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#Post#: 1827--------------------------------------------------
Re: Energy Errata
By: Phil Potts Date: November 24, 2021, 3:58 pm
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HTML https://asia.nikkei.com/Opinion/Electric-vehicles-are-not-the-greenhouse-silver-bullet-many-think
#Post#: 1830--------------------------------------------------
Re: Energy Errata
By: Nearings fault Date: November 24, 2021, 7:33 pm
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[quote author=Phil Potts link=topic=49.msg1827#msg1827
date=1637791085]
HTML https://asia.nikkei.com/Opinion/Electric-vehicles-are-not-the-greenhouse-silver-bullet-many-think
[/quote]
That is a quality article that outlines the complexity of the
transition to EVs.
Thank you.
#Post#: 1896--------------------------------------------------
What Happens If Europe Runs Out Of Gas
By: RE Date: November 30, 2021, 5:54 am
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No worries. They can just stop making fertilizer. ::)
HTML https://oilprice.com/Energy/Natural-Gas/What-Happens-If-Europe-Runs-Out-Of-Gas.html
What Happens If Europe Runs Out Of Gas
I'll be a bit surprised if this actually occurs this year. Just
have to wait and see. Imagine though being Locked Down in a
freezing apartment. That would be unpleasant. You would have
ice though.
RE
#Post#: 1897--------------------------------------------------
Re: What Happens If Europe Runs Out Of Gas
By: Nearings fault Date: November 30, 2021, 7:33 am
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[quote author=RE link=topic=49.msg1896#msg1896 date=1638273267]
No worries. They can just stop making fertilizer. ::)
HTML https://oilprice.com/Energy/Natural-Gas/What-Happens-If-Europe-Runs-Out-Of-Gas.html
What Happens If Europe Runs Out Of Gas
I'll be a bit surprised if this actually occurs this year. Just
have to wait and see. Imagine though being Locked Down in a
freezing apartment. That would be unpleasant. You would have
ice though.
RE
[/quote]
Good. The higher the price goes the more long term incentive
there will be to improve the efficiency of their buildings which
is horrible and reduce their dependence on Russia who they say
they object to.
#Post#: 1898--------------------------------------------------
Re: Energy Errata
By: Phil Potts Date: November 30, 2021, 10:21 am
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Most people can get by with much less heating than they normally
use. They will most likely make that choice before having power
off, the high price is a strong incentive.
#Post#: 1899--------------------------------------------------
Re: Energy Errata
By: RE Date: November 30, 2021, 11:29 am
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I definitely agree many people do keep their homes hotter than
necessary. In the Gulag for instance, it was usually around 70F
and very uncomfortable for me. It also dried out my skin and I
was always itchy with dandruff issues. For me, 63F is a good
indoor temperature, although with extra layers on high 50sF is
tolerable.
The problem is with people whose budget is already stretched
thin by rising food prices and who already have the thermostat
set as low as they can stand it. What happens at the end of the
month if they can't pay the gas bill? Also, if gas in storage
truly goes to ZERO, somebody is not gonna get gas somewhere.
Obviously, if/when gas in storage gets low enough, there will be
mandated rationing. Electricity plants running on NG will go to
rolling blackouts. You can go with Zero lights on, but you
can't go with Zero heat very long if it is below freezing
outside.
Again, I'll be a bit surprised if it gets THAT bad this year in
Western Europe anyhow. The next 3 months will see how it plays
out.
RE
#Post#: 1901--------------------------------------------------
Re: What Happens If Europe Runs Out Of Gas
By: Phil Potts Date: November 30, 2021, 4:48 pm
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[quote author=BuddyJ link=topic=49.msg1900#msg1900
date=1638311556]
[quote author=RE link=topic=49.msg1896#msg1896 date=1638273267]
No worries. They can just stop making fertilizer. ::)
HTML https://oilprice.com/Energy/Natural-Gas/What-Happens-If-Europe-Runs-Out-Of-Gas.html
Imagine though being Locked Down in a freezing apartment. That
would be unpleasant. You would have ice though.
RE
[/quote]
Ice is so horrifying easy to make naturally it isn't the point
at all. It is having the power to build and run the machines
that make it, make it so easy and cheap that they will give it
to you for free at McDonalds should you buy something of value,
like a $1.19 soyburger. In the developed world it is taken for
granted, such energy wasting for a mere convenience, an
afterthought, something taken for granted.
Hence the reason why, when it cannot be handed out to anyone who
wants it, found in every corner convenience store to keep a
drink cool, made in our own homes while we aren't even thinking
about it, when such magic is no longer available...well....then
we will all know the world as we know it has collapsed.
BuddyJ doesn't do tinkerbell collapse folks.
[/quote]
Like refusing to recognise cancer until pt is dead. The electric
grid is necessary for the control grid. There needs to be enough
lektrik for people to charge their digital tracking devices, not
just the online library at the agency. Less ice privileged
people means less energy consumed and the longer the control
grid can continue controlling. Living in dystopia, waiting your
turn to be put on ice is collapsed civilization to me.
#Post#: 1902--------------------------------------------------
Re: What Happens If Europe Runs Out Of Gas
By: RE Date: November 30, 2021, 6:03 pm
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[quote author=Phil Potts link=topic=49.msg1901#msg1901
date=1638312516]
Like refusing to recognise cancer until pt is dead. The electric
grid is necessary for the control grid. There needs to be enough
lektrik for people to charge their digital tracking devices, not
just the online library at the agency. Less ice privileged
people means less energy consumed and the longer the control
grid can continue controlling. Living in dystopia, waiting your
turn to be put on ice is collapsed civilization to me.
[/quote]
1/3rd of people currently living on earth have never used the
internet. Varying percentages do not have refrigeration.
HTML https://globaldatalab.org/areadata/fridge/
The percentage of people who once had a fridge but now do not is
unknown. Most homeless people living in tents and refugee camps
don't have one. When the power goes out in your neighborhood,
you can't make ice. If when it comes back on, you can. If you
can afford the electric bill anyhow.
You can't measure collapse by whether you have refrigeration,
any more than you can measure it by whether there is a decent
restaurant within 20 miles of where you live. Only if you can
tally up aggregate numbers can you get some sense of what is
ongoing.
One thing you can say for sure is that if fewer people have
access to affordable energy, they will be increasingly unable to
make ice.
RE
#Post#: 1903--------------------------------------------------
Re: Energy Errata
By: monsta666 Date: November 30, 2021, 7:13 pm
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I don't see energy running out in Europe this year unless
something REALLY dramatic happens. If things get real bad then
the governments will nationalise the industry and energy
rationing will take place to tide things over. However we are
already in December so it is only a few months until we are past
winter and things slowly get better. As for the UK, despite
several gas companies going bust Boris has made it his intention
to allow market forces to prevail i.e. he will not bail out big
corp from this latest crisis. Biggest company to go under here
is Bulb Energy which had 1.7 million customers upon its demise.
However despite the company going bust the customer still
receive gas and are not out of energy.
I expect prices to rise more steeply especially if the companies
can get its way and turn the law so they can increase prices
quicker than current mandates dictate. If that happens energy
poverty will increase dramatically but even if the laws do not
change there will be a substantial increase. I actually had a
call the other day dealing with someone with no energy. It could
be something that happens more regularly going forward. But then
this is capitalism's way of rationing out a resource. Things
have got a ways to go before things get to the point of
blackouts. It will happen but not quite yet.
#Post#: 1904--------------------------------------------------
Re: Energy Errata
By: RE Date: November 30, 2021, 9:19 pm
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It does seem highly unlikely gas would run out so quick, but I
also don't think BoJo can maintain a "market" approach if a
significant number of Brits are priced out of keeping the flat
warm. What is a significant number? 5%? 10%? You can't have
a significant number of people unable to afford heat in a
Western country. That is political suicide.
Pipeline Politics also factor in. How much can you actually get
shipped in from Mother Russia? What alternative suppliers can
you tap into? How fast can it be delivered?
Even if this winter has enough gas, this would be a good time to
start aclimatising to the cold. How long can you sit outside
smoking a cancerette when it is below freezing? How cold can
you keep your flat and stay comfortable?
RE
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