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#Post#: 800--------------------------------------------------
Solving the Mysteries of Rokkenjima! (Your Blue Truths to Solve
the Murders!)
By: Kirei Ryuusei Date: April 21, 2011, 9:29 pm
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I didn't see a thread like this one before so I decided to start
one! I looked at the mysteries that were done in Umineko and
thought "Is there a real solution to it?" I started this little
debate with Subaru-kun (since you don't know, she's a girl) on
the CLAMP in Forumland site we both are on. We tried to come up
with solutions whether they be nonsense, complexities, or
complete word play so now I wonder...can anyone one come up with
the murders' solution(s)?
Here's some of my theories...
In the 1st game...
--The toolshed was really obvious. As Battler said "Anyone
without an alibi could do it".
--When it came to Nanjo, Genji, and Kumasawa's death instead of
using Battler's method I will pull the 'play on words'. All the
deaths were homocides and Maria didn't kill them. 'Them' is
plural meaning Maria couldn't have killed more than one person.
However, one of the adults could have killed the other two and
Maria then killed the last person out of self-defense.
--Eva and Hideyoshi's death: I'll play the card from chiru. It
is possible for the culprit to have killed both Eva and
Hideyoshi and hid when Kanon and Genji were sent to find them.
Since Kanon broke the closed room the culprit could've slipped
out as soon as they left!
--Natsuhi and Kanon: Simple, any of the survivors could have
killed them then the other people still alive!
1st game: Who is the culprit? I won't deny Battler's logic,
anyone can fake a corpse since the first six with the exception
of Shannon couldn't be identified! However, this is only a game
of denying magic--anti-fantasy, meaning there is no rule that a
person, even the solver of the murders, could lie about their
alibis or what they witnessed! Anyone excluding Shannon,
Natsuhi, Genji, Kumasawa, Nanjo, and Kanon could be the cuplrit!
Furthermore ANYONE could have been an accomplice!
How do you like that? Feel free to assert my 'blue truth' or
deny with your own 'red' or 'blue'! I'll work on the other games
too so we can debate the solutions to the Rokkenjima murders!
#Post#: 816--------------------------------------------------
Re: Solving the Mysteries of Rokkenjima! (Your Blue Truths to So
lve the Murders!)
By: Yopee Date: May 14, 2011, 9:58 pm
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Ep1
First twilight
[quote author=Kirei Ryuusei link=topic=123.msg800#msg800
date=1303439377]
--The toolshed was really obvious. As Battler said "Anyone
without an alibi could do it".
[/quote]
I'm sorry but I'm going to have to remind you of a painful red
truth that destroys any chance of the five dead adults being
body doubles. The identities of all unidentified corpses are
guaranteed! You might still have some luck with Krauss but not
the other four adults.
I'm going to have to go with Will and say that there was no
Shannon/sixth body in the shed. This will automatically imply
that Hideyoshi, Kanon, Nanjo, and possibly George are
suspicious.
Second twilight
Again, I will go with Will and say that the chain was never set.
This implies that Kanon, Genji, and possibly Kumasawa are
suspicious.
Furthermore, I suggest that Hideyoshi is faking since he and
Nanjo were already suspicious from before.
Fourth/Fifth twilights
I don't mean to sound like a Will worshiper but he just nails
the first game down completely. Kanon was found alive by Battler
and co. This implies that Kanon and Nanjo are suspicious.
Well Kinzo is just easy. I mean he wasn't even alive to start
with...
Sixth/Seventh/Eighth twilights
[quote author=Kirei Ryuusei link=topic=123.msg800#msg800
date=1303439377]
--When it came to Nanjo, Genji, and Kumasawa's death instead of
using Battler's method I will pull the 'play on words'. All the
deaths were homocides and Maria didn't kill them. 'Them' is
plural meaning Maria couldn't have killed more than one person.
However, one of the adults could have killed the other two and
Maria then killed the last person out of self-defense.
[/quote]
Maria, who was in the same room, did not kill them!
I don't think Maria killed any of them. Pretty silly to me how
the culprit would come in and kill two old geezers and leave one
for Maria. Might as well get the job done and take out all three
of them at once. That's what I am lead to believe too based on
the fact that there are more than one wound on the geezers. Eva,
Hideyoshi (if he's not faking), and Natsuhi all suffered a
one-hit clean kill with no wounds other than the one with the
stake inside. However, each of them were killed on their own so
the culprit only had to handle one person at a time. These three
old geezers in the parlour, however, were obviously together so
the culprit had to take on three people this time around. At
least one of them is bound to run for it so the culprit would
most likely have to take them down as fast as he could. That's
why their heads turned to smashed watermelons. Same sort of
thing probably happened with the first twilight siblings.
And there's no way Maria can kill out of self-defense. She would
not have been attacked by any of the three old geezers. Genji,
Kumasawa, and Nanjo are not killers! However, Maria could have
been an accomplice and helped the culprit kill the three old
geezers.
Will says Maria did nothing except for singing by the wall while
one of the unaccounted for (Shannon, Kanon, Hideyoshi) killed
the three old geezers. Then George lied about the door being
locked, taking his time with the keys and making quite some
noise to alert the culprit nearby that Battler and co have
arrived.
For once, I sort of disagree with Will. I argue that maybe
rather than George, Maria was the one who is suspicious and
locked the door to create the illusion of the locked room.
One other theory would be the kill, hide, escape method. The
parlour room's layout and furnishings have never been described
fully so I might be going against Dine and Knox with this theory
but the culprit was hiding behind maybe a sofa or some other
reasonably large furniture/concealed place. Battler was in a
real rush entering the room and completely missed out on a
letter that Natsuhi spotted which makes it reasonable to think
he may have even failed to spot the hiding culprit.
Ninth twilight
Natsuhi was shot for real by the culprit lol Nothing to it.
So in conclusion, I think Kanon, Shannon, and/or Hideyoshi are
the culprits for Ep1, with George, Genji, and Nanjo being likely
accomplices. Maybe Maria or Kumasawa too.
#Post#: 818--------------------------------------------------
Re: Solving the Mysteries of Rokkenjima! (Your Blue Truths to So
lve the Murders!)
By: DetectiveFurudoErika Date: May 17, 2011, 12:40 pm
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Oh, this is way too amazing!!
I'm excited to see the explanation for Nanjo's death in EP3.
Magic standpoint: A witch killed him.
My standpoint on it: A witch killed him, but not with magic.
#Post#: 821--------------------------------------------------
Re: Solving the Mysteries of Rokkenjima! (Your Blue Truths to So
lve the Murders!)
By: Yopee Date: May 18, 2011, 1:53 am
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lol I don't think we will ever get a conclusive explanation for
Nanjo's ep3 ninth twilight. All we know is that neither Jessica
nor Battler nor Eva is the culprit who killed Nanjo.
My only two wild theories is either the trick lies with the
timing of the red like Battler mentioned in the ep4 showdown
with Beato or with the names of the characters. Yoshiya and Sayo
were never mentioned as being dead.
However, let me borrow EVA's red cobweb to crush your
standpoints with certainty:
Absolutely no factors other than humans participate in this game
board!
The one who killed Nanjo was definitely a human!
A weapon was readied, and he was killed with it from point-blank
range in front of him!
Sorry, no room for witches or magic for this one :/
#Post#: 834--------------------------------------------------
Re: Solving the Mysteries of Rokkenjima! (Your Blue Truths to So
lve the Murders!)
By: DetectiveFurudoErika Date: May 20, 2011, 1:19 pm
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Like you said, it could be Yoshiya/Sayo/Yasu, so either one
could have appeared and killed Nanjo, but not with magic. Could
the weapon have been a knife, since the murder weapon appears to
have stabbed him through the head?
#Post#: 838--------------------------------------------------
Re: Solving the Mysteries of Rokkenjima! (Your Blue Truths to So
lve the Murders!)
By: Kirei Ryuusei Date: May 20, 2011, 4:37 pm
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Will said all that? I'm still having problems downloading it so
I'm stuck waiting but I'll do what I can.
As for Nanjo's murder...How can we say that none of the
'murdered' were still alive? It is possible for Nanjo to lie
about who was killed and later, the 'declared dead' came back to
silence him.
#Post#: 839--------------------------------------------------
Re: Solving the Mysteries of Rokkenjima! (Your Blue Truths to So
lve the Murders!)
By: Yopee Date: May 21, 2011, 9:31 pm
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Exactly. That's what Battler thought of and suggested. Behold
Battler's timing of the red solution:
One of those who were first made dead by EVA's proclamation of
the deaths, was able to skillfully play dead earlier and wait
for us to pass by! And while their death still hadn't been
proclaimed with the red, we were made to think that they had
died. Then they killed Doctor Nanjo, and later died for some
reason! Then after that, Eva proclaimed their death in red!!
#Post#: 846--------------------------------------------------
Re: Solving the Mysteries of Rokkenjima! (Your Blue Truths to So
lve the Murders!
By: GoldenSorcererBattler Date: May 23, 2011, 7:30 pm
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EP4
10th Twilight
Battler death:
Earth to Earth
[Color=Blue]The personality know as "Battler" was "killed" in a
sense of the word by Yasu/Shannon/Beatrice[/color]
#Post#: 848--------------------------------------------------
Re: Solving the Mysteries of Rokkenjima! (Your Blue Truths to So
lve the Murders!)
By: Yopee Date: May 23, 2011, 9:47 pm
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[quote author=GoldenSorcererBattler link=topic=123.msg846#msg846
date=1306197014]
EP4
10th Twilight
Battler death:
Earth to Earth
[Color=Blue]The personality know as "Battler" was "killed" in a
sense of the word by Yasu/Shannon/Beatrice[/color]
[/quote]
Wait wait wait Will never said that!
Ep7
Clair: Fourth game, ninth twilight. And none shall be left
alive.
Will: Earth to earth. Illusions to illusions. When fiction is
shut up inside a cat box, it becomes truth.
Clair: Who...am I? (Reference to Beato's heart at end of ep4)
Will: Illusions...to illusions. The promised reaper lowers the
curtains on the tale regardless of the witch's will.
Will doesn't suggest anything about Battler being just a
personality that was cast off hence earth to earth. If Battler
did not own a real, physical body of his own then it would have
been an illusions to illusions.
The illusions to illusions parts are referring to the heart of
Beato and how Beato the witch is believed to be the culprit
because there are no survivors that talk about it, only the
fantastic message bottles written by Beato herself that are left
behind.
End of Ep4 - showdown between Beato and Battler
heart of Beato: Ushiromiya Battler. I will now kill you. And
right now, there is no one other than you on this island. The
only one alive on this island is you. Nothing outside the island
can interfere. You are all alone on this island. And of course,
I am not you. Yet I am here, now, and will kill you.
In other words, Will is saying that something real (not some
fantastic witch) killed Battler (a real human with a body)
despite the person calling herself Beato (Yasu) being dead
already at the end of ep4.
[quote author=GoldenSorcererBattler link=topic=123.msg846#msg846
date=1306197014]
[Color=Blue]The personality know as "Battler" was "killed" in a
sense of the word by Yasu/Shannon/Beatrice[/color]
[/quote]
Wait, are you trying to say Battler is another personality of
Yasu/Shannon/Kanon/Beato/Gaap/Clair? That's pretty messed up but
I'd like to hear your reasoning.
#Post#: 851--------------------------------------------------
Re: Solving the Mysteries of Rokkenjima! (Your Blue Truths to So
lve the Murders!
By: GoldenSorcererBattler Date: May 24, 2011, 12:26 am
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No I'm not saying that Will say that. I was just quoted Will's
earth to earth.
I'll explain[Color=Red] Battler Ushiromiya has a body[/Color].
[Color=Blue]Battler lost all of his memories thanks to Yasu. He
even forgot who he was, so in a way "Battler" was "killed" but
his body is still alive with a new personality[/Color].
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