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#Post#: 52078--------------------------------------------------
Re: Offensive words - and which ones are TOO offensive
DIR By: Queenie
Date: December 15, 2021, 6:01 am
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I just checked the rules, and right at the top are
"Be civil.'
and
"No hate speech or slurs."
Therefore I believe that use of the c-word in any context
besides describing a vagina would be disallowed.
Good: Slobberdog keepks licking her [vagina].
Bad: This politician I dislike is a [vagina.]
I do think there's a spectrum of vulgar and I do think [vagina]
is on the "more offensive" end of it, and I do think that
[penis] is on the milder end and I don't know why I think this.
I definitely think doink and doodyhead are fine.
#Post#: 52117--------------------------------------------------
Re: Offensive words - and which ones are TOO offensive
DIR By: Itopian
Date: December 15, 2021, 8:22 am
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I'm going to proceed on the assumption that "asshole" is still
acceptable, on the grounds that (barring the rarest of medical
anomalies) everybody has one, so it doesn't single out any
protected group in particular. ( and that, no, "asshole" is not
a protected group)
I'm also going to conclude that if you are fine with gendered
insults against one sex, and not against another, that there is
a sexist in the room, and I'm afraid I HAVE SOME BAD NEWS (cue
music). Elaborate arguments about why "that's different!!!" will
not sway me on that score.
#Post#: 52133--------------------------------------------------
Re: Offensive words - and which ones are TOO offensive
DIR By: oreally
Date: December 15, 2021, 9:29 am
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Calling people names is probably not a good idea ever. I have a
bad habit of it when I am alone and no one can hear me, which
makes it all the easier to say when I have an audience.
"What an ass."
"Jeez, don't be such an asswipe."
Most of my insults are ass related.
Somehow making it a simile rather than a metaphor seems a little
better.
"You're acting like an ass right now."
Better still would be addressing a behavior rather than
pronouncing what a person is or acts like.
And best would be to save my vulgarities for inanimate objects
and random situations.
Not using vulgarities at all might be too big an ask.
#Post#: 52146--------------------------------------------------
Re: Offensive words - and which ones are TOO offensive
DIR By: floridafan15
Date: December 15, 2021, 10:03 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: kkt link ---
>
> [quote author=VagueMagician link=topic=609.msg51899#msg51899
date=1639517213]
> I agree with Queenie except I'm okay with male-gendered
insults (bastard, dick). You know, as long as we're being gender
inclusive when we use them.
>
--- End Quote ---
Bastard is male-gendered? I thought it was a child of unmarried
parents, either sex...
[/quote]
I called an ex-BF a bastard once. His response was that he
didn't care because I wasn't insulting him, I was insulting his
mother. In his mind, it was slut-shaming and by definition could
only apply to a woman because only a woman had a duty to not
sleep around. I'd never heard that particular take on misogyny
before.
#Post#: 52300--------------------------------------------------
Re: Offensive words - and which ones are TOO offensive
DIR By: GingerJ1
Date: December 15, 2021, 2:31 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Thetis099 link ---
>
> To clarify, when I say I want to see this word's power taken
away, I mean for women. Misogynistic men won't change how they
view women because women take the power out of the word. The
power I want to see evaporate is the power it has over women in
the context of other women. We tear each other down with it -
misogynistic men don't need our help with that. People,
including women, will use the word. Better to take the power
down from the nuclear level to an equivalent position with the
"p" word if at all possible. Were a bunch of women mad at Cardi
B. and Megan for their gratuitous use of the "p" word in their
song "WAP" last year? If they were I must have missed it. I
want that for the "c" word.
>
> It will never be a neutral word. That's not even the point.
Many "reclaimed" words retain their original nuclearness when
used by those exerting the word upon others in order to degrade.
Those people will degrade even if they are forced to changed
their vocabulary around said degradation. Yes, this is a divide
but a divide that already exists and a divide that women can't
unilaterally reconcile. We would need men too. We won't get
the misogynistic men, so we take the power out of it for women
in relation to women as much as we can.
>
> I have asked many women over many years to explain why they
are so against the "c" word but not the "p" word or any other
slang term for vagina. Most can't fully explain why they hate
the "c" word so much. They just know it is the worst thing and
that's that. They learned early on that acceptance among other
women required having that same attitude about the "c" word
being nuclear. Me and my damned curious why questions.
>
> And, there is no way in hell there will ever be a consensus on
which words are not okay and why they are not okay. Better to
go after intent behind the words. At least that seems less
problematic.
>
--- End Quote ---
The problem with "taking away a word's power" is that it doesn't
work.
Especially if the way you try to do this is to use the word a
lot and insult/appall the folks who don't have this goal. They
will just think the less of the person spouting vulgarities.
Others may disagree, and that's fine, but I made my living using
words, and considering both connotations and denotations, and I
stand by my opinion...for what it's worth.
#Post#: 52430--------------------------------------------------
Re: Offensive words - and which ones are TOO offensive
DIR By: offtopicalways
Date: December 15, 2021, 7:16 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Thetis099 link ---
>
>
> I have asked many women over many years to explain why they
are so against the "c" word but not the "p" word or any other
slang term for vagina. Most can't fully explain why they hate
the "c" word so much. They just know it is the worst thing and
that's that. They learned early on that acceptance among other
women required having that same attitude about the "c" word
being nuclear. Me and my damned curious why questions.
>
>
--- End Quote ---
I think it's the sound: the hard c, short u, nt. It's just harsh
sounding in a way similar meaning words aren't. It's probably
enough of a difference that over time, the gap just grew.
#Post#: 52449--------------------------------------------------
Re: Offensive words - and which ones are TOO offensive
DIR By: PalomaBlanca
Date: December 15, 2021, 10:10 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Thetis099 link ---
>
>
> I have asked many women over many years to explain why they
are so against the "c" word but not the "p" word or any other
slang term for vagina. Most can't fully explain why they hate
the "c" word so much. They just know it is the worst thing and
that's that. They learned early on that acceptance among other
women required having that same attitude about the "c" word
being nuclear. Me and my damned curious why questions.
>
>
--- End Quote ---
I'm not against a little swearing. When I'm annoyed, the f-bomb
with a lot of alliteration is fun. Others are the really
colorful phrases I've picked up in my wanderings. The end
result of these is that I crack myself up, and that ends the
annoyance. [I know - the simple pleasures, right? :) ]
The words quoted above though really, really bother me. I'd
probably give the side-eye to anyone who used them and it would
affect how I see them. I appreciate Thetis' pov, which forced
me to ask myself why I feel that way, and if the words can be
disempowered.
I don't think they can be. Whenever I've heard them, they are
said with such hatred, and an intent to demean. And can we
circle back to vulgar? I don't know if de-sensitizing ourselves
to the vulgar or the hate-filled really does us a public
service. It's a long road to try to reclaim those words and it's
just. not. worth. it. I'd fight hard for something I believe
in......and there's nothing to believe in here.
Fwiw, I have equal shying away from the male equivalent. Same
reasons.
#Post#: 52455--------------------------------------------------
Re: Offensive words - and which ones are TOO offensive
DIR By: kkt
Date: December 15, 2021, 10:57 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: floridafan15 link ---
>
> [quote author=kkt link=topic=609.msg52074#msg52074
date=1639554942]
> [quote author=VagueMagician link=topic=609.msg51899#msg51899
date=1639517213]
> I agree with Queenie except I'm okay with male-gendered
insults (bastard, dick). You know, as long as we're being gender
inclusive when we use them.
>
--- End Quote ---
Bastard is male-gendered? I thought it was a child of unmarried
parents, either sex...
[/quote]
I called an ex-BF a bastard once. His response was that he
didn't care because I wasn't insulting him, I was insulting his
mother. In his mind, it was slut-shaming and by definition could
only apply to a woman because only a woman had a duty to not
sleep around. I'd never heard that particular take on misogyny
before.
[/quote]
Wow, that is a very special interpretation of that insult.
#Post#: 52470--------------------------------------------------
Re: Offensive words - and which ones are TOO offensive
DIR By: ManyHats
Date: December 16, 2021, 7:07 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: billieryder link ---
>
> In general its pretty hard to shock me over general swearing.
What gets me annoyed is name calling and is doesn't have to be
swearing to annoy me. I really hate the words stupid and moron
for instance. The statement "You're a moron" gets me pretty
steamed and not a single swear word in sight.
>
> I'm pretty sure I'm not "woke" as I'm not even sure what that
means but it doesn't seem like rocket science that name calling
is disrespectful regardless of the use of swear words - or not.
>
> As long as its not name calling its not too offensive in my
mind.
>
--- End Quote ---
Riffing on name calling: I hate the term "trophy wife" and did
not even apply it to the former FLOTUS, much as I do not admire
her. To me, it's the same as calling someone a prostitute or any
of the other gazillion pejoratives people call female sex
workers. A guy I thought was a friend of DH's and mine applied
it to me in his comment on a pic someone else tagged us in on
FB. I messaged the guy to gently call him out - "hey, it's not
like you to call people names; did I do something to cheese you
off?" He flipped out and unfriended me. Okay, then.
#Post#: 52487--------------------------------------------------
Re: Offensive words - and which ones are TOO offensive
DIR By: Itopian
Date: December 16, 2021, 8:37 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: kkt link ---
>
> [quote author=floridafan15 link=topic=609.msg52146#msg52146
date=1639584224]
> [quote author=kkt link=topic=609.msg52074#msg52074
date=1639554942]
> [quote author=VagueMagician link=topic=609.msg51899#msg51899
date=1639517213]
> I agree with Queenie except I'm okay with male-gendered
insults (bastard, dick). You know, as long as we're being gender
inclusive when we use them.
>
--- End Quote ---
Bastard is male-gendered? I thought it was a child of unmarried
parents, either sex...
[/quote]
I called an ex-BF a bastard once. His response was that he
didn't care because I wasn't insulting him, I was insulting his
mother. In his mind, it was slut-shaming and by definition could
only apply to a woman because only a woman had a duty to not
sleep around. I'd never heard that particular take on misogyny
before.
[/quote]
Wow, that is a very special interpretation of that insult.
[/quote]
I salute the half that refuses to be shamed by accusations about
an accident of birth a person couldn't possibly affect or
improve upon. It's also curiously obsolete, denoting a person
too "base" to inherit, whether property or title.
I don't salute the slut-shaming that followed it.
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