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#Post#: 86241--------------------------------------------------
Lambeth 52M Upper Ground Failing to comply with a prohibition on
certain types of vehicle (motor veh
DIR By: gooly
Date: August 18, 2025, 7:07 pm
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Hi everyone!
Hope you are all keeping well, and as always thank you for
taking the time out of your day to help others with their PCNs.
I've been sent a PCN from Lambeth for passing through a no motor
vehicles sign at Southbank on Upper Ground. For context, this
junction has no motor vehicle signs on two sides! I saw one
side, did a 3 point turn to avoid it and clearly unwittingly
drove through the other. The sign on the right also would have
been in my A-pillar blindspot whilst doing the turn and the one
on the left is remarkably far away from the carraigeway.
I would like to find out if I have any grounds for appeal. I
note that similar to another Lambeth case dealt with by user
Hippocrates on here
(
HTML https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/pcn-52m-eastmearn-road-lambeth-5206/msg62370/#msg62370),<br
/>there is a discrepancy in dates - the notice was issued on
06.08.2025 and states that I have 14 days to pay the discounted
rate, but the online portal says I have until 25.08.2025 to pay
the discounted rate, which is 19 days.
Please find attached a copy of my letter, some screengrabs from
the portal and some GSV screenshots. The exact google maps
location is here:
HTML https://maps.app.goo.gl/Bwrmawh2sBDkGB4h9
Please note that if you move around you will lose the signs as
there is very little data for 2024 and after at this location.
I also note this successful appeal at Tribunal for this location
regarding improper signage, citing no prior warning from sharp
turns
HTML https://londontribunals.org.uk/ords/pwslive/f?p=14952:70::INITIALISE::70:P70_CAS_REFNO,P70_PCN_REFNO,P70_RETURN_PAGE,P70_AST_CODE:1673801,3076567,60,APPEAL&cs=39m0YTCPGBmq8dTz83zMUMXopV1wBPOJjrc2CeV6jLBjyU8NXmwjuct50v5fP16VknjeZt11Md283SIzyuaO2Aw
Thanks in advance for your time.
HTML https://i.ibb.co/Q0R27Bt/Screenshot-2025-08-19-at-01-06-36.png
HTML https://ibb.co/DdyxPXT
HTML https://i.ibb.co/N2SfLNV0/Screenshot-2025-08-19-at-00-59-56.png
HTML https://ibb.co/d4gXQpWN
HTML https://i.ibb.co/XfqdwM4H/Screenshot-2025-08-19-at-01-02-08.png
HTML https://ibb.co/FkFfPCWp
HTML https://i.ibb.co/fzxtpScf/Screenshot-2025-08-19-at-01-01-56.png
HTML https://ibb.co/21kPt6bx
HTML https://i.ibb.co/39027VQv/Screenshot-2025-08-19-at-00-59-31.png
HTML https://ibb.co/LXCm8BHr
HTML https://i.ibb.co/7t4hYnZQ/Screenshot-2025-08-19-at-00-59-39.png
HTML https://ibb.co/Kxwn02fD
#Post#: 86286--------------------------------------------------
Re: Lambeth 52M Upper Ground Failing to comply with a
prohibition on certain types of vehicle (motor veh
DIR By: stamfordman
Date: August 19, 2025, 7:48 am
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Video does show you turning right.
HTML https://i.ibb.co/Cs92ZNXW/501d1bbe-7fee-45ee-ae6e-d574807e6ef6-ezgif-com-video-to-gif-converter.gif
#Post#: 86369--------------------------------------------------
Re: Lambeth 52M Upper Ground Failing to comply with a
prohibition on certain types of vehicle (motor veh
DIR By: fraser.mitchell
Date: August 19, 2025, 2:33 pm
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It's virtually a deliberate trap, isn't it ? The only possible
approach is from under the bridge, and this sign is there:-
HTML https://maps.app.goo.gl/SG3acMnGEHUPeRrm6
Essentially, the only place you can get to is the car park but
this is blocked-off with bollards. So you have to turn right and
go up the ramp to Waterloo Bridge Road: -
HTML https://maps.app.goo.gl/2RNgCPkenTdqayym8
then where you go only God can help you !
So why were you driving along Upper Ground ? Following an
out-of-date satnav maybe ?
#Post#: 86389--------------------------------------------------
Re: Lambeth 52M Upper Ground Failing to comply with a
prohibition on certain types of vehicle (motor veh
DIR By: gooly
Date: August 19, 2025, 3:42 pm
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--- Quote from: Incandescent link ---
>
> It's virtually a deliberate trap, isn't it ? The only possible
approach is from under the bridge, and this sign is there:-
>
HTML https://maps.app.goo.gl/SG3acMnGEHUPeRrm6
> Essentially, the only place you can get to is the car park but
this is blocked-off with bollards. So you have to turn right and
go up the ramp to Waterloo Bridge Road: -
>
HTML https://maps.app.goo.gl/2RNgCPkenTdqayym8
> then where you go only God can help you !
>
> So why were you driving along Upper Ground ? Following an
out-of-date satnav maybe ?
>
--- End Quote ---
I approached from Waterloo Bridge down to Upper Ground to find
parking, as there used to be P&D bays on there. I turned right
onto Upper Ground, drove under the bridge, saw that Upper Ground
eastbound was now blocked off with the no motor vehicles sign.
I then reversed into the National Theatre car park approach to
turn around. The thought did not enter my head that I would have
driven through a one way no motor vehicle sign. I completed the
three point turn, completely missed the signs and drove back the
way I came.
The last time I drove on Upper Ground, it was an unrestricted,
two-way road with a fair few P&D bays. I personally think the
signage is inadequate. The sign showing the road layout under
the bridge doesn't actually show the sign I went through, as it
is in the opposing direction to that sign, so the only way to
catch it is to spot the signs as you are turning right out of
National Theatre.
#Post#: 86390--------------------------------------------------
Re: Lambeth 52M Upper Ground Failing to comply with a
prohibition on certain types of vehicle (motor veh
DIR By: gooly
Date: August 19, 2025, 3:43 pm
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--- Quote from: stamfordman link ---
>
> Video does show you turning right.
>
>
HTML https://i.ibb.co/Cs92ZNXW/501d1bbe-7fee-45ee-ae6e-d574807e6ef6-ezgif-com-video-to-gif-converter.gif
>
--- End Quote ---
Yes absolutely. I suppose I am wondering if there are any
grounds for appeal despite this - either due to poor signage or
procedural improprieties relating to payment dates, as
Hippocrates previously achieved on a Lambeth PCN.
#Post#: 86408--------------------------------------------------
Re: Lambeth 52M Upper Ground Failing to comply with a
prohibition on certain types of vehicle (motor veh
DIR By: fraser.mitchell
Date: August 19, 2025, 6:09 pm
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Well, if you're looking for a 'technical' appeal, hopefully
Hippocrates will soon comment. However the video shows the
contravention is made out, but what a devious trap they have set
up up here, but typical Lambeth
#Post#: 116688--------------------------------------------------
Re: Lambeth 52M Upper Ground Failing to comply with a
prohibition on certain types of vehicle (motor veh
DIR By: gooly
Date: April 22, 2026, 7:18 am
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I had my tribunal yesterday. I attended over video call and
presented my case stating that the signage was inadequate. The
appeal was allowed on this basis. Please find the full summary
below - I hope this is helpful for anyone else who gets caught
out by this restriction.
Introduction
1. This appeal concerns a Penalty Charge Notice issued for
failing to comply with a prohibition on certain types of vehicle
on Upper Ground. The appeal was determined following a personal
hearing on Micorsoft Teams, the Appellant attended.
Appellant’s Case
2. The Appellant submits that the restriction is not adequately
signed. It is said that the junction layout is confusing, that
there was no sufficient warning when turning from the National
Theatre access road, and that the prohibition signs are small,
poorly positioned and easily obscured.
3. The Appellant further relies on an alleged discrepancy
between the discount period stated on the PCN and that shown on
the Authority’s online portal.
Enforcement Authority’s Case
4. The Enforcement Authority relies on CCTV footage and
photographs showing the vehicle passing the no motor vehicles
signs. It relies on the relevant Traffic Management Order (“the
TMO”), which prohibits motor vehicles from proceeding beyond the
junction. Article 8 of the TMO prohibits motor vehicles from
entering or proceeding beyond the restriction.
5. The Enforcement Authority submits that the signage is
compliant with the Traffic Signs Regulations and General
Directions 2016 and is clearly visible.
Findings and Conclusion
6. I am satisfied from the CCTV evidence that the Appellant’s
vehicle passed the prohibition signs. The issue in this case is
whether the restriction was adequately conveyed to a motorist
executing the manoeuvre shown on the evidence.
7. I accept the Appellant’s evidence that, having approached
from the west and encountered the restriction ahead, the driver
turned into the National Theatre access road in order to turn
around and return.
8. The CCTV shows that, upon re-emerging from that access road,
the vehicle immediately re-enters Upper Ground at or very close
to the point of restriction. I am not satisfied that there is
any adequate advance warning to a motorist in that position that
the return route is also subject to a prohibition.
9. While the prohibition signs are present at the restriction
point, signage must be considered in its totality. This includes
whether a motorist is given sufficient opportunity, in advance
of committing to a manoeuvre, to appreciate and comply with the
restriction.
10. I have considered the decisions referred to by the
Appellant. However, each appeal turns on its own facts. My
decision is based on the evidence in this case. In the
particular circumstances of this case, I am not satisfied that a
reasonably diligent motorist, having turned around as described,
would be given adequate notice of the prohibition before
entering it.
11. I have considered the Enforcement Authority’s evidence but
it does not satisfy me that the restriction is sufficiently
clearly signed for this specific manoeuvre.
Decision
12. The appeal is allowed.
#Post#: 116694--------------------------------------------------
Re: Lambeth 52M Upper Ground Failing to comply with a
prohibition on certain types of vehicle (motor veh
DIR By: astralite
Date: April 22, 2026, 8:28 am
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Well done!
#Post#: 116737--------------------------------------------------
Re: Lambeth 52M Upper Ground Failing to comply with a
prohibition on certain types of vehicle (motor veh
DIR By: Hippocrates
Date: April 22, 2026, 2:05 pm
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Case Number please.
#Post#: 116756--------------------------------------------------
Re: Lambeth 52M Upper Ground Failing to comply with a
prohibition on certain types of vehicle (motor veh
DIR By: John U.K.
Date: April 22, 2026, 8:02 pm
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--- Quote from: Hippocrates link ---
>
> Case Number please.
>
--- End Quote ---
That would be 2250600758.
Incidentally, of 20 Lambeth cases on Tuedsday, 13 were allowed
and only 7 refused. I make that a 65% success rate for
appellants!
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