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#Post#: 256543--------------------------------------------------
Re: Your Excuses For Eating Meat Are Predictable And Wrong,
Study Finds
DIR By: northbayteky
Date: June 12, 2024, 4:55 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: LabPartner link ---
>
> [quote author=northbayteky link=topic=2795.msg256533#msg256533
date=1718227328]
> [quote author=LabPartner link=topic=2795.msg256526#msg256526
date=1718225656]
> Just curious if anyone has done this study:
> How many millions (billions?) of people would have to stop
eating meat before the factory farms that produce it would
switch to other products?
>
--- End Quote ---
The way to get people to stop eating meat is to show them how it
gets to their plate. Even then, I'm not sure it would actually
make a difference. I was born on a farm and am familiar with how
chickens, pigs and cows arrive in the grocery store and I still
buy it.
[/quote]
Not really my question, but I don't think it would work. I've
watched those videos already.
[/quote]
I know. I just can't imagine what will motivate people to give
up meat. I know where it comes from and the realities of factory
farming and I'm not inclined to give it up. I don't know what
the answer is.
#Post#: 256563--------------------------------------------------
Re: Your Excuses For Eating Meat Are Predictable And Wrong,
Study Finds
DIR By: kkt
Date: June 12, 2024, 6:28 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: northbayteky link ---
>
> [quote author=LabPartner link=topic=2795.msg256537#msg256537
date=1718228343]
> [quote author=northbayteky link=topic=2795.msg256533#msg256533
date=1718227328]
> [quote author=LabPartner link=topic=2795.msg256526#msg256526
date=1718225656]
> Just curious if anyone has done this study:
> How many millions (billions?) of people would have to stop
eating meat before the factory farms that produce it would
switch to other products?
>
--- End Quote ---
The way to get people to stop eating meat is to show them how it
gets to their plate. Even then, I'm not sure it would actually
make a difference. I was born on a farm and am familiar with how
chickens, pigs and cows arrive in the grocery store and I still
buy it.
[/quote]
Not really my question, but I don't think it would work. I've
watched those videos already.
[/quote]
I know. I just can't imagine what will motivate people to give
up meat. I know where it comes from and the realities of factory
farming and I'm not inclined to give it up. I don't know what
the answer is.
[/quote]
Only if you convice people that it's actively bad for their
health. And even then, not everyone would quit.
#Post#: 256572--------------------------------------------------
Re: Your Excuses For Eating Meat Are Predictable And Wrong,
Study Finds
DIR By: farmgirl
Date: June 12, 2024, 7:44 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I don't actually like to eat meat and rarely eat fish. I eat an
average of a few ounces of meat/month and probably 8 ounces of
canned fish/shellfish. But I like poultry, eggs, and dairy
(although not so much cheese.)
I admit that giving up poultry, dairy milk and eggs would be
very difficult for me - and to be honest, it is made more
difficult by my being unable to eat any wheat at all. A lot of
things that vegans eat have wheat or wheat protein. And gluten
free things often substitute eggs for the lack of wheat, since
GF flours don't hold together so the eggs provide the elasticity
that would normally come from the wheat. You can sometimes work
around it at home, but in restaurants it can be very difficult.
If you're giving up meat because of climate implications, the
charts are interesting. Cheese is worse than poultry or pork
for example.
HTML https://haxnuts.createaforum.com//www.un.org/en/climatechange/science/climate-issues/food#:~:text=Animal%2Dbased%20foods%2C%20especially%20red,the%20highest%20greenhouse%20gas%20emissions.
#Post#: 256573--------------------------------------------------
Re: Your Excuses For Eating Meat Are Predictable And Wrong,
Study Finds
DIR By: kkt
Date: June 12, 2024, 7:49 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: farmgirl link ---
>
> I don't actually like to eat meat and rarely eat fish. I eat
an average of a few ounces of meat/month and probably 8 ounces
of canned fish/shellfish. But I like poultry, eggs, and dairy
(although not so much cheese.)
>
> I admit that giving up poultry, dairy milk and eggs would be
very difficult for me - and to be honest, it is made more
difficult by my being unable to eat any wheat at all. A lot of
things that vegans eat have wheat or wheat protein. And gluten
free things often substitute eggs for the lack of wheat, since
GF flours don't hold together so the eggs provide the elasticity
that would normally come from the wheat. You can sometimes work
around it at home, but in restaurants it can be very difficult.
>
> If you're giving up meat because of climate implications, the
charts are interesting. Cheese is worse than poultry or pork
for example.
>
>
HTML https://haxnuts.createaforum.com//www.un.org/en/climatechange/science/climate-issues/food#:~:text=Animal%2Dbased%20foods%2C%20especially%20red,the%20highest%20greenhouse%20gas%20emissions.
>
--- End Quote ---
But I love cheese! there must be some other way to save the
planet.
#Post#: 256575--------------------------------------------------
Re: Your Excuses For Eating Meat Are Predictable And Wrong,
Study Finds
DIR By: northbayteky
Date: June 12, 2024, 8:02 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: kkt link ---
>
> [quote author=northbayteky link=topic=2795.msg256543#msg256543
date=1718229331]
> [quote author=LabPartner link=topic=2795.msg256537#msg256537
date=1718228343]
> [quote author=northbayteky link=topic=2795.msg256533#msg256533
date=1718227328]
> [quote author=LabPartner link=topic=2795.msg256526#msg256526
date=1718225656]
> Just curious if anyone has done this study:
> How many millions (billions?) of people would have to stop
eating meat before the factory farms that produce it would
switch to other products?
>
--- End Quote ---
The way to get people to stop eating meat is to show them how it
gets to their plate. Even then, I'm not sure it would actually
make a difference. I was born on a farm and am familiar with how
chickens, pigs and cows arrive in the grocery store and I still
buy it.
[/quote]
Not really my question, but I don't think it would work. I've
watched those videos already.
[/quote]
I know. I just can't imagine what will motivate people to give
up meat. I know where it comes from and the realities of factory
farming and I'm not inclined to give it up. I don't know what
the answer is.
[/quote]
Only if you convice people that it's actively bad for their
health. And even then, not everyone would quit.
[/quote]
I think the jury is still out on that one. I really think it
comes down to personal genetics. Some people do horrible on a
plant based diet. Others do horrible eating meat.
#Post#: 256605--------------------------------------------------
Re: Your Excuses For Eating Meat Are Predictable And Wrong,
Study Finds
DIR By: Thetis099
Date: June 13, 2024, 7:16 am
---------------------------------------------------------
I didn't read this article as advocating for only a meat free
diet, but also for a reduced meat diet. I find it interesting
that some seem to have interpreted this as a "don't eat any
meat, ever" article, or, they only read the clickbaity headlines
and not the complete article and maybe that is why they got that
message. I think both sides tend to get defensive because both
sides feel attacked over it. For sure, there has been much shit
talking and joking around about vegans for at least 15 years
now. I don't think that exists for those who eat meat, please
correct me if I am wrong about that.
Two of my guesses as to why:
Some may get a bit defensive because they feel attacked for
eating meat, and some get defensive because they know they could
cut down on meat to help the planet, but they just don't want to
because they like to eat meat, and they are tired of being
reminded. Those are certainly valid feelings, just like the
feelings of wanting to do something as individuals to limit our
impact on the environment.
I do get annoyed sometimes when the excuses that are complete
bullshit are thrown out there, just like I get annoyed when
vegetarians and vegans use bullshit arguments to shit talk those
who eat meat. There are plenty of verifiable data out there for
vegetarians and vegans to use for counterargument, so they
should use that if they insist on arguing, but, I really think
they should stop the shit talking, and so should those who love
to shit talk vegetarians and vegans.
Own you lifestyle choices and I (as well as every other
vegetarian or vegan I know) have no beef with you, pun intended.
And, just sayin', there are plenty of folks from the meat
industry who also have an agenda, you know, the ones who try to
claim eating avocado toast does more damage to the planet than
raising cattle (so NOT true). They sure as fuck don't want any
messages against beef, and it has been that way for a long time
- just ask Oprah how that "I will never eat a burger again"
statement she made because mad cow disease was a scary moment
got those folks all the way up her ass for a while. I thought
they would never stop talking about it in Texas, and I am
certain there are still some good ol' boys bitching about her
comment today:
HTML https://www.texastribune.org/2018/01/10/time-oprah-winfrey-beefed-texas-cattle-industry/#:~:text=The%20beef%20interview&text=Howard%20Lyman%2C%20a%20vegetarian%20and,I'm%20stopped.%22
Similarly, vegetarians and vegans can be too rigid with their
ideas and and sometimes seem to want to shame people who eat
meat. I don't like that shit either - it is counterproductive
to the planetary cause they claim to support. They need to stop
as much as the contingent of vegetarian and vegan haters. There
is room for everyone, and there is room for meat, just a whole
lot less of it if we want to slow the planetary bleeding.
HTML https://media0.giphy.com/media/y4yJaxSPmxgEo/200.gif
#Post#: 256606--------------------------------------------------
Re: Your Excuses For Eating Meat Are Predictable And Wrong,
Study Finds
DIR By: Thetis099
Date: June 13, 2024, 7:23 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: LabPartner link ---
>
> Just curious if anyone has done this study:
> How many millions (billions?) of people would have to stop
eating meat before the factory farms that produce it would
switch to other products?
>
--- End Quote ---
Excellent question. I don't have time to read the whole article
at the moment (headed out of town this morning), but this is an
article about how to feed the global population, so the answer
may be contained within - step one seems really important:
"Step One: Freeze Agriculture’s Footprint
For most of history, whenever we’ve needed to produce more food,
we’ve simply cut down forests or plowed grasslands to make more
farms. We’ve already cleared an area roughly the size of South
America to grow crops. To raise livestock, we’ve taken over even
more land, an area roughly the size of Africa. Agriculture’s
footprint has caused the loss of whole ecosystems around the
globe, including the prairies of North America and the Atlantic
forest of Brazil, and tropical forests continue to be cleared at
alarming rates. But we can no longer afford to increase food
production through agricultural expansion. Trading tropical
forest for farmland is one of the most destructive things we do
to the environment, and it is rarely done to benefit the 850
million people in the world who are still hungry. Most of the
land cleared for agriculture in the tropics does not contribute
much to the world’s food security but is instead used to produce
cattle, soybeans for livestock, timber, and palm oil. Avoiding
further deforestation must be a top priority."
HTML https://www.nationalgeographic.com/foodfeatures/feeding-9-billion/
#Post#: 256644--------------------------------------------------
Re: Your Excuses For Eating Meat Are Predictable And Wrong,
Study Finds
DIR By: Paloma
Date: June 13, 2024, 9:20 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Safe travels, Thetis!!
Right now, we're vegetarian about half the week. (There are
health reasons I don't want to enumerate in a public forum. :)
) The other times, we add meat or sometimes cheese/eggs. I
think we lived on baked potato soup with cheddar and chives this
winter!
With all the flexing back and forth, people really noticed how
they felt with different diets. I feel better without meat.
The kids say they feel better with it. (They're all pretty
athletic). Spouse requires protein. What people eat makes a
huge difference in not just how they feel but how they perform
at work, in school, etc. Interestingly, some feel more able to
do creative, innovative thought on different diets. And now as
adults, everyone is making their own choices where they are.
I'm thinking this accounts for some of the defensiveness people
show towards diet: their life outcomes are affected by what
they do or don't eat. :)
#Post#: 257333--------------------------------------------------
Re: Your Excuses For Eating Meat Are Predictable And Wrong,
Study Finds
DIR By: Tryp_OR
Date: June 16, 2024, 6:43 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: kkt link ---
>
> [quote author=northbayteky link=topic=2795.msg256543#msg256543
date=1718229331]
> [quote author=LabPartner link=topic=2795.msg256537#msg256537
date=1718228343]
> [quote author=northbayteky link=topic=2795.msg256533#msg256533
date=1718227328]
> [quote author=LabPartner link=topic=2795.msg256526#msg256526
date=1718225656]
> Just curious if anyone has done this study:
> How many millions (billions?) of people would have to stop
eating meat before the factory farms that produce it would
switch to other products?
>
--- End Quote ---
The way to get people to stop eating meat is to show them how it
gets to their plate. Even then, I'm not sure it would actually
make a difference. I was born on a farm and am familiar with how
chickens, pigs and cows arrive in the grocery store and I still
buy it.
[/quote]
Not really my question, but I don't think it would work. I've
watched those videos already.
[/quote]
I know. I just can't imagine what will motivate people to give
up meat. I know where it comes from and the realities of factory
farming and I'm not inclined to give it up. I don't know what
the answer is.
[/quote]
Only if you convice people that it's actively bad for their
health. And even then, not everyone would quit.
[/quote]
Yeah, it would have to be a quickly observable effect. For
example, the alpha-gal allergy that people develop after certain
tick bites is a pretty convincing incentive for those people to
avoid mammalian meat. I'm pretty sure that even a high
likelihood of developing (e.g.) heart disease after age 50 would
not be not meaningful for people who have 20 or 30 years to go.
Maybe if it were near certainty and they experience their
parents dying, the cause-and-effect message might be strong
enough.
RE Lab's question about how many people would have to give up
eating meat to cause factory farming to disappear -- I'd say the
answer is almost everyone (certainly more than 90% of
population). There are industries related to specialty diets
that target far less than 10% of the population. One
counterargument -- if such meat production were outlawed rather
than fading away due to market forces. California's cage-free
egg production law is an example (although full compliance seems
to be behind schedule).
#Post#: 257335--------------------------------------------------
Re: Your Excuses For Eating Meat Are Predictable And Wrong,
Study Finds
DIR By: farmgirl
Date: June 16, 2024, 6:54 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I read this last summer - How a mere 12% of Americans eat half
the nation’s beef, creating significant health and environmental
impacts
HTML https://news.tulane.edu/pr/how-mere-12-americans-eat-half-nation%E2%80%99s-beef-creating-significant-health-and-environmental#:~:text=of%20beef%20consumption.-,Those%2012%25%20%E2%80%93%20most%20likely%20to%20be%20men%20or%20people%20between,combined%20for%20those%20consuming%202200
I thought it was pretty interesting.
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