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#Post#: 84326--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN for U-Turn – Hammersmith & Fulham
DIR By: traz
Date: August 5, 2025, 4:25 pm
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Thanks to [member=24]Hippocrates[/member] for sharing the links
— I’ve now read through all three cases and found them really
helpful, though admittedly a bit dense!
In the first case, the claimant tried to argue that the “No
U-turn” sign (diagram 614) didn’t apply because they performed a
3-point turn rather than a classic U-turn. The court ultimately
rejected that argument, ruling that the sign prohibits any kind
of manoeuvre that results in reversing direction, regardless of
how it's done. In my case, however, I turned onto Wandsworth
Bridge Road rather than going back on myself, so it might still
be arguable that what I did wasn’t technically a U-turn in the
prohibited sense.
The second case (with LemonTootski) seems to focus on a
technical defect in the PCN, specifically missing mandatory
information. After checking, it looks like the same error may
apply to my PCN as well, so that might be worth raising.
The third case really struck a chord — it shows how difficult
and drawn-out this whole process can be, even when logic seems
to favour the motorist. It reflects what Hippocrates mentioned
in the other post: that councils bank on most people just giving
up and paying because the time and research involved isn't worth
it. Sadly, that’s probably true.
To be completely honest, this isn’t my area of expertise. My gut
feeling is that Fulham Council will reject any informal or
formal challenge, which means I’ll have to take it to the London
Tribunal if I want to fight it. I’m currently thinking of
appealing on two main grounds:
The PCN is invalid due to missing mandatory information (as seen
in LemonTootski’s case).
It wasn’t a U-turn, since I didn’t turn back in the opposite
direction — I turned onto a different road.
Not sure how strong either point is, so any thoughts or
suggestions would be really appreciated.
Also — if it does end up going to the London Tribunal, I’m
honestly not sure how well I’ll hold up in there. It feels a bit
daunting, especially not being experienced in this kind of
thing.
Thanks again to everyone who contributes — it really helps those
of us trying to make sense of this stuff.
#Post#: 85241--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN for U-Turn – Hammersmith & Fulham
DIR By: traz
Date: August 11, 2025, 5:43 pm
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Would anyone be willing to represent me for this? To be honest,
I don’t think I stand much chance of winning on my own.
#Post#: 85260--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN for U-Turn – Hammersmith & Fulham
DIR By: Hippocrates
Date: August 12, 2025, 2:56 am
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Yes. Have you made formal representations yet?
#Post#: 85444--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN for U-Turn – Hammersmith & Fulham
DIR By: traz
Date: August 12, 2025, 5:48 pm
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No, I haven’t made formal representation yet.
#Post#: 85560--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN for U-Turn – Hammersmith & Fulham
DIR By: traz
Date: August 13, 2025, 12:21 pm
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What should I mention in my representation. As far as I
understand almost anything I say will get rejected and then it
will be off to TEC to fight it out
#Post#: 85564--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN for U-Turn – Hammersmith & Fulham
DIR By: H C Andersen
Date: August 13, 2025, 12:57 pm
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I think we're in danger of going off-piste here.
Both the High Court judgment and the Panel decision quoted in
the reviewed case state clearly that in order for a 'u-turn' to
be performed, whether in 3 goes or one, an essential limb is
that after the manoeuvre 'it travels in the direction from
whence it came'.
In this case the vehicle did not.
So IMO, it's not how a 'u-turn' was achieved, it's whether one
occurred.
IMO, it did not, and neither did the contravention.
#Post#: 85594--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN for U-Turn – Hammersmith & Fulham
DIR By: Hippocrates
Date: August 13, 2025, 3:50 pm
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--- Quote from: traz link ---
>
> What should I mention in my representation. As far as I
understand almost anything I say will get rejected and then it
will be off to TEC to fight it out
>
--- End Quote ---
Tribunal not TEC. I'll do a draft later.
#Post#: 85603--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN for U-Turn – Hammersmith & Fulham
DIR By: fraser.mitchell
Date: August 13, 2025, 4:28 pm
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Basically, yes, they automatically reject all reps because they
know most people then cough up. However you need to put in your
reps the things you want the adjudicator to see which were
rejected by the council.
#Post#: 85614--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN for U-Turn – Hammersmith & Fulham
DIR By: traz
Date: August 13, 2025, 5:32 pm
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should i write up an appeal using the points already mentioned
in this thread
#Post#: 85625--------------------------------------------------
Re: PCN for U-Turn – Hammersmith & Fulham
DIR By: Hippocrates
Date: August 14, 2025, 2:24 am
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Yes please and post up a draft first. Sorry, I am inundated.
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