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#Post#: 9981--------------------------------------------------
Grace Period - Oxfordshire CC PCN
DIR By: Grace Period
Date: November 12, 2023, 5:02 pm
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Hi everyone,
I got a council PCN yesterday for overstaying a public 2 hour
free parking bay in which the car was observed from 16:07 to
18:14 (2 hrs 7 mins).
I was under the impression that CEOs had to allow a 10 minute
grace period before issuing a ticket meaning that it would only
be admissible if it were issued after 18:17. Is this the case?
If so can anyone point me in the direction of any relevant laws
I can point to in my appeal?
The CEO also got the colour of the car wrong but I'm assuming
this is not important.
If it helps, I've attached the front and back of the PCN with
identifiable information redacted.
Link to Pepipoo post -
HTML http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=152041
Thanks!
[attachment deleted by admin]
#Post#: 9988--------------------------------------------------
Re: Grace Period - Oxfordshire CC PCN
DIR By: DancingDad
Date: November 12, 2023, 5:27 pm
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There is no need to redact personal information and can be
obstructive to do so as we cannot easily check for things like
CEO photos.
I assume somewhere near here but please locate exactly and link
back
HTML https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.7602026,-1.2673444,3a,90y,254.66h,70.32t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sLQsl1LkOjj75Maa13auoYQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu
Apart from that, I am with you, you seem to have overstayed your
welcome by 7 minutes.
But not by the 10 minutes that they must give before they can
issue a PCN
#Post#: 10000--------------------------------------------------
Re: Grace Period - Oxfordshire CC PCN
DIR By: Grace Period
Date: November 12, 2023, 5:53 pm
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Thanks, exact location is here, just down the road:
HTML https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.7598943,-1.2679656,3a,75y,120.43h,93.58t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sK1lrsXG_L2KK16rE9ejEhQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu
#Post#: 10020--------------------------------------------------
Re: Grace Period - Oxfordshire CC PCN
DIR By: Pastmybest
Date: November 13, 2023, 2:25 am
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The grace period is valid, also the PCN payment periods are from
date of contravention not service this has won on it's own
#Post#: 10027--------------------------------------------------
Re: Grace Period - Oxfordshire CC PCN
DIR By: Grace Period
Date: November 13, 2023, 3:40 am
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Sorry can you explain what you mean by that? The PCN says it's
payable from the date it was served
PCN: OX7259998A
Reg: LT59YSB
For the pictures
#Post#: 10028--------------------------------------------------
Re: Grace Period - Oxfordshire CC PCN
DIR By: DancingDad
Date: November 13, 2023, 4:09 am
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--- Quote from: Pastmybest link ---
>
> The grace period is valid, also the PCN payment periods are
from date of contravention not service this has won on it's own
>
--- End Quote ---
I'm lost on that one as well PmB?
This PCN says starting with date served.
I think it is Oxford bus lane PCNs that get it wrong but haven't
checked?
#Post#: 10032--------------------------------------------------
Re: Grace Period - Oxfordshire CC PCN
DIR By: Pastmybest
Date: November 13, 2023, 4:36 am
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The regs
Particulars to be included in a penalty charge notice given
under regulation 9
2. The information to be included in a penalty charge notice
served under regulation 9 is—
(a)the date on which the notice is served,
(b)the regulatory matters,
(c)the grounds on which the civil enforcement officer issuing
the notice believes that a penalty charge is payable,
(d)that the penalty charge must be paid within the period of 28
days beginning with the date on which the alleged contravention
occurred,
(e)that if the penalty charge is paid no later than the
applicable date, the penalty charge will be reduced by the
amount of any applicable discount, and
(f)that if the penalty charge is not paid within the period of
28 days referred to in sub-paragraph (d), a notice to owner may
be served by the enforcement authority on the owner of the
vehicle.
I cannot remember if it is MrM or CP who have argued this
successfully
This HC case would apply
#Post#: 10033--------------------------------------------------
Re: Grace Period - Oxfordshire CC PCN
DIR By: DancingDad
Date: November 13, 2023, 4:50 am
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Ah.... new fangled regs LOL.
Thanks
There is an older HC case, offhand cannot remember which one
that dealt extensively with the difference between served and
contravention date and why they had to be clear...I think was
under the 1991 regs but reasoning is still valid.
Went along the lines of a CEO could come across a car parked in
contravention at 11.55pm.
Observe for a couple of minutes and decide to issue a PCN.
Which may not have been served until after midnight, giving a
day difference in the statutory time periods
#Post#: 10045--------------------------------------------------
Re: Grace Period - Oxfordshire CC PCN
DIR By: Grace Period
Date: November 13, 2023, 5:47 am
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This is what I plan to say in my challenge to the council. All
good?
The PCN does not comply with The Civil Enforcement of Parking
Contraventions (England) General (Amendment) Regulations 2015
which states that:
“(3) No penalty charge is payable for the contravention where
the vehicle has been left beyond the permitted parking period
for a period not exceeding 10 minutes.”
For the PCN to be permissible, it should not have been issued
before 18:17, i.e. 10 minutes after the 2 hours allotted time
has elapsed.
I also note that the PCN does not comply with The Civil
Enforcement of Road Traffic Contraventions (Approved Devices,
Charging Guidelines and General Provisions) (England)
Regulations 2022 which states that:
Particulars to be included in a penalty charge notice given
under regulation 9
2. The information to be included in a penalty charge notice
served under regulation 9 is—
(a)the date on which the notice is served,
(b)the regulatory matters,
(c)the grounds on which the civil enforcement officer issuing
the notice believes that a penalty charge is payable,
(d)that the penalty charge must be paid within the period of 28
days beginning with the date on which the alleged contravention
occurred,
At no point does the PCN mention that the penalty charge must be
paid within the period of 28 days beginning with the date on
which the alleged contravention occurred, only the date which it
was served, which is not the same.
Here are the links to the relevant legislation:
HTML https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2015/561/regulation/2/made
HTML https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2022/71/schedule/2/made?view=plain
#Post#: 10050--------------------------------------------------
Re: Grace Period - Oxfordshire CC PCN
DIR By: DancingDad
Date: November 13, 2023, 6:18 am
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The 10 minute grace is now to be found in the new fangled regs,
your link is to repealed regs
HTML https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2022/71/regulation/5
Reg 5(2) applies
Imposition of penalty charges for relevant road traffic
contraventions
5.—(1) A penalty charge may be imposed with respect to a vehicle
where that vehicle is involved in a relevant road traffic
contravention which is committed on or after the commencement
date.
(2) But no penalty charge may be imposed under paragraph (1) in
relation to a parking contravention where—
(a)the vehicle is stationary in a designated parking place and
is left beyond the permitted parking period, and
(b)the period for which it is left beyond the permitted parking
period does not exceed 10 minutes.
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