#Post#: 4536--------------------------------------------------
Re: Liam Marsh Wells
By: David M. Katz Date: March 21, 2018, 3:42 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I think you handled Liam well.
With older boys CP can often be the easy way out. I think it
was Kat who once suggested that CP fr older teens should be
reserved for minor issues.
I think it is all about knowing the boy and you seemed to have
nailed it with Liam.
#Post#: 4540--------------------------------------------------
Re: Liam Marsh Wells
By: Jack Date: March 21, 2018, 4:00 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=David M. Katz link=topic=10.msg4536#msg4536
date=1521664943]
With older boys CP can often be the easy way out. I think it
was Kat who once suggested that CP fr older teens should be
reserved for minor issues.
[/quote]
I know Kat once said, 'just because something isn't the most
effective doesn't mean it's not effective,' or something like
that. That's how I look at CP for the older boys.
For the most part, you probably know that I see CP as a
consequence. With an older kid, they probably know that they
screwed up, and they understand that they need to correct their
behavior. I see the paddle as a way to put an exclamation point
at the end of our discussion, so we can just move on. While I
think CP is generally effective with Liam (he was bawling when
we had the phone trouble back in February
HTML https://jackshouse.createaforum.com/botd/botd-2018122-catching-a-virus-a-jack-production/<br
/>), but this case he just totally came off wrong. I guess it's
that, if a kid seems to be taking their correction for granted,
it doesn't seem like it's working.
I don't mind using it even for more major problems, but I do
think that there are times when you need something that lasts a
bit longer.
#Post#: 5826--------------------------------------------------
Re: Liam Marsh Wells
By: Jack Date: May 22, 2018, 4:33 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Liam and I had some trouble this weekend.
Remember a couple of weeks ago, when he took off to get dinner,
and ended up coming home several hours later and after curfew?
Remember that he's now required to turn in and stick to an
itinerary when he 'hangs' with his friends? You do? I ask,
because apparently he doesn't.
We got in a big disagreement Friday night, because he decided he
wanted to drive to Deadpool, so he and his friends could go 'get
something to eat or something' after the movie. I told him no.
He asked why.
I explained that first, he was supposed to plan these things out
ahead of time in detail. This plan most definitely didn't match
that. Second, he was supposed to get that approved ahead of
time, and we were supposed to be leaving for the movie in about
15 minutes.
He then tried explaining to me how unreasonable I was, so I
reminded him of exactly why he was in this situation. He rolled
his eyes. I offered to let him stay home.
I thought we were done then, though I did talk to him a bit to
make sure we each understood the same thing on him giving me
notice and time to approve plans before hand. That's not to say
that I won't let him do something on short notice, but not when
there are a dozen other things going on, and not when it's as
vague as what he'd suggested.
Everything seemed okay for a short while, then Saturday night,
he started up again. He and and Kevin Bartlett wanted to get
together, call a few other guys, go see if anyone was at the
mall or Putt Putt, then maybe.... I stopped him there. 'No.'
I reminded him that I hadn't grounded him, but that he was now
having to turn in a detailed itinerary because he can't be on
time and be where he said he'd be. What he needed to do was
decide what they wanted to do, right that down for me, and I'd
probably tell him yes at that point.
Let me point out here that he'd already done that once the
weekend before, and it seemed to go fine, as far as I could
tell.
Instead of just listening and doing as he should, he starting
arguing with me, and he kept it up long enough to spend Saturday
night in his room with no electronics. Even then, he had to be
offered the choice of a paddling to go with it if he didn't
quite backtalking before he left.
I made him stay home Sunday as well, though I let him have his
phone and a couple of his friends came over. I'm sure they all
agreed about how unreasonable I'm being.
[hr]
I have given this some thought, and I think I understand what's
going on here.
Their mom died nearly two years ago. I believe his (adopted
step) father passed away a couple of years before that, when
Liam was probably 13. I know he went through some behavior
problems at that point, which is understandable.
I've heard it said a number of times that people suppress trauma
until they feel safe. I remember one of my cats had hurt her
leg somehow, and she was limping and acting pretty pitiful.
When we got her to the vet, everything seemed normal. We
figured out what was wrong with her, but he explained that
animals are nervous about appearing weak in an insecure
environment. They might let you know they feel bad, because
they trust you, but they won't want to admit it to the vet
because they feel threatened, so they want to look strong.
People are kind of the same way - the mind suppresses things
when it feels unsafe, because it wants us to be able to do with
whatever's the reason for the lack of safety.
When I first met Liam, his real concern was keeping his brothers
together and seeing they were taken care of. I think, at this
point, he understands that they are safe and secure. What I
don't know is if he's reverting to his old, bad habits; or if
he's finally working through his own trauma; or if he's acting
out for attention; or if he's testing me; or if it's something
else entirely.
Liam has a session with his therapist this week. I've already
sent an e-mail to the therapist giving him a general idea of
what's been going on, and that Liam's behavior seems to have
changed in the last few months. He's going to evaluate if this
is a problem, or just fairly normal teenage behavior, as well as
whether Liam might benefit from more frequent sessions for a
while.
We'll see where it goes from there.
#Post#: 5831--------------------------------------------------
Re: Liam Marsh Wells
By: Adric Date: May 22, 2018, 9:05 am
---------------------------------------------------------
I feel a lot of sympathy for Liam's situation, and it doesn't
seem to me that it is a matter for a therapist. I'm sure I
don't fully understand the situation, but from what I've read I
would also find those travel restrictions very difficult to deal
with. I would deal with them differently than he did, but not
necessarily in a better way. (I would probably choose
self-imposed grounding over being on a "short leash" and having
my friends know just how short it is.)
#Post#: 5832--------------------------------------------------
Re: Liam Marsh Wells
By: db105 Date: May 22, 2018, 10:11 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hmm... yes, it doesn't seem so out of the ordinary for a
teenager to have this kind of clashes with an authority figure.
However, since he is seeing a therapist it makes sense to
mention it to him, to see what he makes of it.
#Post#: 5835--------------------------------------------------
Re: Liam Marsh Wells
By: Jack Date: May 22, 2018, 1:08 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
The reason I'm mentioning it to the therapist is not the
behavior per se, but because it seems like a very drastic change
in just a few months. My personal opinion is that basically the
honeymoon is over, and he's gone from a helpful, cheery angel to
what he would have been like all along. While it's a pain in my
butt (and likely to become a pain in his), it's also good news,
because it probably does mean that he feels like he's safe and
at home.
As for the restriction, Adric - if I were him, I'd just say,
'Nah, my dad's making me jump through all these hoops 'cause I
was late a couple of times, but at least I'm not grounded."
My intentions in doing this are to avoid grounding him, and to
give him a chance to show me that he can be responsible. Maybe
I need to talk to him a bit more, while we're both calm, and
explain that.
#Post#: 5839--------------------------------------------------
Re: Liam Marsh Wells
By: Zyngaru Date: May 22, 2018, 3:55 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=Jack link=topic=10.msg5835#msg5835
date=1527012510]
As for the restriction, Adric - if I were him, I'd just say,
'Nah, my dad's making me jump through all these hoops 'cause I
was late a couple of times, but at least I'm not grounded."
My intentions in doing this are to avoid grounding him, and to
give him a chance to show me that he can be responsible. Maybe
I need to talk to him a bit more, while we're both calm, and
explain that.
[/quote]
I agree with the Restriction comment. Put the blame on the
adult in the room. "Dad's gone all authoritarian and making
life rough on me right now." I think most kids understand that
statement.
As for having another talk with Liam. I think that is a good
idea. There is no telling what is going through his head as to
why you are insisting him give you an itinerary. So, making it
clear to him that you are trying to go easy on him and you, with
the itinerary thing so you don't have to ground him for being
late and not checking in with you. Try to get him to see it as
he is getting off easy. At least he can see his friends this
way.
Hopefully you don't get the common comeback. "It ain't fair.
You're not being fair. You're being unrealistic."
*****************************************************
DIR Previous Page
DIR Next Page